The Official Dieworkwear Appreciation Thread

[mhip]

Derek crowned “cult men’s wear commentator” by Guy Trebay in the NYT

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Do Dress Sneakers Belong in the Oval Office? (Published 2023)

People felt strongly after spotting the hybrid shoe at a meeting with the president.

www.nytimes.com

Yeah, it's bad...
Forced to choose though, I'd take Hakeem's look over McCarthy's.
He looks like a used car salesman in Lancaster.

 

[LA Guy]

It was semi-entertaining to see the number of staffers and reporters rush to the defense of dress sneakers under the guise of how hard it is to walk around on marble floors as if we hadn’t all been wearing leather soled shoes on those same floors for generations. Honestly the only sole I find pretty much unwearable on them is dainite everything else is fine.

The thing is, there are loads of solutions, some purely utilitarian, some straight up cool.

The obvious solution is orthopedic inserts, which were designed specifically for comfort for long days of standind and walking

Aside (or in addition) to that, you can pick up a pair of Solovair Gibsons, which were the "original" doc martens, and which were originally made as orthopedic shoes: They come in black and every shade of brown you could want: https://us.nps-solovair.com/collections/gibson-shoe
And if you don't want to mess with sizing, just get Redwing Postman's: https://stagprovisions.com/products/postman-no-101-black

I mean, yes, I know more about shoes than that vast majority anyone on the hill, but seriously, if you are going to wear these every weekday, you can be bullocksed to come onto Styleforum for advice and maybe get dragged a bit, if you deserve it. Or just use Google.

 

[sushijerk]

It’s not really about finding a “better” shoe. The dress sneaker has become a piece of uniform accepted as “safe but hip” in the political sphere so nobody wants to take a risk in another direction. It’s just like how every politician wears nondescript, frameless prescription lenses because they are safe and neutral. It’s not because they never googled Jacques Marie mage or any better choice.

 

[JohnMRobie]

It’s not really about finding a “better” shoe. The dress sneaker has become a piece of uniform accepted as “safe but hip” in the political sphere so nobody wants to take a risk in another direction. It’s just like how every politician wears nondescript, frameless prescription lenses because they are safe and neutral. It’s not because they never googled Jacques Marie mage or any better choice.

Nah. It’s not that deep - pure laziness. People make this assumption that politicians are trying to dress to fit in with the electorate or make people comfortable and that might be true when staff put some thought into what their bosses wear on the trail or during shoots. If it’s a decent office or campaign they’ll get an advance package on what to wear for an event (usually when they’re in district.) But the day to day, particularly in DC, is all them wearing whatever they pick. Bad taste and all.

 

[scurvyfreedman]

It's just a progression to more and more gym clothes invading what should be business-dress space. 20 years ago it was Echo that all of the male hill staffers wore - glued plastic/rubber sole, square toe, odd toe stitching. I used to call those sneakers. Now, they actually just wear sneakers.

 

[LA Guy]

It's just a progression to more and more gym clothes invading what should be business-dress space. 20 years ago it was Echo that all of the male hill staffers wore - glued plastic/rubber sole, square toe, odd toe stitching. I used to call those sneakers. Now, they actually just wear sneakers.

The problem with this response is the implicit assumption that things used to be better. There is no compelling reason that there should be a "business-dress space". Business dress is merely a useful convention. It has no ceremonial role, unlike, say, robes, which are still used. In fact, not so long ago, a modern business suit itself would have been considered a huge breach of etiquette and decorum. Norms change. There is nothing inherently problematic about that.

However, there are more thoughtful and less thoughtful approaches. I'd have to rate the dress sneaker to be an terribly thoughtless and lazy. Frankly, it would be more interesting if everyone just went straight athleisure. Or full lumberjack.

 

[scurvyfreedman]

The problem with this response is the implicit assumption that things used to be better. There is no compelling reason that there should be a "business-dress space". Business dress is merely a useful convention. It has no ceremonial role, unlike, say, robes, which are still used. In fact, not so long ago, a modern business suit itself would have been considered a huge breach of etiquette and decorum. Norms change. There is nothing inherently problematic about that.

