The lines between Business Dress - Business Casual - Casual

[JayJay]

Originally Posted by letmebefell

Try these guidelines:

Business - Business Suit and Tie.
Business Casual - at a minimum, pants with a crease, pressed shirt, leather shoes, sportscoat and tie optional.
Casual - including at least one element less formal than business casual (jeans, chinos without a crease, non-leather shoes)

A man in a suit with no tie is a man who has not finished dressing.
A good guide.

 

[mensimageconsultant]

Originally Posted by ProfessorShak

I'm not sure the cotton would make a difference. Here is another example: on memorial day, went to a big BBQ in khaki linen pants and a light weight white button down w/ sleeves rolled up but tucked in and burgundy drivng mocs sockless, and I was either asked why I was dressed up or if I was hot in my clothes. It was 78 degrees sunny and was very cool. So ???

Good question about cotton. If it were wrinkle-free, then perhaps the distinction is purely cultural.

Now a white dress shirt is one of the most formal shirts encountered by most people. It's also impractical for a BBQ. It was probably that that did the most damage, unless the other items were obviously high-end. A polo shirt likely would have worked much better.

How to dress appropriately? Unless you fundamentally are quite different and proud of it, dress in items that are not too different from what others are wearing. For informal situations, don't rely on the non-standard opinions of the people who are drawn to this and similar forums. They hardly care if your friends and loved ones disapprove, while you obviously do. Fit advice given online tends to be good, though.

 

[yachtie]

Originally Posted by letmebefell

Try these guidelines: Business - Business Suit and Tie. Business Casual - at a minimum, pants with a crease, pressed shirt, leather shoes, sportscoat and tie optional. Casual - including at least one element less formal than business casual (jeans, chinos without a crease, non-leather shoes) A man in a suit with no tie is a man who has not finished dressing.

Originally Posted by JayJay

A good guide.
+1. That about sums it up. There's some variation in Business and Business Casual depending on cloth , but that's pretty much it. I wear suedes for casual but that's not definitive.

 

[TheDroog]

Originally Posted by ProfessorShak

I'm not sure the cotton would make a difference. Here is another example: on memorial day, went to a big BBQ in khaki linen pants and a light weight white button down w/ sleeves rolled up but tucked in and burgundy drivng mocs sockless, and I was either asked why I was dressed up or if I was hot in my clothes. It was 78 degrees sunny and was very cool. So ???

Hmm, it sounds like you're overdressing. Context is everything. If it's 78 degrees and you're at a BBQ, what's wrong with shorts and a shirt? (You could do seersucker shorts and a polo to prep it up if you're so inclined). As it is, I suspect you're the only one dressed like a peacock and people are calling you out on it.

 

[Fuuma]

Originally Posted by letmebefell

Try these guidelines:

Business - Business Suit and Tie.
Business Casual - at a minimum, pants with a crease, pressed shirt, leather shoes, sportscoat and tie optional.
Casual - including at least one element less formal than business casual (jeans, chinos without a crease, non-leather shoes)

A man in a suit with no tie is a man who has not finished dressing.

Suit+shirt+shoes+tie = appropriate
Suit+shirt+shoes = luxe

 

[LexSenthur]

Just start singing "When You Got It, Flaunt It" until they stop asking. They'll get used to you dressing nice after a while.

 

[SkinnyGoomba]

Originally Posted by mensimageconsultant

Good question about cotton. If it were wrinkle-free, then perhaps the distinction is purely cultural.

Now a white dress shirt is one of the most formal shirts encountered by most people. It's also impractical for a BBQ. It was probably that that did the most damage, unless the other items were obviously high-end. A polo shirt likely would have worked much better.

How to dress appropriately? Unless you fundamentally are quite different and proud of it, dress in items that are not too different from what others are wearing. For informal situations, don't rely on the non-standard opinions of the people who are drawn to this and similar forums. They hardly care if your friends and loved ones disapprove, while you obviously do. Fit advice given online tends to be good, though.

Seeking the approval of others is the key to unhappiness.

 

[mensimageconsultant]

No, actively courting disapproval is. People should dress primarily for themselves when given the leeway, but they should also take into account others' reactions. That many people don't is a prime reason for the epidemic of unstylish dressing.

 

[glowell222]

Originally Posted by letmebefell

A man in a suit with no tie is a man who has not finished dressing.

And yet, there are times when I'm feeling prickish enough to throw on a suit sans tie.

