Cigarettes

Discussion in 'Social Life, Food & Drink, Travel' started by RamNYC, Jul 10, 2005.

  1. Ludeykrus

    Ludeykrus Senior member

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    well the only problem i have with smoking is that is personal habit that affects the people in ths surrounding area in a negative way possibly affecting the health of people that do not smoke,

    I think that people have exploited this fact to undermine a person's property rights.

    Someone privately owns a piece of property or business. They wish to smoke in it, and allow others to do so. The government, fueled by self-righteous arrogant pricks, feels they have authority to tell someone what they can do with their own property, and over such a mundane act as smoking. Don't want to be exposed to smoke? Don't choose to patronize establishments that permit smoking.

    It's that simple.
     


  2. scarphe

    scarphe Senior member

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    I think that people have exploited this fact to undermine a person's property rights. Someone privately owns a piece of property or business. They wish to smoke in it, and allow others to do so. The government, fueled by self-righteous arrogant pricks, feels they have authority to tell someone what they can do with their own property, and over such a mundane act as smoking. Don't want to be exposed to smoke? Don't choose to patronize establishments that permit smoking. It's that simple.
    true, i did not say anything about private poperty adn the rights around it frankly i alway stay in non smoking area of bars and restaruants and if they do n have that area i leave. if someone wants to be around smokers or wish to smoek on private property ok. but why should a person be able to smoke on public property when it may have afect on other people, and everyone has the right to occupy the space? but to call smoking mundane is an understatement.
     


  3. Biscotti

    Biscotti Senior member

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    I think that people have exploited this fact to undermine a person's property rights.

    Someone privately owns a piece of property or business. They wish to smoke in it, and allow others to do so. The government, fueled by self-righteous arrogant pricks, feels they have authority to tell someone what they can do with their own property, and over such a mundane act as smoking. Don't want to be exposed to smoke? Don't choose to patronize establishments that permit smoking.

    It's that simple.


    I agree if you do not want to be in a business that allows smoking, go elsewhere. All it would do is hurt the business.
     


  4. Ludeykrus

    Ludeykrus Senior member

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    but why should a person be able to smoke on public property when it may have afect on other people, and everyone has the right to occupy the space?
    Just to clarify, I wasn't really referring to you. But debate is debate! Define public property. Courthouse? DMV? Library? Sure, I don't mind a ban on smoking in these buildings. A 'public' business that is privately owned and operated? Definitely have a problem with that. At a public park? Whoever argues that is an idiot; open-air smoking is harmless to others.
    I agree if you do not want to be in a business that allows smoking, go elsewhere. All it would do is hurt the business.
    Agreed. In fact, smoking makes some places. Who finds it right to not be able to light up in a tobacco shop? And how can you call a bar a 'bar' if it's not smoky and full of drunks? In fact, my friends make me smoke at my weekly poker night since it's just not a game without it. Then again, these are the same fags that make me bake bread for them......
     


  5. Biscotti

    Biscotti Senior member

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    I enjoy the odd cigarette and hookah; in my opinion they are great social activities. Yes I think it would be wonderful to be able to enjoy a cigarette indoors, it is nicer that way.
     


  6. theber

    theber Member

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    but I take it for granted that you´re considerate enough to not pollute my lungs and nice clothing when you decide to smoke.

    Loving the international debate going here. I always ask if people mind if I light up when I'm not around smokers, and if they have an issue I don't. I don't even mind being made to go outside for a smoke now because I fully understand that people who don't smoke don't want to sit in a cloud of it. What I don't like is that it is perfectly acceptable to actively discriminate against smokers. And all the sanctimonious preaching from everyone is beginning to wear a little thin now.

    BTW, can any self-described addiction ever be considered "classy"? Much as I enjoyed Trainspotting, I don´t find anything elegant in being a heroin addict. But I´m sure there are some who think the paraphernalia are really "cool".

    Can you in all seriousness compare heroin addiction to smoking.
     


  7. gnatty8

    gnatty8 Senior member

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    Loving the international debate going here. I always ask if people mind if I light up when I'm not around smokers, and if they have an issue I don't. I don't even mind being made to go outside for a smoke now because I fully understand that people who don't smoke don't want to sit in a cloud of it. What I don't like is that it is perfectly acceptable to actively discriminate against smokers. And all the sanctimonious preaching from everyone is beginning to wear a little thin now.


