The State of Black Tie: Your Observations

[Faux Brummell]

Not everybody is going to love every option but a white waistcoat has always been a classic choice. Here’s Peter Marshall of the Black Tie Guide.

 

[Nick Charles]

View attachment 1895181

Interesting. Thanks!

 

[JohnMRobie]

X-post from the cloth thread.

Has anyone had anything made up in the dupioni in the Black Tie book from H&S who can share feedback on how it tailored/wears? I’m contemplating a DB shawl. Something ivory and slubby and slightly more casual for summer events.

LP has a silk that’s a bit heavier but a bit less interesting and not slubby in the Mare bunch. And Caccioppoli has an ivory WSL they released in this season’s Suits bunch but the dupioni is the leader in the clubhouse so far.

 

[Cidermonk]

I am interested in Le Noeud Papillon bow ties based on the fantastic recommendations in this thread. Would it be inappropriate to choose their most popular bow tie and cummerbund set in silk if my tuxedo has grosgrain facings? (https://www.lenoeudpapillon.com/products/the-majestic-black-set-1)

 

[ericgereghty]

I am interested in Le Noeud Papillon bow ties based on the fantastic recommendations in this thread. Would it be inappropriate to choose their most popular bow tie and cummerbund set in silk if my tuxedo has grosgrain facings? (https://www.lenoeudpapillon.com/products/the-majestic-black-set-1)

Couldn't say definitively, but, given that it's a custom order, I'd imagine Nicholas would be more than happy to make up a set in grosgrain.

 

[Faux Brummell]

I am interested in Le Noeud Papillon bow ties based on the fantastic recommendations in this thread. Would it be inappropriate to choose their most popular bow tie and cummerbund set in silk if my tuxedo has grosgrain facings? (https://www.lenoeudpapillon.com/products/the-majestic-black-set-1)

Technically yes. But since Manton has been mentioned a few times in this thread recently, here are his views:

Strictly speaking, yes. But no one will notice. I have many times worn a grosgrain bow with satin lapels, and no one cares.

 

[ericgereghty]

Technically yes. But since Manton has been mentioned a few times in this thread recently, here are his views:

Strictly speaking, yes. But no one will notice. I have many times worn a grosgrain bow with satin lapels, and no one cares.

Though he's absolutely correct, it is rather surprising for one so aggressively rigid about so many minute details that nobody would notice to be so meh about the discordance.

 

[sftiger]

I am interested in Le Noeud Papillon bow ties based on the fantastic recommendations in this thread. Would it be inappropriate to choose their most popular bow tie and cummerbund set in silk if my tuxedo has grosgrain facings? (https://www.lenoeudpapillon.com/products/the-majestic-black-set-1)

I had fitted bow ties made for my groomsmen from Sam Hober. Looks like they do cummerbunds as well. If it matters to you, I bet theirs would be half the price of LNP's. Although I do own bow ties from both LNP and SH and they're both great.

 

[Faux Brummell]

Though he's absolutely correct, it is rather surprising for one so aggressively rigid about so many minute details that nobody would notice to be so meh about the discordance.

He alluded to that in his full post. (I believe “Will” is Will Boehlke.)

“Strictly speaking, yes. But no one will notice. I have many times worn a grosgrain bow with satin lapels, and no one cares. More to the point, it doesn't bother me. And the only person more anal about these things than me is Will. (It probably bothers him.)”

 

[Cause Moe]

My philosophy is this: I consider the Tuxedo jacket and trousers (and optional waistcoat) to be a suit, and I like the same fabrics to be used for the body of all three plus the button coverings, and a different fabric (e.g. grosgrain) to be used for both the trouser stripes and lapel facings. I think of the cummerbund and tie as accessories, so I don't try to match them exactly. My guiding principle is that the outfit be comfortable, well coordinated, and look good. When I see a black satin tie with faille facings, it typically looks just fine.

Black tie is a uniform, and it's nice for men in black tie to look pretty much the same from a distance. The details, especially accessories, can be more individual with absolutely no problem. To paraphrase Duke, if it looks good, it is good. And to enjoy wearing it, it has to look good to me, as well as being comfortable.

Prescriptivist guides and strict rules can be very useful for someone putting together a black tie rig with little experience. But sweating the fine details isn't necessary if it looks good, and looking good is far more important than strict adherence to "rules." For instance, if your butt looks better with double vents than with none, and double vents are more comfortable to you, there is no reason not to wear double vents. Nobody's eyes have ever been damaged by the sight of my non-patent shoes or my double vents. If the wales of your grosgrain tie are a different width than those on your grosgrain cummerbund there is really no problem.

 

[Andy57]

He alluded to that in his full post. (I believe “Will” is Will Boehlke.)

“Strictly speaking, yes. But no one will notice. I have many times worn a grosgrain bow with satin lapels, and no one cares. More to the point, it doesn't bother me. And the only person more anal about these things than me is Will. (It probably bothers him.)”

No, it bothers me too. 😑

 

[Andy57]

I am interested in Le Noeud Papillon bow ties based on the fantastic recommendations in this thread. Would it be inappropriate to choose their most popular bow tie and cummerbund set in silk if my tuxedo has grosgrain facings? (https://www.lenoeudpapillon.com/products/the-majestic-black-set-1)

Nicholas has black grosgrain ties in his inventory. It's trivial to match your tie fabric to your lapel facings. I don't know if he has a grosgrain cummerbund, but Budd certainly does.

 

[Andy57]

More red accessories for Valentine's Day.

And, as an aside, my tie is by Le Noeud Papillon but is not grosgrain nor satin. Instead it's a sort of jacquard pattern, tone on tone, that I like and which would, presumably, go with most any kind of lapel facing (or none at all, as here).

 

[DavidJordan]

What is this forum's perspective on an off-white pocket square paired with a black dinner suit (with a pure white shirt)?

I received the below off-white pocket square yesterday. I ordered a pure white pocket square because I think the pure white would (1) coordinate better with the pure white shirt; and (2) contrast better against the black dinner suit and bow tie.

 

[JohnMRobie]

Where is mafoofan when you need someone to defend an off white square?