Cashmere Sweater Hierarchy

[reidd]

This link should work:

About

Shop sunspel.com for the definitive range of luxury British staples for men and women, with exclusive products and free delivery available.

www.sunspel.com

no mention of woollen cloth as far as my quick look could see.

Lots of great info and transparency on there in fact. Would be nice to see that from other brands as well. I have no experience with Sunspel but I'm now tempted to buy something. I have been in need of some new underwear and I'm sure theirs is really nice.

 

[dieworkwear]

This link should work:

About

Shop sunspel.com for the definitive range of luxury British staples for men and women, with exclusive products and free delivery available.

www.sunspel.com

no mention of woollen cloth as far as my quick look could see.

Nearly all high-end knitwear is fully fashioned, so it's made from yarn, not cloth. The only knitted fabric I'm aware of is the stuff you'd use for polos and jerseys.

Sunspel makes their own t-shirts, underwear, vests, and a small line of cut-and-sew womenswear at their Nottingham factory (in England). The knitwear is sourced from a Scottish mill based in Hawick. Given the info available, I believe that mill sources its yarn from Todd & Duncan, also based in Scotland.

Most large brands don't make all of their own items, even if they have their own factory. They have too many SKUs and product lines. So they might make their own shirts and ties, but then get outerwear, trousers, and knitwear from other places (e.g., Drake's).

 

[Knurt]

I can recommend their boxer shorts! Some of the cuts for t-shirts do not fit me so well, but the cotton cloth seems to me to be excellent. Thick and soft and do not change much with washing.

 

[PairOfDerby's]

Sunspel's t-shirts are brilliant. Boxer shorts are also great. I have dozens of both as I live quite close and they have a factory shop. ( and it's in Derbyshire not Nottingham ).
I have one Sunspel cashmere sweater that they told me was Johnsons of Elgin. This was a number of years ago though. The last last time I was in the factory shop, I tried a cotton/cashmere mix sweater on but it said "made in Portugal " so I left it. Almost everything that is not made in Long Eaton (Derbyshire), is made in Portugal and is good quality - although they need to learn how to sow a button on chinos so that they stay on!
I am a huge fan of Sunspel but having said that, I stick to Scottish made cashmere.

 

[Knurt]

I am a huge fan of Sunspel but having said that, I stick to Scottish made cashmere.

Well, well, I think we established that Sunspel cashmere is Scottish made.

 

[PairOfDerby's]

Well, well, I think we established that Sunspel cashmere is Scottish made.

Portugal.

 

[PairOfDerby's]

I'm talking about where the garment is made though. Scottish made yarn does not mean a Scottish made sweater.

 

[PairOfDerby's]

I see the current Sunspel cashmere is made in Scotland looking at their website but if you was to buy last years lines of Sunspel cashmere from another retailer, you might be disappointed to find it was made in Portugal.

 

[JamaisAssez]

@Johnny80 , I returned my JOHNSTONS OF ELGIN 6-ply jumper.

I received it today and, after having tried it on and compared to my BERK 4-ply jumper, decided to return the JOHNSTONS OF ELGIN for three reasons:

I didn't like the color (it is a muted gray color contrary to the photos on their website)
I didn't like the fit (creates a weird pouch on me)
I didn't like the construction after having compared with my BERK. Despite being 6-ply, the JOHNSTONS is considerably lighter in weight than my BERK 4-ply (very chunky). It is less tightly-knitted than the BERK.

That said, if I didn't own any grey sweaters already I'd buy this one. At 40% off it is a great price, and it has lots of attractive detailing (see photos).

The last photo shows you the difference between my BERK (dark gray) and the JOHNSTONS (light gray). I would classify the former as a heavyweight cashmere jumper, while the latter a midweight.

I think this further confirms my suspicion and that of @RJman about BERK being made by WILLIAM LOCKIE.

 

[TheShetlandSweater]

Are there any Lockie cashmere turtleneck retailers in the USA or is this the only place to pick some up: https://teviotdalemills.com/products/william-lockie-oxton-roll-collar-sweater-in-black-cashmere ?

Pretty sure the Armoury's house brand is Lockie. They have cashmere turtlenecks in charcoal and navy. Ordering from the UK is likely cheaper.

