How do you roll? Untangle the Great Buttondown Collar Conspiracy!

[ord65]

I'm now even more certain about 4.

4 is a bell:



Smaller at the top, wider at the bottom - more pleasing to the eye, with a bit more drama and rakishness.

1 is a pear. Visually far less interesting.



I commit the ultimate crime of buying OTR Extra-Slim BB OCBDs (it's the only non-bespoke shirt I buy), and, to make matters worse, I don't button the buttons. I just like them. *gasp*

But, if I had a tailor with a trained hand who could concoct from scratch the perfect roll for my bespoke shirts, I would show him a picture of 4 as the model.

As for Mercer making some sort of flawless perfect true-to-history BD collar, I'd like to see them in the wild. Vox posted his shipment of 83 of them with all manner of bows and thank-you cards attached, but I think we have yet to see one in the wild.

Knowing Vox's propensity to indirectly get involved in SF discussions by posting pics that are pseudo on-point, I expect a Mercer shirt with Cambridge springtime in the background in anywhere from one to three weeks. *waits*

I agree with this, but the reason I voted for 1 over 4 was because I really don't like it when there is a lot of roll - like an "S" shape. I felt 4 was treading the line...
By the way, nice diagrams Foo. Illustrator?

 

[TheFoo]

Photoshop. Lots of layers and circles.

 

[Wallcloud]



Foo, you're insane, and that's what makes this forum cool.

One of the more true things I have seen in a while. :foo:

 

[ord65]

Photoshop. Lots of layers and circles.

Even more impressive.

 

[tdude]

#2 or #4?

 

[TheFoo]



#2 or #4?

Spoiler

[IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/62/Cary_Grant_Notorious.png[/IMG]

I'd say the closest is #1, which was intended to illustrate a flat, wide plateau atop the roll. But I can see how it could also be construed as akin to #2. After the initial roll, the collar does not invert into a strong bell shape. Instead, the points just seem to head straight down.

 

[tdude]



I'd say the closest is #1, which was intended to illustrate a flat, wide plateau atop the roll. But I can see how it could also be construed as akin to #2. After the initial roll, the collar does not invert into a strong bell shape. Instead, the points just seem to head straight down.

Maybe move the buttons up and in slightly and finish out the bottom of the bell. But is there enough tie space?

 

[tdude]

 

[Knowledge is King]

Absent from this discussion (including pics in the original post) is whether or not the collar that gives an ideal roll can also allow the Agnelli unbuttoned points look. Foo, what if you found the ideal roll when the collar points were buttoned, but the collar didn't look right when the points were unbuttoned w/ a tie?

 

[DocHolliday]

I'm more agnostic on this matter than some might expect. I have a variety of vintage BDs, and I enjoy their variations. But they all share a similarity in that they're bell-shaped, rather than "S" shaped. So I guess you'd say I avoid the extremes -- both the cheapie collars that look like points with buttons tacked on and the overly effusive Italian BDs that take something understated and make it conspicuous.

In this discussion, I think it's important not to underestimate the importance of the collar band. Some of my (formerly) deadstock ones have collars that seem much shorter than what you see today, while others seem quite tall. Has a big impact on the overall presentation. (Button placement on the placket too, for that matter.)

 

[CaymanS]

This one (from vox's blog) is quite nice, and basically looks like #4 (*cough* the winner *cough*):

 

[CaymanS]

Actually, the stems make it 5ish.

Bummer.

Close to perfect.

 

[TheFoo]

I think it looks more like #1, with a flatter, broader top.

As for how much of the you can see: keep in mind, the camera is looking up at the subject. So, I wouldn't focus too much on that. The key differentiator of #5 is that the top portion of the roll goes above the collar band. That the tie stems show is incidental.

 

[mack11211]

I voted for 1, but the same collar could move to 4 or 5 in the course of a day's wear. So the range of choices seems artificial and exhausting; just the sort of thing that turns menswear into #menswear and strangles the pleasure of it.

 

[CaymanS]



I voted for 1, but the same collar could move to 4 or 5 in the course of a day's wear. So the range of choices seems artificial and exhausting; just the sort of thing that turns menswear into #menswear and strangles the pleasure of it.

Not sure it strangles the pleasure of it.

Sometimes we like something and don't know why - we just do.

A lot of threads on SF (the good ones at least) attempt to describe what it is that's appealing so that it can be replicated and made a part of your wardrobe, if you so choose.