The Styleforum x Archibald Hand-Welted Dress Shoes GMTO

[flx]

Should be fixed

should be fixed! Changing colours should be faster now but keep me updated if there any other issues

Yes it's working now ?

 

[ArchibaldRoh]

So Orlando just happened to come across this link by someone called shoegazing...

I have a bit of a bone to pick with this guy because he has gone and commented on a product that he has never seen, felt or has any clue about all based on the back of the price we are selling it at.
I know brands are meant to stay quiet (but we are fairly outspoken as a company) but I kind of want him to challenge us and do a proper review with an item in-hand rather than chatting nonsense from afar..

https://shoegazing.com/2020/04/17/buying-tip-hand-welted-shoes-below-e300/

Does anyone know if he is on SF? And if so, the username?

 

[EgoCamisas]

So Orlando just happened to come across this link by someone called shoegazing...

I have a bit of a bone to pick with this guy because he has gone and commented on a product that he has never seen, felt or has any clue about all based on the back of the price we are selling it at.
I know brands are meant to stay quiet (but we are fairly outspoken as a company) but I kind of want him to challenge us and do a proper review with an item in-hand rather than chatting nonsense from afar..

https://shoegazing.com/2020/04/17/buying-tip-hand-welted-shoes-below-e300/

Does anyone know if he is on SF? And if so, the username?

I might be wrong, but isn't that the blog associated to Skolyx.se? Didn't Emil write himself? Again, I might be wrong but, in that case, Skolyx is very much in SF, yes.

Cheers

 

[mhip]

So Orlando just happened to come across this link by someone called shoegazing...

I have a bit of a bone to pick with this guy because he has gone and commented on a product that he has never seen, felt or has any clue about all based on the back of the price we are selling it at.
I know brands are meant to stay quiet (but we are fairly outspoken as a company) but I kind of want him to challenge us and do a proper review with an item in-hand rather than chatting nonsense from afar..

https://shoegazing.com/2020/04/17/buying-tip-hand-welted-shoes-below-e300/

Does anyone know if he is on SF? And if so, the username?

It didn't read as a hatchet job to me.
In fact, if I had read that story cold, my next move would have been most likely to go to your site...

 

[beargonefishing]

So Orlando just happened to come across this link by someone called shoegazing...

I have a bit of a bone to pick with this guy because he has gone and commented on a product that he has never seen, felt or has any clue about all based on the back of the price we are selling it at.
I know brands are meant to stay quiet (but we are fairly outspoken as a company) but I kind of want him to challenge us and do a proper review with an item in-hand rather than chatting nonsense from afar..

https://shoegazing.com/2020/04/17/buying-tip-hand-welted-shoes-below-e300/

Does anyone know if he is on SF? And if so, the username?

He is on here and active, especially in the TBL Mallorca thread. I didn't think the article was unfair or bad, at all.

 

[dhoff10]

He is on here and active, especially in the TBL Mallorca thread. I didn't think the article was unfair or bad, at all.

Perhaps this is what bugged Rohan
"and the leather might not be the best there is. But with the RRP of €450 for an Italian-made hand welted shoe, you can’t expect too much."

 

[ArchibaldRoh]

Perhaps this is what bugged Rohan
"and the leather might not be the best there is. But with the RRP of €450 for an Italian-made hand welted shoe, you can’t expect too much."

Yes it was. Well i guess what bugged me is someone is writing about something they have never seen nor gotten close to. At least perhaps talk to someone that owns them etc? The issue with Archibald is that the price (normal or naked) always betrays us because people use it to formulate the story that this is just another millenial direct to consumer brand selling cheap product for cheaper. We have had advicr multiple times to increase the prices by a significant factor to solve the issue caused by price but if we cave and do that then we are betraying the big idea of the world's ultimate value proposition.

I guess there are few people playing on this model of direct-to-consumer high luxury but with an actual product that matches up... I know when we started we were the first and only. I also understand how so many times the precedent has been set by general direct-to-consumer players who put more into advertising than product but it is really sad to see someone who seems to be pretty well respected go ahead and review a brand without even seeing and feeling the product.

The leather we use is exceptional, so much so that it is reserved for custom or special grade shoes by brands like JL, EG and GG. It is unusually soft and durable at the same time and really takes the shape of the foot so when the foot is in the shoe, the shoe always looks great. Downside, with wear and not treated well (i abuse mine) it does require a little care to look great without the foot inside. It will however last the length of the 12 re-soles handwelted shoes can undergo.

