Steed vs Anderson & Sheppard

[loarbmhs]

Whoops, you're right. Two years.

Is the twice a year thing new? As of last year, I only received notice of their usual winter visit.

Yes, they just started it. Twice-yearly visits to Los Angeles—they were in LA in February and will return again and (I believe) twice to San Francisco as well.

Whoops, you're right. Two years.

Is the twice a year thing new? As of last year, I only received notice of their usual winter visit.

Yes, it’s very new. Twice-yearly visits, to both San Francisco and Los Angeles, in February and June. Great news for men on the West Coast!

 

[loarbmhs]

Whoops, you're right. Two years.

Is the twice a year thing new? As of last year, I only received notice of their usual winter visit.

 

[bdavro23]

I don’t know if it’s acceptable, but it’s not uncommon to see issues with bespoke clothes. Some things that I think can help, if you're looking for a good custom tailoring firm:

1. Ask if your cutter will be at your fittings. It’s not uncommon nowadays, even with big firms, to only have a salesperson at your fitting. This isn’t disqualifying, but it raises your chances of getting something good if the actual technical person behind the garment can see what’s going on.

2. Think of things more in terms of cutters than firms. I think online, we talk about things like “this is an A&S garment” or “this is a Rubinacci garment.” But the main person behind these garments is the cutter, and people can change in and out of jobs. Two cutters at a firm may have different skill sets or interpret a house style differently. I’ve long admired Bruce Boyer’s A&S garments, but his pattern was drafted and cut in the 1970s by Colin Harvey, who has long passed away. Similarly, if you’re at a John Lobb trunk show, you may admire the sample shoes, but the people who made those things are long gone. If you know who will be your last maker or cutter, try to track down examples of that person’s work.

3. Try to track down people who have used that lastmker or cutter, or at least firm. For whatever reason, bespoke customers are happy to post online when they want to crow, but they’re more likely to handle things privately when things go wrong. Many RTW customers, perhaps because they’re dealing with a more faceless entity, are fine with posting about problems online. But the horror stories I hear about bespoke tailoring and shoemaking often come through DMs and emails — people are reluctant to post about their bad experiences online. So if you’re thinking about using a company, try to track down people who have used that company recently and ask them if they can candidly share their experience.

4. I also recommend not getting caught up in thinking of things in terms of categories. Sometimes guys think that bespoke is automatically better than RTW, or some big famous firm is obviously good. In my experience, there are good and bad examples of RTW, MTM, and bespoke. And there’s little correlation between a firm’s prestige and the quality of their work. It’s hard to make broad sweeping generations nowadays. I imagine it used to be that a Savile Row firm was definitely better than some no-name firm, and definitely better than ready-to-wear (in the early stages of factory-made RTW). I don’t think that’s the case anymore.

On the upside, when things go right, there’s really nothing like bespoke, IMO. But you also have to be willing to pay a lot of money, not just for the garments, but for the process of finding the right tailor for you. Sometimes you may also find that you choose the wrong fabric or detail, which is no fault of the tailor. Bespoke comes with some trial and error.

I also agree with Patrick though your clothes don’t have to look perfect for you to look good. Sometimes being too neurotic about this stuff makes you look worse, even if you have pitch-perfect tailoring.

These are all good points, but I would add one: Talk to the maker about your expectations and give them the opportunity to help shape those expectations. Often times people go into a commission thinking the result will be X, and are very upset when it isnt delivered. It might even be a perfectly fitting garment, but its still a disappointment.

Obviously the maker should be proactive in setting expectations, but the customer should actively participate to help shape the end product. It also might give the maker the opportunity to say, "You know, thats not something that we do here." Or at least explain why its not a great idea.

All of this is the long way of saying that communication is very important...

 

[bdavro23]

Another random thought no one asked me my opinion about: I cant imagine waiting 2-3 years for a garment. I understand it can be part of the process, but its just not for me.

Edit* I would wait that long for a Chris Despos garment, but probably no one else.

 

[dieworkwear]

Another random thought no one asked me my opinion about: I cant imagine waiting 2-3 years for a garment. I understand it can be part of the process, but its just not for me.

Edit* I would wait that long for a Chris Despos garment, but probably no one else.

At the rate they raise prices, I sell my deposits like stock futures.

 

[bry2000]

If you are seeing a tailor during his traveling tour, I would not expect much from “interviewing” the tailor.

These guys have appointments booked back to back. Most customers are there to get measured, have a fitting, select cloth, etc and then get out quickly. So sticking to a schedule, which A&S does a good job of, is important. That leaves little time for a tailor to pitch his services to you or for you engage in a protracted discussion of house styles, etc.

