Black Tie Help?

[Bounder]



I would also say no to midnight blue Dinner Jacket and black trousers, although I must say that Christopher Plummer pulled this look of quite well.

Note that he is wearing a velvet DJ with his black pants. (Obviously, I hope, you can't wear a velvet DJ with velvet pants.) This is semi-correct except that velvet DJs are only supposed to be worn at private gatherings among friends. Mr. Plummer is, no doubt, extremely popular. But the Oscars still don't qualify.

There are three ways it is more-or-less acceptable to wear a DJ with non-matching pants: When you are wearing a white DJ, When you are wearing a velvet DJ and when you are wearing a Black Watch DJ. Otherwise, not.

So no, you can't wear a midnight blue DJ and black pants, it will look ridiculous. Trust me on this. You should also know that midnight blue, shawl lapel tuxedos are pretty rare so you are going to have a very hard time finding one OTR.

Herein follows the obligatory recommendation of http://www.blacktieguide.com

 

[unbelragazzo]

To clarify, I was assuming that the jacket was wool when I responded. I also support wearing a midnight blue velvet jacket with black pants. In fact I'm having a one button peak lapel midnight blue velvet jacket made right now that I will probably wear exclusively with black pants.

 

[TimelesStyle]



To clarify, I was assuming that the jacket was wool when I responded. I also support wearing a midnight blue velvet jacket with black pants. In fact I'm having a one button peak lapel midnight blue velvet jacket made right now that I will probably wear exclusively with black pants.

Out of curiosity, what facings will you use?

I think that a dark blue velvet DJ is very underrated (seems most that do velvet go burgundy or black); just as midnight wool is said to look "blacker than black" in artificial light I feel that dark blue velvet takes on an almost purplish hue and has a very luxurious look to it.

 

[unbelragazzo]



Out of curiosity, what facings will you use?
I think that a dark blue velvet DJ is very underrated (seems most that do velvet go burgundy or black); just as midnight wool is said to look "blacker than black" in artificial light I feel that dark blue velvet takes on an almost purplish hue and has a very luxurious look to it.

No facings, it's all velvet.

 

[TimelesStyle]



Note that he is wearing a velvet DJ with his black pants. (Obviously, I hope, you can't wear a velvet DJ with velvet pants.) This is semi-correct except that velvet DJs are only supposed to be worn at private gatherings among friends. Mr. Plummer is, no doubt, extremely popular. But the Oscars still don't qualify.

So does he earn or lose extra points for also utilizing a velvet evening slipper?

 

[unbelragazzo]



So does he earn or lose extra points for also utilizing a velvet evening slipper?

Lose, for the same reasons. Not appropriate to the event/occasion/venue.

 

[TimelesStyle]



Lose, for the same reasons. Not appropriate to the event/occasion/venue.

My issue with the whole question of "appropriate" in these cases is this: there are few, if any, who still host black tie functions for small, intimate gatherings, which means that these versions either have to be rendered obsolete or must be considered acceptable under a wider variety of circumstances. Personally, I think that with the world going casual in ways never before imagined, that this form of dress should be considered acceptable in public, much the way that slacks and a collared shirt has come to replace the suit in many business environments and designer jeans have come to replace slacks in five star restaurants.

 

[unbelragazzo]

Personally I think there's just very little use for smoking jackets and velvet slippers these days. I think the better idea is to adapt those same items to informal wear - I have house shoes that are suede but could easily be made of velvet that I wear when entertaining at home in non-black-tie gear. Likewise my non-smoking-jacket velvet jacket, which I will wear with black trousers and a white shirt, usually without tie, out at night. Better that than forcing an at-home-black-tie get-up into other black-tie situations, when there are so few of those remaining to begin with. If your goal is to save the smoking jacket and velvet slipper from extinction, you'll need another outlet other than making them acceptable at public black-tie affairs.

 

[TimelesStyle]



Personally I think there's just very little use for smoking jackets and velvet slippers these days. I think the better idea is to adapt those same items to informal wear - I have house shoes that are suede but could easily be made of velvet that I wear when entertaining at home in non-black-tie gear. Likewise my non-smoking-jacket velvet jacket, which I will wear with black trousers and a white shirt, usually without tie, out at night. Better that than forcing an at-home-black-tie get-up into other black-tie situations, when there are so few of those remaining to begin with. If your goal is to save the smoking jacket and velvet slipper from extinction, you'll need another outlet other than making them acceptable at public black-tie affairs.

Personally, I can't imagine using them for most black tie events. Ok, a New Year's Eve party maybe (regardless of whether it's in someone's home or at a more public venue) but as you said, there are so few black tie events these days that I'll use my tux.

The other reason I think it works on Plummer, though, is simply the fact that he's an old person, and old people can get away with a lot of things younger people can't simply because they're old. The senior chairman of a financial services firm showing up in his golf clothes because he's old and only comes to the office because it feels weird to not go to the office is totally fine while a 45yr old managing director showing up to a potential client meeting in same would be highly inappropriate in most settings.

 

[Bounder]



So does he earn or lose extra points for also utilizing a velvet evening slipper?

Velvet slippers are correct for black tie though I don't wear them. For me, the problem with that ensemble is that it would be most excellent if he were lounging around at home after dinner drinking port with a bunch of friends in his personal smoking room. For the same reason, it's kind of a fail at the biggest and most public black-tie event in the world. But I suppose he gets a couple of FU points for consistency.

My issue with the whole question of "appropriate" in these cases is this: there are few, if any, who still host black tie functions for small, intimate gatherings

You don't know that. Maybe you just don't get invited.

Well, me neither. But it would be great to revive this. I suggest you invite all your tuxedo-owning friends to a black-tie dinner party.

Personally, I think that with the world going casual in ways never before imagined, that this form of dress should be considered acceptable in public, much the way that slacks and a collared shirt has come to replace the suit in many business environments and designer jeans have come to replace slacks in five star restaurants.

And you consider this a good thing that we should encourage? Business casual? Designer jeans in Michelin-starred restaurants? Frankly, I'm against it.

 

[SMatthews]

That is true - a dinner jacket is very different from a blazer.

 

[TimelesStyle]



And you consider this a good thing that we should encourage? Business casual? Designer jeans in Michelin-starred restaurants? Frankly, I'm against it.

Well, I'm personally a jeans guy, though I don't believe in "business casual" as a style of dress; for me it's either jeans or suits. That being said, I'll wear jeans in places where it was once considered unacceptable but will also wear suits in places slacks and a jacket would be the norm. Basically I'm arrogant enough (and a good enough dresser) that I feel it acceptable to substitute my own judgement for past/present societal norms.

 

[mjjo]

i'm a jeans guy myself, i hardly wear chinos even when it's too warm outside. but if it boils down to a suit jacket and blazer, it's hands down the suit for me.