Now that is my heavily biased observation as someone who stands to gain from all of this. I am always ready for criticism and an honest review as it means that we can improve, become better and achieve our end game faster.
.

 

[boot_owl]

Yes it was. Well i guess what bugged me is someone is writing about something they have never seen nor gotten close to. At least perhaps talk to someone that owns them etc? The issue with Archibald is that the price (normal or naked) always betrays us because people use it to formulate the story that this is just another millenial direct to consumer brand selling cheap product for cheaper. We have had advicr multiple times to increase the prices by a significant factor to solve the issue caused by price but if we cave and do that then we are betraying the big idea of the world's ultimate value proposition.

I guess there are few people playing on this model of direct-to-consumer high luxury but with an actual product that matches up... I know when we started we were the first and only. I also understand how so many times the precedent has been set by general direct-to-consumer players who put more into advertising than product but it is really sad to see someone who seems to be pretty well respected go ahead and review a brand without even seeing and feeling the product.

The leather we use is exceptional, so much so that it is reserved for custom or special grade shoes by brands like JL, EG and GG. It is unusually soft and durable at the same time and really takes the shape of the foot so when the foot is in the shoe, the shoe always looks great. Downside, with wear and not treated well (i abuse mine) it does require a little care to look great without the foot inside. It will however last the length of the 12 re-soles handwelted shoes can undergo.

Now that is my heavily biased observation as someone who stands to gain from all of this. I am always ready for criticism and an honest review as it means that we can improve, become better and achieve our end game faster.
.

Now that's interesting. What tannery is your leather from?

Leather quality is such a nebulous thing, admittedly there isn't much copy about your leather so there's no reason to assume it's a standout from any competitors

 

[OrlandoMo]

Now that's interesting. What tannery is your leather from?

Leather quality is such a nebulous thing, admittedly there isn't much copy about your leather so there's no reason to assume it's a standout from any competitors

Our calfskin comes from Valdarno Tannery in Ponte a Egola (FI), Italy. Our Shell Cordovan comes from Horween

 

[stephenaf2003]

Our calfskin comes from Valdarno Tannery in Ponte a Egola (FI), Italy. Our Shell Cordovan comes from Horween

This.

Hopefully, this, is why you all will ultimately succeed. Always telling the truth. Of course, your success is not guaranteed, luxury product purchasers love to be taken advantage of, indeed it seems to be a badge of honor for many of them.

For me, as long as you remain transparent, I can’t say I’ll purchase every product you offer, but I will contribute and you’ll get a sizable chunk of my discretionary income going forward.

 

[j ingevaldsson]

So Orlando just happened to come across this link by someone called shoegazing...

I have a bit of a bone to pick with this guy because he has gone and commented on a product that he has never seen, felt or has any clue about all based on the back of the price we are selling it at.
I know brands are meant to stay quiet (but we are fairly outspoken as a company) but I kind of want him to challenge us and do a proper review with an item in-hand rather than chatting nonsense from afar..

https://shoegazing.com/2020/04/17/buying-tip-hand-welted-shoes-below-e300/

Does anyone know if he is on SF? And if so, the username?

Since we are all about openness here, I paste my reply to the email I got from Orlando:

“Are you serious? Do you call that a review? It’s an article about your campaign (a type of article that I often get contacted by brands and thanked for when writing). And when I write 95% positive things in an article about your brand, you come back and are annoyed with one sentence where I say “the leather quality might not be the best there is”? After I’ve been fully disclosing that I haven’t seen or handled your shoes in person, I just give an opinion of what I can see from the pictures, but that’s also all it should be seen as. I’m not saying it’s bad leather, if anything I’m saying that it seem to be the leather you can expect for what you offer.

You are more than welcome take your time and read the reviews I have on the blog, I always state how much I have worn the shoes before they are being reviewed. I’m, like you, are very open.

Review Archives - Shoegazing.com

shoegazing.com

I certainly haven’t been more interested in reviewing your shoes after this reaction.”