If you see a tailor in his shop, there may be more time to engage in a discussion to the extent the tailor has patience. Most of the best known tailors have experience with window shoppers, bloggers, etc. so they often have a sense who is serious about placing an order and who is a hobbyist.

 

[nmprisons]

Edit* I would wait that long for a Chris Despos garment, but probably no one else.

Ha! I send him a polite DM every year or so. Still happily waiting.

 

[nmprisons]

If you are seeing a tailor during his traveling tour, I would not expect much from “interviewing” the tailor.

These guys have appointments booked back to back. Most customers are there to get measured, have a fitting, select cloth, etc and then get out quickly. So sticking to a schedule, which A&S does a good job of, is important. That leaves little time for a tailor to pitch his services to you or for you engage in a protracted discussion of house styles, etc.

If you see a tailor in his shop, there may be more time to engage in a discussion to the extent the tailor has patience. Most of the best known tailors have experience with window shoppers, bloggers, etc. so they often have a sense who is serious about placing an order and who is a hobbyist.

That wasn't my experience with my first Steed appointment. They were happy to sit and chat for as long as I wanted and didn't pressure me at all to commission a piece (although I did). Probably makes sense to make your intentions known while scheduling, though.

 

[bdavro23]

If you are seeing a tailor during his traveling tour, I would not expect much from “interviewing” the tailor.

These guys have appointments booked back to back. Most customers are there to get measured, have a fitting, select cloth, etc and then get out quickly. So sticking to a schedule, which A&S does a good job of, is important. That leaves little time for a tailor to pitch his services to you or for you engage in a protracted discussion of house styles, etc.

If you see a tailor in his shop, there may be more time to engage in a discussion to the extent the tailor has patience. Most of the best known tailors have experience with window shoppers, bloggers, etc. so they often have a sense who is serious about placing an order and who is a hobbyist.

This is not an apples to apples comparison, but I go through something like this with my little MTM business. If someone is interested in making something with me, I will meet with them, talk about styles, what I can and cant do, fabrics, etc. Sometimes they order, sometimes they dont. Everyone is a tire kicker until they pay...

A&S have a body of work that gives people an idea of what they're getting, but I would still expect (hope) that people would send an email, call ahead, write a letter to discuss a potential commission. I dont think thats an appropriate conversation necessarily to have during an appointment with a travelling tailor, but certainly before you book. If you dont due that little bit of diligence, how do you expect a great outcome?

 

[bry2000]

My comments were particularly geared towards tailors on their traveling tours. You have to keep in mind the business models and the expenses associated with traveling and shipping stuff back and forth. They need to maximize the value of each appointment and they can do that with taking orders, doing fittings, etc.

I am sure they are willing to meet potential customers and have a preliminary discussion before an order is placed, especially if you have already reserved time on their schedule. But for most tailors, the model is getting customers in and out. That is what most customers want also since most are there to place orders or have fittings and are not there for the comraderie or to talk shop. Last thing a tailor wants is to have customers waiting way past their scheduled time.

In any event, all the tailor is likely to do is show you an example of their work and explain the number of fittings and that they will get it right or fix it. You either take the leap and place the order or you don’t. I am not sure what other discussion will help you decide. Discussion hand stitching? Armscye? Who cuts the button holes?

 

[Texasmade]

I've used 2 tailors with one being through their trunkshow only. I usually email them with specific questions and do quite a bit of research before hand on house style to see if I would like the style. I'm not going to set an appointment just to chat with the tailor during a trunk show. Going to a trunkshow also takes time out of my day and I prefer to just get in and out to get on with the rest of my day. Only 1 appointment took more than 30 minutes which was when I had to select fabric and get measured. Everything else was 30 minutes or less.

 

[dieworkwear]

I think a bit of initial chit chat is nice. Maybe start with something like "so what do you do for work?"

 

[Texasmade]

Of course I do the hello, hi, how are you, and generally friendly but I don't engage in their life story, plans for vacations, etc. If they have questions about where to eat or drink in Houston I'll answer. I know they have other customers to see and want to get on with their day which I respect.

 

[smittycl]

I had a great chat with Steed at my first appointment. Nice guys with good senses of humor. We talked current events, a little politics, things to do in DC, etc. They took a look at the fabric I brought, did the measuring, discussed options, then I commissioned an MTM suit. A great experience.

Suit arrived and needed a few tweaks so I caught them on their next visit. They mailed it back a little while later.

I started the process late so my winter suit in Fox Bros. flannel will have to wait until late Fall I think.

 

[bry2000]

Everyone is nice to @smittycl . No surprise.