 

[SkinnyGoomba]

Originally Posted by mensimageconsultant

No, actively courting disapproval is. People should dress primarily for themselves when given the leeway, but they should also take into account others' reactions. That many people don't is a prime reason for the epidemic of unstylish dressing.
Why bother, really. Within the realm of reasonably dressing (pith helmets and spats aside) I dont see why one needs to tone it down to avoid ruffing feathers. Which reminds me, I recently went to a Golf outing at which I was planning to simply attend the cocktail hour and Dinner. However I arrived a bit early while people were still golfing and low and behold one of my Ultra-casual business friends is there, who loves to bust my chops. He tells me...."you still have time to hit the pro shop and buy a polo shirt". At which point i look at him and ask "What's a Polo shirt?"

IMO if you're going to overdress, its important to have a sense of humor about the comments you are bound to receive, some of them do get annoying at times. However I consider it far far far worse to look like part of the crowd, then to stand out. Living as a dormant soul would be far worse then death for me.

 

[davidmross]

Originally Posted by ProfessorShak

Did a search and found only things relevant to business casual but not on Casual Dress.

Since Dressing better I've recieved much attention to how I look relative to others around me. It's obvious that when you are in the office, or at a formal event (wedding, conference, meeting, etc...) The guildlines are different, more standard. But when do the lines between dressing nice and dressing down fade?


If I would go out at night to a friendly get together, I would wear wool slacks, a button down shirt and a sport jacket/blazer. I stick in a nice pocket square and nice shoes which aren't black. My wife would get upset and say, "Why are you dressed up, we're only going out with friends!" (Before my transformation I was a Jeans and untucked dress shirts guy)
Or when I was at work, on Casual Friday, I wore my charcoal suit with brown loafers, a thick Blue/Black Striped unbuttoned shirt no tie, with a PS and was asked why was I dressed up. I figured that would pass for Business Casual at least.

So how do you discern when you are appropriatley dressed for the right occassion?
Are there any guidlines for Business Casual and Casual?

I think that in both occasions you were a bit overdressed. I wouldn't wear a jacket over to a friend's house for a friendly get together. In this day and age it simply IS too overdressed for what people are accustomed to. If it was a more "formal" (and I use formal in the North American sense of the word) party such as Christmas then perhaps a jacket would make sense. When going out with a group of friends I think the ensemble could work but it would still be perceived as a bit overdressed. Is that right? No. But it depends on where you are and who's answering the question.

Someone earlier said,"Suit with no tie = inappropriately dressed." I agree. While I like the look of an open neck shirt with a jacket I find that it doesn't tend to look good with a suit, unless it is very slim fitting. I do like the look of an open necked shirt with a jacket and pants/jeans and believe that both of these looks have their time and place.

I find the anecdote about the BBQ the most interesting. My guess is that if you took a photo of the other men almost all of them would be in running shoes, sport sandals, t-shirts, baggy shorts, ball caps. This is standard summer attire for North American men. Sad, but true.

I think the ensemble you described for the BBQ is great. Well done. And don't let the bastards get you down.

 

[mkarim]

Originally Posted by SkinnyGoomba

Either start dressing like ****, or stop worrying about it. Sometimes it takes everyone else quite a while to get used to your new style.

I spend a great deal of time thinking up funny answers to stupid questions, simply so that i can make someone, like the one who asked if you were hot, feel less secure about their own image.

True. I have been changing my style slowly to give people time to digest. I used to be a jeans-tshirt-sneakers kind of guy a year ago. Once people get used to seeing your style, they will expect it - and even start dressing better themselves!

 

[mkarim]

Originally Posted by mensimageconsultant

Now a white dress shirt is one of the most formal shirts encountered by most people. It's also impractical for a BBQ. It was probably that that did the most damage, unless the other items were obviously high-end. A polo shirt likely would have worked much better.

A white linen shirt would be appropriate.

 

[furo]

Originally Posted by letmebefell

Try these guidelines:

Business - Business Suit and Tie.
Business Casual - at a minimum, pants with a crease, pressed shirt, leather shoes, sportscoat and tie optional.
Casual - including at least one element less formal than business casual (jeans, chinos without a crease, non-leather shoes)


In the business casual category, are you stating that the tie alone is optional, or did you mean to say that the coat is optional as well?

Because imo the jacket should be optional w/ business casual

 

[Newcomer]

I think that you were a tad overdressed on these occaisons. Although I think it is important to dress well, I believe that you can dress well and also tone it down. Wear some nice shorts and a sport shirt, or a pair of linen pants and a sport shirt.

But at the end of the day, it all boils down to how you take it. If your friends bother you about it, then so be it, you will still look better