The Hong Kong BaoTou Tailors and Fabric Shops for CMT Thread

[shirtingfantasy]

I may sound snobbish, but Loro Piana products below Wish series and Zegna products below Trofeo are just honestly unusable. Many people who buy Tropical (still HKD 700/m?) for the namesake of Zegna, which is a total waste of the very limited money they spent.

Loro Piana and Zegna have their strength in very high super wool and cashmere. If you have tried Zegna 13milmil/ 14milmil or Loro Piana Cashmere Cloud, you probably won’t say they are easily replaceable even with products from the best British merchants.

 

[Memo]

On Hung Sifu, I had some experience during my trip to HK last month. I rang him prior to a visit for a quote for a 2 piece CMT and he told me that it costs around mid-$3k but if I want top notch workmanship I am looking at “around $4k-ish” depending on the fabric.

I went to his shop, asked him again about the cost and he said he needs to see the fabric first because he charges differently depending on the fabric. I showed him the fabric - he asked for the brand label - so I asked why does it matter. He laughingly insisted to see the label because he said it’s highly relevant to his assessment. I showed him the Scabal tag (it’s normal stuff) then he said it would be $4.2k for a normal CMT or “roughly” $5.8k for the better CMT. I was at a loss as to why his pricing fluctuates so much so I left, and before I left he told me that he’s happy to do $3.8k for the normal CMT if I am keen, an instant $400 discount. This doesn’t seem to be a honest shop, I am afraid.

 

[dennistsang]

On Hung Sifu, I had some experience during my trip to HK last month. I rang him prior to a visit for a quote for a 2 piece CMT and he told me that it costs around mid-$3k but if I want top notch workmanship I am looking at “around $4k-ish” depending on the fabric.

I went to his shop, asked him again about the cost and he said he needs to see the fabric first because he charges differently depending on the fabric. I showed him the fabric - he asked for the brand label - so I asked why does it matter. He laughingly insisted to see the label because he said it’s highly relevant to his assessment. I showed him the Scabal tag (it’s normal stuff) then he said it would be $4.2k for a normal CMT or “roughly” $5.8k for the better CMT. I was at a loss as to why his pricing fluctuates so much so I left, and before I left he told me that he’s happy to do $3.8k for the normal CMT if I am keen, an instant $400 discount. This doesn’t seem to be a honest shop, I am afraid.

I strongly suggest not to go CMT if you are not a regular tourist to Hong Kong because you don't have time to come back and do a fitting/ modification with Sifu (If they are willing to).
BTW, where did you go after visiting Hung Sifu?

 

[shirtingfantasy]

On Hung Sifu, I had some experience during my trip to HK last month. I rang him prior to a visit for a quote for a 2 piece CMT and he told me that it costs around mid-$3k but if I want top notch workmanship I am looking at “around $4k-ish” depending on the fabric.

I went to his shop, asked him again about the cost and he said he needs to see the fabric first because he charges differently depending on the fabric. I showed him the fabric - he asked for the brand label - so I asked why does it matter. He laughingly insisted to see the label because he said it’s highly relevant to his assessment. I showed him the Scabal tag (it’s normal stuff) then he said it would be $4.2k for a normal CMT or “roughly” $5.8k for the better CMT. I was at a loss as to why his pricing fluctuates so much so I left, and before I left he told me that he’s happy to do $3.8k for the normal CMT if I am keen, an instant $400 discount. This doesn’t seem to be a honest shop, I am afraid.

Perhaps it shows that this so-called sifu cannot judge fabric quality without looking at the label himself, even if he wanted to charge more for luxury fabric?

One of the so-called advantages of CMT is that the customer on a limited budget can skip the necessary fabric mark up by the shop or the tailor. If this advantage vanishes, the average customer has little incentive to go CMT (very few people have the knowledge to source exclusive or vintage fabric without being ripped off).

 

[patliean1]

then he said it would be $4.2k for a normal CMT or “roughly” $5.8k for the better CMT.

I’m assuming these prices are in HKD not USD correct? Silly question I know...

 

[thesupremegrape]

Is there any general consensus on who is the best sifu for a full-canvass CMT right now?

 

[PekingRoadHK]

Is there any general consensus on who is the best sifu for a full-canvass CMT right now?

There are over 100 sifu in Mirador Mansion. No one can try all BaoTou to make the ranking. Everyone has different taste and needs, thus, there is no guarantee which one best for everyone.

I talk to many BaoTou, some come from best well known bespokes in HK. Most of them are young enough to work on the suit on the cutting and fitting parts. Sifu above 80 years old, they do cutting and fitting good, I look at their end products, I can see they are still good. Don't expect 80 years old sifu that have all the energy to work on everything, let the Shenzhen labour to work on the suits.

I’m assuming these prices are in HKD not USD correct? Silly question I know...

