French Tailoring Thread (e.g. Camps de Luca, Cifonelli, Smalto and etc.)

[lasbar]



I would not say that Di Fiore is not one of the big boys. Almost the same generation as Marc de Luca, same history, same village in Italy that everyone is from -- the families are basically neighbors & know eachother a generation back. Marc de Luca has only ever had good things to say about Di Fiore (he nevers badmouths other tailors, contrary to others.) Di Fiore is up there, he's just off the radar, known only to connaisseurs because he never grew his business and works essentially on his own.

I meant known by guys like me..

 

[Romain]

Dirnelli, how would you compare di Fiore to Suzuki, or to the other tailors you've met?

 

[SeamasterLux]

Dirnelli, how would you compare di Fiore to Suzuki, or to the other tailors you've met?

The question is not addressed to me but I'd definitely say that Di Fiore has a more classic cut compared to the others that are more contemporary. The others are also more technically skilled in terms of movement freedom optimization (if that means anything).

 

[Romain]

Thanks for your answer! I see what you mean.

 

[dirnelli]

I disagree with SeamasterLux: I'm not sure that, in terms of freedom of movement, Di Fiore has anything less compared to other currently hyped italian tailors, From speaking to di Fiore, I find that both he and Camps de Luca have a soft tailoring (italian) approach to movement (think Claude Francois dancing in his CdL suit, arms flailing).

Let's not confuse soft tailoring and soft shoulders. The French tailors do structured roped shoulders, but the best ones like CdL, Cifo and Di Fiore (all italian) interpret the roped shoulder within a very fluid jacket, which is what's so amazing -- the combination of structured look and light tailoring. Lesser French tailors have a structured look, but also a rigid feel. However, the top tailors combine the best of both worlds: the chiselled look of Savile Row with the ease of movement of the Italians. That's the French touch, described by Marc de Luca in my video interview at the start of this thread.

Having not met Suzuki yet (I examined a customer's jacket, amazing, but never met its maker), I will not comment too much. My sense is that he is a pure product of the Camps, Smalto, Gonzales & Di Fiore tradition.

 

[Fuuma]



The market is not really satured in Japan.

It's funny because I talked last month with the CEO of LV Japan.
And he told me that with the opening of the new LV shop at Shinjuku - Tokyo (biggest train station in the world).
They have pretty amazing results on a two floors building. 

Japanese customers are very loyal to their favorite brands and you have a lot of others new customers from Asia.


I'm very interested about the strategy of Loro Piana with Antoine Arnault at his head. 
They're re-structuring everything in Paris. Wait and see ...

But trust me LVMH brands are all doing well ! 

LV and Hermès were pretty much the only brands doing well in JP during the height of the recession, anyone that sees saturation just does not understand the Japanese mindset when it comes to clothing. Lots of them will just purchase a few pricey items, wear them to the ground, then start again with new, in fashion, garments.

 

[add911_11]



LV and Hermès were pretty much the only brands doing well in JP during the height of the recession, anyone that sees saturation just does not understand the Japanese mindset when it comes to clothing. Lots of them will just purchase a few pricey items, wear them to the ground, then start again with new, in fashion, garments.

Actually thats how my ethos. It is such a waste if your suits and shoes are only in the waldrobe without being worn probably.

Wear it like you dont care.

 

[poorsod]



I disagree with SeamasterLux: I'm not sure that, in terms of freedom of movement, Di Fiore has anything less compared to other currently hyped italian tailors, From speaking to di Fiore, I find that both he and Camps de Luca have a soft tailoring (italian) approach to movement (think Claude Francois dancing in his CdL suit, arms flailing).

Let's not confuse soft tailoring and soft shoulders. The French tailors do structured roped shoulders, but the best ones like CdL, Cifo and Di Fiore (all italian) interpret the roped shoulder within a very fluid jacket, which is what's so amazing -- the combination of structured look and light tailoring. Lesser French tailors have a structured look, but also a rigid feel. However, the top tailors combine the best of both worlds: the chiselled look of Savile Row with the ease of movement of the Italians. That's the French touch, described by Marc de Luca in my video interview at the start of this thread.

Having not met Suzuki yet (I examined a customer's jacket, amazing, but never met its maker), I will not comment too much. My sense is that he is a pure product of the Camps, Smalto, Gonzales & Di Fiore tradition.

I've tried on a vintage Smalto, made for someone else, and it felt like armor - very stiff and sculpted shoulders. Quite the opposite to what I have from NSM. Was the Smalto I tried atypical?

 

[dirnelli]

Vintage Cifo, vintage Rousseau can also feel stiff by today's standards.
Djay feels stiff. Evzeline looks stiff. Guilson feels stiff. Diagne is super soft. Smalto falls probably in the middle today.
Basically, tailoring has evolved, a Cifo from 1981 ( I just sold three of mine) feels nothing like a Cifo today. CdL however was already known for ease of movement in the 60's.

 

[Kuro]

^what about Charvet (in terms of stiffness)?

 

[89826]

Suggestions for finding a new La Forestiere jacket before it is too late? Other than ebay. Perhaps it already is too late.

 

[unbelragazzo]



Vintage Cifo, vintage Rousseau can also feel stiff by today's standards.
Djay feels stiff. Evzeline looks stiff. Guilson feels stiff. Diagne is super soft. Smalto falls probably in the middle today.
Basically, tailoring has evolved, a Cifo from 1981 ( I just sold three of mine) feels nothing like a Cifo today. CdL however was already known for ease of movement in the 60's.

Do you know what the stiffness comes from? Is it the kind of canvas used? The way the padding is done? The cut? The amount of stuff in the shoulder?

 

[SeamasterLux]

^what about Charvet (in terms of stiffness)?

Good question. You'd have to ask RJMan about that.

I would expect that it's not as Camps and Cifo.

On the contrary of what Dirnelli said, I actually tried on a Di Fiore sportcoat (slightly too large for me though) and I didn't feel like it gave me the same sense of freedom of movement. Anyway, I don't really care since I won't give any of my business to Mr. Di Fiore

I'm more wondering about Suzuki or Cifo for a next order. Not the same price though but both are interesting.

 

[lasbar]

We need him back.

 

[dirnelli]

+1 on RJ returning to SF.

FWIW, I just wrote this post comparing NSM/Ripense and Cifo/CdL:

http://dirnelli.tumblr.com/post/75278481283/nsm-ripense-vs-cifonelli-camps-de-luca