Sole Welting

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Quarantanove, Apr 19, 2012.

  1. TheWraith

    TheWraith Senior member

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    Thanks for the added info, bengal. Very instructive.
     
  2. Nick V.

    Nick V. Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Yes, you did distort what I said in order to make your point. I printed it clearly and explained. If you didn't see it then you are simply guilty of what you accuse others of.....NOT READING. I don't have to show you. You can find it yourself if you're interested.
    Yes, I am a manager. That's not an admission of guild. It's a fact I'm proud of.. Henry Ford was a manager. To say he didn’t know how to build an automobile would be at the very least naive. I would venture to say he knew more about what it took to build a car than some of his most talented engineers and mechanics. And, since you brought it up.....A few months ago huge major shoe factory was having a problem with a certain aspect of their production. Their best people could not find a solution to the problem. Top brass suggested they contact me to get my thoughts in terms of a solution. They explained the problem to me. I got together with my men, we exchanged ideas. A few days later I presented the company with our solution. WA-la...problem solved. They are using our ideas in their production as I type this. But what do I know, according to you I'm “just a manager”. I enjoy working with my men as much as they do working with me. We learn from each other almost every day. We are a team that constantly strives with the intent and focus of improvement. In order to stay that course we need to be open-minded. But, you being a one man shop, I can't expect you to understand that concept.
    You're 100% correct. I don't get my hands dirty. I get my brains dirty. You're challenge of me getting behind the bench is immature and ridiculous from my view-point. I'll explain if you care to read and digest it.
    1. I don't need to.
    For what reason? To say I took up the almighty DW's challenge? Big deal.
    2. If I got behind the bench business would suffer in other areas. That would cost me money. I'm in business to make money, not lose it.
    Having two college tuition’s and mouths to feed my priories are there not with you.
    As they say in Texas “that dog won't hunt”.

    However, I have a challenge for you....One that won't cost you any money and will save you time.
    That is, you have wined several times that this issue (the welt/gemming one) keeps getting re-visited. You mentioned that there were several chances to let it die but it keeps getting re-born.
    My challenge to you is, you don't comment on this topic any further and I won't.

    Let's see who flinches first Mr. “last word” addict.
     
  3. chogall

    chogall Senior member

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    I been into a few shoe factories, except they don't do much or any recrafting at all...

    Yes, I own and wear GY welted shoes. No, I do not know if they suffered gemming failure or not, since I neither have see-through x-ray eyes nor have the experience of Northampton shoe factory recrafting station workman. Neither am I thelonius or rogerp, who can actually determine gemming failure without opening up his shoes.

    Whatever others choose to buy is none of my problem and certainly I am in no position to determine the rate of gemming failure on an aggregate basis. Neither are most on this forum. And unlike the drones who jump on fused suits or square toe shoes, I don't go in to different shoe threads and telling them their choice sucked. And if stating facts hurt someones feelings, my apologies.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2013
  4. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    Well, aren't you a clever little fellow! One of those "damned if you do, damned if you don't" things, eh? Unfortunately, I don't care. I'm polite enough that when someone addresses me, I respond.

    Then too, I like to let a feller go away knowing he was on my mind.

    I don't know what you're referring to as far as distorting your words. I can't hear your brains rattle or read your mind, so implied or hidden meanings shall have to remain hidden. I asked because I wanted to know, that's all. You know (or maybe you don't) a "quest" for information?

    "Getting your brains dirty," is that it? Sounds like the last refuge of someone who can't do, or is above, the work. By those lights, however, every time I modify a last to fit a customer--3D modeling / sculpture, or draw up a pattern for a shoe--math and geometry and more than a little aesthetic analysis...or even diligently go through and check my spelling when I am in a discussion with other people, I'm getting my brains dirty. Something I do every day, all night and each morning, in multiple disciplines--metal, wood, leather, organics. But I don't think of it as getting dirty, I think of it as using my brains. It's just another one of those skills associated with making shoes that people who don't deign to get their hands dirty, consider beside the point.

    But dirty brains and clean hands make both useless simply because they are connected....you know, heart, hands, mind...or maybe only in some people.

    The very beauty of a challenge is that it's not a not a demand. You can rise to the challenge or not... as is your nature.

    --
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2013
  5. jssdc

    jssdc Senior member

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    We could buy a shoe factory for three years of McK [​IMG]
     
  6. JubeiSpiegel

    JubeiSpiegel Senior member

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  7. RogerP

    RogerP Senior member

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    DW cede the last word? That will never happen - he's in love with the sound of his own voice. Addict is indeed an apt term.

    Nick, most of us here understand fully that you are indeed well-positioned to comment on this issue. A number of forum members have made that point. Those who are emotionally invested in trashing GYW will never hear a contrary view no matter the source. At they will predictably attack the source due to an inability to address the substance of that view. But that doesn't mean that there isn't a segment of the forum membership that is both rational and open-minded and thus very much receptive to your input.
     
  8. TheWraith

    TheWraith Senior member

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    +1
     
  9. bengal-stripe

    bengal-stripe Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Congratulations! - This vile and abusive posting must be an all-time low in the forum's history!!!
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2013
  10. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    Oh! I thought that happened in that other recent thread where you accused someone of offending your delicate sensibilities--only to find out that you weren't offended at all. It was just selective outrage...and phony for all of that--at bottom, just another form of posturing.

    "Do the name Ruby Begonia strike a familiah note?"

    --
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2013
  11. TheWraith

    TheWraith Senior member

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    You may well be an excellent cordwainer, DWF, I'm sure you are, but for anything else, you lack the requisite skills to know when to let it lie. And I'm sure, just to prove me right, you'll let fly with another (invective filled?) post rather than just zip it...

    :deadhorse:
     
  12. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    Did I hear someone call my name or is that just flies buzzing?

    My skills as a cordwainer are beside the point. You're the one that's pushing it and you have been for pages. You shut your piehole and I'll consider zipping it. How's that?

    No promises though because I'm nothing, if not polite.

    And always and ever responsive to my fellow creatures when they are in pain.

    This discussion isn't about GYW or even about shoes. It never has been. You know it, I know it and the dog knows it...even if the rabbits don't know it.

    It began as a provocation and became a circle-jerk, a rising tide of groupthink and dullard pettiness.

    --
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2013
  13. TheWraith

    TheWraith Senior member

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    ^ *sigh* you proved me right (as I knew you would).
     
  14. Nick V.

    Nick V. Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Thanks...Just won a $100.00 bet that he couldn't last 24 hours refeining to my challenge. Sorry for my spelling, I'm not as polite as he claims to be.
    We have all seen it before. Some can give it but can't take it when they get it back. Anyway I'm going to enjoy my porterhouse and wine tonight. So, I have to thank DW for that.....
    Truth is I really respect his knowledge. I learned some things from him. He would learn some things from me if he wanted to. But, in order to learn you have to be open-minded.
    Anyway.....I thought I would offer this for peace:
     
  15. barky

    barky Senior member

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    Really, x-ray eyes? I thought that gemming failure is so evil that it will render the shoe unrepairable so if all your recrafts came back, you can make the simple conclusion that none of your shoes experienced any failure, no? At the very least, if I send my shoe for a resole and if there is gemming failure, I would be informed by my cobbler accordingly and if it is repairable (I don't know as it has never happened to me before, all my shoes came back), will ask if I am acceptable to a higher fee for the additional work, no? Or do most cobblers/cordwainers just suck up the additional work required as cost of doing business and leave their customers none the wiser about the condition of their shoes gemming? Not trying to be smart, honest question.
     

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