HK$

 

[PekingRoadHK]

Perhaps it shows that this so-called sifu cannot judge fabric quality without looking at the label himself, even if he wanted to charge more for luxury fabric?

One of the so-called advantages of CMT is that the customer on a limited budget can skip the necessary fabric mark up by the shop or the tailor. If this advantage vanishes, the average customer has little incentive to go CMT (very few people have the knowledge to source exclusive or vintage fabric without being ripped off).

It's easy to compare with the average market price. When we see something extra expensive comparing to similar things, it tells us to walk away.

Average market price for full canvas CMT (HK sifu cutting and fitting in HK, made in China) = HK$2.xk.
When we see HK$3.2k / HK$3.3k , that's expensive, but still acceptable. Above HK$3.5k, I suggest consumers to walk away.

Average market price for full canvas CMT (HK sifu cutting and fitting in HK, made in HK) = HK$3.xk. This price should include high grade canvas.
When we see above HK$4k, we go to someplace else. No doubt about it.

With this average price suggestion and comparison, and as I have suggested how to pick the right BaoTou, how bad can it be?

From what I see, BaoTou can't mark up too much, they don't offer fabric, they charge workmanship only. When we see a BaoTou offering fabric, it's a tailor shop. That's a good place to look at many fabrics and compare fabrics in one place, and they might mark up on workmanship or fabrics or both, this is an extra service.

I don't see a point for any consumer to make an order when a Mirador Baotou offers any price above HK$4k CMT full canvas. We walk away, this is consumer decision.

In most case, I don't accept offers above HK$3k CMT full canvas, I don't care it's made in HK or China. This is my acceptable price.

 

[PekingRoadHK]

For ordinary consumers like me, I don't consider any fabric for over HK$1k per yard. Therefore, Zegna is out budget. I say above $800 per yard is already super expensive. Between $400 and $800 per yard, this price range is good enough for quality fabrics (British brands and Italian brands).

Tailor shops and BaoTou do have the same situation, they have higher risk handling fabrics that cost over $1k/yard, they usually charge more on workmanship. They have to look at the expensive fabrics before they can offer a price for the workmanship. Because they make a cutting mistake, they have to pay for it. For ordinary consumers like me, I don't see a point for any fabric for over HK$1k per yard.

from my strategy, how wrong can it be on pricing when we make CMT order?

 

[thesupremegrape]

Anyone know how to get good fabrics for cheap e.g. ebay?

 

[PekingRoadHK]

I may sound snobbish, but Loro Piana products below Wish series and Zegna products below Trofeo are just honestly unusable. Many people who buy Tropical (still HKD 700/m?) for the namesake of Zegna, which is a total waste of the very limited money they spent.

Loro Piana and Zegna have their strength in very high super wool and cashmere. If you have tried Zegna 13milmil/ 14milmil or Loro Piana Cashmere Cloud, you probably won’t say they are easily replaceable even with products from the best British merchants.

low price Zegna and Loro Piana = wasting time!

Good quality Zegna fabrics cost over $2k/$3k per yard, there are extra workmanship charge for expensive fabrics, that's why total price of over $11k/$14k is expected. Retailers charge over $60k for it.

 

[PekingRoadHK]

Anyone know how to get good fabrics for cheap e.g. ebay?

my suggestion:
1) https://www.harrisonsburley.net/ , they offer brand name fabrics for low price.

2) check brand name shops, they have good discount sometime.
over 50% off is possible on famous British brands.

 

[thesupremegrape]

my suggestion:
1) https://www.harrisonsburley.net/ , they offer brand name fabrics for low price.

2) check brand name shops, they have good discount sometime.
50% off is possible on famous British brands.

Thank you!

 

[Memo]

I strongly suggest not to go CMT if you are not a regular tourist to Hong Kong because you don't have time to come back and do a fitting/ modification with Sifu (If they are willing to).
BTW, where did you go after visiting Hung Sifu?

Fair enough. I went to another Sifu and unfortunately, he’s too busy to have the garment ready for first fitting within a week. Having had some so-so experience with Lok Sifu (don’t get me wrong - nothing disastrous, I just thought his cut is not my cup of tea) a couple of years ago, I have decided to not make a suit with any sifu during this trip. I did, however, commission 12 shirts from three different sifu - they are all excellent for my needs.

 

[dukenukem4ever]

Have an old, second-hand Hickey Freeman Super 170s suit bought off eBay. Honestly when comparing the value and price (well I got it second hand so can't complain too much but at regular retail Hickey Freeman is around 1700 - 2000 USD for a suit) points to a CMT suit using "luxury" brand supers, with my preferred Mirador Baotou, my opinion is that LP at such high super numbers just really isn't worth it to me, personally again I state personally. I don't own any Zegna fabric suits so can't compare.