However, there are more thoughtful and less thoughtful approaches. I'd have to rate the dress sneaker to be an terribly thoughtless and lazy. Frankly, it would be more interesting if everyone just went straight athleisure. Or full lumberjack.

Business dress has changed over time, but it still is based on a lounge suit, particularly in the halls of government (all three federal branches), which I frequent. Yes, it was a frock coat over a century ago, but it hasn't been such for a long, long time. And, before that a cut away coat.

Be that as it may, I never implied better, my attempt was to say disharmonious. A lounge suit goes with leather soled oxford shoes.

 

[LA Guy]

Business dress has changed over time, but it still is based on a lounge suit, particularly in the halls of government (all three federal branches), which I frequent. Yes, it was a frock coat a century ago, but it hasn't been such for a long, long time. And, before that a cut away coat.

Be that as it may, I never implied better, my attempt was to say disharmonious. A lounge suit goes with leather soled oxford shoes.

I understand why these guys don't want to wear leather soles all day. That technology is hundreds of years old, and there are much more comfortable alternatives that can have a significant benefit to your quality of life, both immediate and long term. I think that it's maybe better to think of how one could use those technological improvements in a way that doesn't look so dorky. It's not even as though people have not tried before, with pretty reasonable results. It's more like designers at Cole Haan thought about it, and decided that mulletshoes were a a good idea.

 

[Ambulance Chaser]

As usual, it’s Obama’s fault. Everything went to sartorial hell after he wore that tan suit.

 

[bernoulli]

People wear (atrocious) loafers with suits; what is so different with sneakers? There is nothing wrong, just social norms evolving.

 

[LA Guy]

People wear (atrocious) loafers with suits; what is so different with sneakers? There is nothing wrong, just social norms evolving.

Nothing wrong in any moral sense. Just... there are better choices that acheive the same ends, better.

 

[scurvyfreedman]

I understand why these guys don't want to wear leather soles all day. That technology is hundreds of years old, and there are much more comfortable alternatives that can have a significant benefit to your quality of life, both immediate and long term. I think that it's maybe better to think of how one could use those technological improvements in a way that doesn't look so dorky. It's not even as though people have not tried before, with pretty reasonable results. It's more like designers at Cole Haan thought about it, and decided that mulletshoes were a a good idea.

As an office worker who walks a few blocks and around the office daily, I don't think leather soles (if the shoe actually fits) cause any noticeable discomfort compared to wearing sneakers. I do prefer double leather to leather, though. And, dainite is the worst. Worse than my boots on a mini-lug sole. For boots, crepe is like walking on pillows.

 

[scurvyfreedman]

People wear (atrocious) loafers with suits; what is so different with sneakers? There is nothing wrong, just social norms evolving.

My point is that if you're going to dress down part of they way, dress down the whole way. Or dress up the whole way. Or wear sneakers when commuting and put on shoes in the office. They don't walk that much. And, they don't run at all.

 

[LA Guy]

As an office worker who walks a few blocks and around the office daily, I don't think leather soles (if the shoe actually fits) cause any noticeable discomfort compared to wearing sneakers. I do prefer double leather to leather, though. And, dainite is the worst. Worse than my boots on a mini-lug sole. For boots, crepe is like walking on pillows.

That may be true for you, but other people apparently have other problems, and like you said. crepe is just much more comfortable. That soft, molded soles are more comfortable than leather soles is not really a question. My only point is that there are better solutions, some of which already exist (Solovair derbies, for example.).

 

[bernoulli]

Nothing wrong in any moral sense. Just... there are better choices that acheive the same ends, better.

Of course. I don't think I can wear anything else with suits other than oxfords. But I would rather people wear sneakers than loafers with tailored clothing. Sneakers = comfortable. Oxford = appropriate. Loafers? Trash.

I also don't mean any of this in earnest. It is a bit tongue-in-cheek. But once people were let into restaurants wearing loafers, we knew where that would end up. Next stop: sandals (still better than loafers).