 

[ArchibaldRoh]

Since we are all about openness here, I paste my reply to the email I got from Orlando:

“Are you serious? Do you call that a review? It’s an article about your campaign (a type of article that I often get contacted by brands and thanked for when writing). And when I write 95% positive things in an article about your brand, you come back and are annoyed with one sentence where I say “the leather quality might not be the best there is”? After I’ve been fully disclosing that I haven’t seen or handled your shoes in person, I just give an opinion of what I can see from the pictures, but that’s also all it should be seen as. I’m not saying it’s bad leather, if anything I’m saying that it seem to be the leather you can expect for what you offer.

You are more than welcome take your time and read the reviews I have on the blog, I always state how much I have worn the shoes before they are being reviewed. I’m, like you, are very open.

Review Archives - Shoegazing.com

shoegazing.com

I certainly haven’t been more interested in reviewing your shoes after this reaction.”

Thanks, I was just about to do the same.

I don't review shoes for a living, but not sure anyone can ascertain or judge leather from a series of pictures. Also that one sentence completely disregards the entire point of our product. We would not be pairing hand-welted Italian craftsmanship of this sort with anything but the finest leathers...it wouldn't make sense with the labour costs of producing the shoes. We don't sell shoes that SHOULD be sold $479, we sell shoes that SHOULD be sold for much higher (a significant multiple higher)... no brand in the world engages with a price to cost ratio that we do, so the statement you made is effectively nonsensical and shows a lack of research into the actual proposition.

It's like reviewing pasta from a picture, I can't do it. But obviously you have some sort of sixth sense of these things...

Of course you won't be reviewing the shoes now, because it would mark just how wrong what you wrote is.

Again, I am biased and yes a typical brand would keep their mouth shut and be gracious that you chose to cover them. I'd much prefer to read something informative, detailed and with real journalistic integrity (good or bad) than a bunch of musings from 30,000 ft away...

 

[j ingevaldsson]

Thanks, I was just about to do the same.

I don't review shoes for a living, but not sure anyone can ascertain or judge leather from a series of pictures. Also that one sentence completely disregards the entire point of our product. We would not be pairing hand-welted Italian craftsmanship of this sort with anything but the finest leathers...it wouldn't make sense with the labour costs of producing the shoes. We don't sell shoes that SHOULD be sold $479, we sell shoes that SHOULD be sold for much higher (a significant multiple higher)... no brand in the world engages with a price to cost ratio that we do, so the statement you made is effectively nonsensical and shows a lack of research into the actual proposition.

It's like reviewing pasta from a picture, I can't do it. But obviously you have some sort of sixth sense of these things...

Of course you won't be reviewing the shoes now, because it would mark just how wrong what you wrote is.

Again, I am biased and yes a typical brand would keep their mouth shut and be gracious that you chose to cover them. I'd much prefer to read something informative, detailed and with real journalistic integrity (good or bad) than a bunch of musings from 30,000 ft away...

First of all, yes, you can say quite a lot about leather from looking at pictures. Especially when there’s many pictures of many shoes from many angles, as in this case. Certainly not all, but quite a lot. Go talk to any shoemaker (it’s quite evident that you aren’t shoemakers yourself) and they will confirm.

And the fact that you, as a lot of other brands offering shoes in the lower price segments, state that you use “nothing but the finest leathers” certainly shows that you are more about marketing than anything else (it’s really interesting that the premium brands and best bespoke makers don’t state they use the best leather, it’s only brands like yours, wonder why that is..?). The fact that you drop a tannery name above and think that that would prove anything towards any direction at all, shows this as well. Two brands can buy from the exact same tannery and get the exact same quality of hides (from the three grades that you always receive in one batch), yet one brand can put out shoes with amazingly fine leathers and the other with much, much less good quality leathers, it’s all down to how you use the hides, which hides for what, which parts for what, how much for final product, and so on and so on.
Maybe you really believe that you are using “finest leathers”, that doesn’t mean it’s true.

In the same way, looking at picture of your shoes and from the manufacturing, you are obviously taking many shortcuts and making things much more simpler than one would do if one were trying to, actually, for real, make the finest shoes there is. In the same way, you are likely to do the same way with the leathers.

And note, I’m NOT saying this is wrong, you’re shoes can still be of great quality price/ratio, but you can’t offer hand welted shoes at the price you do and think that they would be rivalling “the best shoes in the world”, since it’s simply not possible.