 

[dan'l]

Are there any Lockie cashmere turtleneck retailers in the USA or is this the only place to pick some up: https://teviotdalemills.com/products/william-lockie-oxton-roll-collar-sweater-in-black-cashmere ?

other uk options are A Hume and Westaway

Westaway is great. I ordered a cashmere pullover from them and it took a while to arrive due to the holidays, but they are a solid retailer. Unfortunately it was too large, so I had to send it back. Derek has written about Lockie before, but if you touch their stuff, it feels totally different from the cashmere you usually find in dept. stores. I think something about using longer fibers, etc.

Pretty sure the Armoury's house brand is Lockie. They have cashmere turtlenecks in charcoal and navy. Ordering from the UK is likely cheaper.

Lockie makes the stuff for Drakes.

 

[ladislav.jancik]

I think this further confirms my suspicion and that of @RJman about BERK being made by WILLIAM LOCKIE.

I think BERK cashmere sweaters are rebranded and overpriced William Lockie. They look identical to me:

Men’s William Lockie Knitwear | Humes Outfitters

Shop men’s William Lockie knitwear at Humes Outfitters. Jumpers, cardigans, and more from this country wear brand. Buy now with free UK delivery over £99.

www.ahume.co.uk

vs

Cashmeres for Men

Berk cashmere has a firm peachy feel yet it is a fraction of the weight of wool. These timeless men's classics are knitted in the finest strands of sumptuous cashmere. In return for our investment of time and care in the knitting and finishing process you get a touch and feel unlike any other...

berkcashmere.co.uk

I am pretty sure Lockie is doing some stuff for The Armoury, Drake's and Bryceland's as well, possibly with some variations in the fit / design.

 

[aristoi bcn]

I took some pictures of my green and brown shaded made in Scotland cashmere knits. I really love this stuff and I’m always in the hunt of new shades, particularly rollnecks. There is Lockie, Laing and S&C among other less known brands/makers. I think I will contact Lockie to see if it’s possible to order a shade card and have made one single piece to the desired design.

 

[dan'l]

I took some pictures of my green and brown shaded made in Scotland cashmere knits. I really love this stuff and I’m always in the hunt of new shades, particularly rollnecks. There is Lockie, Laing and S&C among other less known brands/makers. I think I will contact Lockie to see if it’s possible to order a shade card and have made one single piece to the desired design.

View attachment 1737275 View attachment 1737276 View attachment 1737277 View attachment 1737278

Let us know how it turns out. I contacted Lockie before about making some small changes to their knits (i.e. sleeve length) and they told me they don‘t do that. With that said, I know some retailers will help you order their knitwear in custom colors, so maybe getting an existing design in a different color is doable.

 

[RJman]

@Johnny80 , I returned my JOHNSTONS OF ELGIN 6-ply jumper.

I received it today and, after having tried it on and compared to my BERK 4-ply jumper, decided to return the JOHNSTONS OF ELGIN for three reasons:

I didn't like the color (it is a muted gray color contrary to the photos on their website)
I didn't like the fit (creates a weird pouch on me)
I didn't like the construction after having compared with my BERK. Despite being 6-ply, the JOHNSTONS is considerably lighter in weight than my BERK 4-ply (very chunky). It is less tightly-knitted than the BERK.

That said, if I didn't own any grey sweaters already I'd buy this one. At 40% off it is a great price, and it has lots of attractive detailing (see photos).

The last photo shows you the difference between my BERK (dark gray) and the JOHNSTONS (light gray). I would classify the former as a heavyweight cashmere jumper, while the latter a midweight.

I think this further confirms my suspicion and that of @RJman about BERK being made by WILLIAM LOCKIE.

View attachment 1736566 View attachment 1736567 View attachment 1736568
View attachment 1736569

Thanks for that write up. It’s a minefield trying to compare brands and makers because no one metric prevails. Made in Scotland can be mediocre or excellent. Someone can say they’re using 6-ply yarn when they’re referring to the finer yarn quality 2/28 instead of the old one of 1/14 so someone’s six ply is another one’s three ply. And regardless of ply a garment can be knitted with high tension or low tension, meaning it can be more or less densely knit; the former taking more time, requiring more yarn, and feeling initially harder to the touch, but being what the best of the old knitters did. My understanding from press over the years is most of the remaining manufacturers are moving to high speed machines that are easier to use and knit less densely so staff don’t have to have the same skill, more pieces can be produced in the same amount of time, using less yarn. We lose out. And I’m sure someone who actually knows the trade will tell me there’s other factors I left out and that I got some of the details wrong. All I mean to say is things are never directly comparable. And even my favorite knitters sometimes cheaped out on certain models. Oh well.