    +1

    I am a cigar smoker, but only in the privacy of my own back deck.. That said, I don't bitch and moan and preach if someone lights up around me, I just excuse myself and wander somewhere else.. That's what people tend to forget, you can walk away if you don't like it..
     


  8. Our_Benefactors

    Our_Benefactors Well-Known Member

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    +1That's what people tend to forget, you can walk away if you don't like it..

    True, but many people (myself included) don't particularly like being essentially forced to do so.
     


  9. ginlimetonic

    ginlimetonic Senior member

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    I'm surprised to see so many anti-smoking advocates here; as if there weren't enough anti-smoking literature and propaganda already available in the media circuits.

    The fact of the matter is that smoking delivers undeniable benefits to its users. As a drug, it provides a potent buzz comparable to few others. In social gatherings, smoking can act as a link between strangers, and the mere act itself can bring people together. If done correctly, smoking projects a positive, classic image - that of an individual indulging in a relaxing activity bereft from stress or worries. Obviously, smoking is a high-risk activity. Nobody here is denying the possibility that there are negative outcomes that may possibly result from smoking. In excess, and over the long course of time, smoking has the capability to cause a multitude of health problems and diseases. We're all adults here, though, and there is no doubt about the destructive capability of cigarette smoking - I don't see why there is a need to lecture everyone about it.

    There are risks associated with almost every enjoyable activity. There are low-risks, such as enjoying one cigarette in the evening, enjoying a steak dinner, or drinking a glass of wine. There are also high-risks, such as smoking over a dozen cigarettes per day, eating red meat every day, or continuously drinking alcohol all week. But for god's sake, demonizing cigarette smoking as the only harmful thing in the world seems so naive and short-sighted.


    Are you part of Marketing team in Phillip Morris or other large tobacco company?
     


  10. nootje

    nootje Senior member

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    I guess it was only a matter of time before this thread would derail because of anti smoking comments..
     


  11. gnatty8

    gnatty8 Senior member

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    True, but many people (myself included) don't particularly like being essentially forced to do so.

    I don't like being forced standing next to someone with body odor on the MARTA either, so I move. I don't like when older women walk into meeting rooms reeking of perfume either, so I usually find a way to remove myself from the situation. I don't like people who leave their cats roam free so that they can come and piss in my landscaping either, but I tolerate it. Note that in none of these situations do I piss and moan to the offending party, I simply do the gracious thing and either tolerate the behavior or minimize the impact of the behavior on myself..
     


  12. scarphe

    scarphe Senior member

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    I don't like being forced standing next to someone with body odor on the MARTA either, so I move. I don't like when older women walk into meeting rooms reeking of perfume either, so I usually find a way to remove myself from the situation. I don't like people who leave their cats roam free so that they can come and piss in my landscaping either, but I tolerate it. Note that in none of these situations do I piss and moan to the offending party, I simply do the gracious thing and either tolerate the behavior or minimize the impact of the behavior on myself..
    but the body odor will not negativey affect your health, it only make you uncomfortable. that is major difference. yes in priavte property one can do what oen wants as long the owner permits but on pulic property smoking should eb forbidden.
     


  13. StopPolloition

    StopPolloition Senior member

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    pulic property smoking should eb forbidden.

    [​IMG]
     


  14. gnatty8

    gnatty8 Senior member

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    but the body odor will not negativey affect your health, it only make you uncomfortable. that is major difference.
    yes in priavte property one can do what oen wants as long the owner permits but on pulic property smoking should eb forbidden.


    How do you know? I may have severe allergies, asthma, or emphysema that may make it difficult for me to breathe in the presence of strong odors.. There are a number of other examples.. Do you drive a car? If so, why are you polluting my air with carbon monoxide and fine particulates?
     


  15. scarphe

    scarphe Senior member

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    How do you know? I may have severe allergies, asthma, or emphysema that may make it difficult for me to breathe in the presence of strong odors.. There are a number of other examples.. Do you drive a car? If so, why are you polluting my air with carbon monoxide and fine particulates?

    . well if you as strong odor as health risk to the general public you can support baning that as well, but in end of the day you are tlaking about a small percentage f the pop, compared to the percantage that is affected by secaond hand smoke... 100%
     


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