And no, I’m not declining doing a review since “it would mark just how wrong what you wrote is”, even if you would make tremendous shoes, I rather write about brands who are run by people that are not responding and talking to others in the rude manner you are. And as a note, I have written things about other brands that are much more unfavourable to them than the small sentence this discussion is about, where their representatives have been fully fine with it and fully understanding it, since they have a realistic view of what they are doing, and know that I know and have a realistic view of what they are doing.

 

[Devis4u]

First of all, yes, you can say quite a lot about leather from looking at pictures. Especially when there’s many pictures of many shoes from many angles, as in this case. Certainly not all, but quite a lot. Go talk to any shoemaker (it’s quite evident that you aren’t shoemakers yourself) and they will confirm.

And the fact that you, as a lot of other brands offering shoes in the lower price segments, state that you use “nothing but the finest leathers” certainly shows that you are more about marketing than anything else (it’s really interesting that the premium brands and best bespoke makers don’t state they use the best leather, it’s only brands like yours, wonder why that is..?). The fact that you drop a tannery name above and think that that would prove anything towards any direction at all, shows this as well. Two brands can buy from the exact same tannery and get the exact same quality of hides (from the three grades that you always receive in one batch), yet one brand can put out shoes with amazingly fine leathers and the other with much, much less good quality leathers, it’s all down to how you use the hides, which hides for what, which parts for what, how much for final product, and so on and so on.
Maybe you really believe that you are using “finest leathers”, that doesn’t mean it’s true.

In the same way, looking at picture of your shoes and from the manufacturing, you are obviously taking many shortcuts and making things much more simpler than one would do if one were trying to, actually, for real, make the finest shoes there is. In the same way, you are likely to do the same way with the leathers.

And note, I’m NOT saying this is wrong, you’re shoes can still be of great quality price/ratio, but you can’t offer hand welted shoes at the price you do and think that they would be rivalling “the best shoes in the world”, since it’s simply not possible.

And no, I’m not declining doing a review since “it would mark just how wrong what you wrote is”, even if you would make tremendous shoes, I rather write about brands who are run by people that are not responding and talking to others in the rude manner you are. And as a note, I have written things about other brands that are much more unfavourable to them than the small sentence this discussion is about, where their representatives have been fully fine with it and fully understanding it, since they have a realistic view of what they are doing, and know that I know and have a realistic view of what they are doing.

To that end, what short cuts would you consider to have identified? I ask out of curiosity

 

[Cheshire symposium]

First of all, yes, you can say quite a lot about leather from looking at pictures. Especially when there’s many pictures of many shoes from many angles, as in this case. Certainly not all, but quite a lot. Go talk to any shoemaker (it’s quite evident that you aren’t shoemakers yourself) and they will confirm.

And the fact that you, as a lot of other brands offering shoes in the lower price segments, state that you use “nothing but the finest leathers” certainly shows that you are more about marketing than anything else (it’s really interesting that the premium brands and best bespoke makers don’t state they use the best leather, it’s only brands like yours, wonder why that is..?). The fact that you drop a tannery name above and think that that would prove anything towards any direction at all, shows this as well. Two brands can buy from the exact same tannery and get the exact same quality of hides (from the three grades that you always receive in one batch), yet one brand can put out shoes with amazingly fine leathers and the other with much, much less good quality leathers, it’s all down to how you use the hides, which hides for what, which parts for what, how much for final product, and so on and so on.
Maybe you really believe that you are using “finest leathers”, that doesn’t mean it’s true.

In the same way, looking at picture of your shoes and from the manufacturing, you are obviously taking many shortcuts and making things much more simpler than one would do if one were trying to, actually, for real, make the finest shoes there is. In the same way, you are likely to do the same way with the leathers.

And note, I’m NOT saying this is wrong, you’re shoes can still be of great quality price/ratio, but you can’t offer hand welted shoes at the price you do and think that they would be rivalling “the best shoes in the world”, since it’s simply not possible.

And no, I’m not declining doing a review since “it would mark just how wrong what you wrote is”, even if you would make tremendous shoes, I rather write about brands who are run by people that are not responding and talking to others in the rude manner you are. And as a note, I have written things about other brands that are much more unfavourable to them than the small sentence this discussion is about, where their representatives have been fully fine with it and fully understanding it, since they have a realistic view of what they are doing, and know that I know and have a realistic view of what they are doing.

When you're in a hole, stop digging.