Navy Hopsack Suit?

Originally Posted by pejsek

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You know, I did find a pretty nice Invertere coat last week--hip-length db in cotton-wool cavalry twill w/ wool pile lining. Arms were (unfortunately) a couple of inches too short.

I could only wish to have dopey's karma. But at least I'm working on it.
If it was an alpaca lining, that was it.

Originally Posted by dopey

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If it was an alpaca lining, that was it.

Perhaps your 10,000th post will bring it back.

Originally Posted by Wes Bourne

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Perhaps your 10,000th post will bring it back.

I am proud to have been virtually present at this momentous occasion.


- B

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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I am proud to have been virtually present at this momentous occasion.


- B

Now would be a good time to tell us how you celebrated your 10,000th...

Originally Posted by Wes Bourne

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Now would be a good time to tell us how you celebrated your 10,000th...

My 10K post was near the beginning of this thread.

Seems like yesterday.


- B

Two notes: 1) As I opened this thread I thought to myself "Moo, you will be mentioned by page 4." I was mistaken, as I was mentioned on page 5. Well done, Vox. EDIT: It was page 4! Ha. 2) While I'm not a huge fan of the hopsack material, I don't really get the sanitation worker argument at all. It's a suit, and if NYR wears it he'll be much further along than 99% of the humani populi. Sometimes one forgets that SF is a little tiny bubble of insignificance to everyone but a few awkward and strange members. If he wears a suit 999/1000 people will think "that guy is wearing a suit - nice" and not "hopsack? What a garbage man! Guffaw!" And the one guy who does think that is truly a fantastic creep, so it really shouldn't matter.

Originally Posted by George

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Have you considered one of those faux tweeds in the Harrison's Glorious Twelfth bunch? Those cloths give the impression of texture without the roughness inherent in a real tweed, they also have a greater variety of colour than your standard suitings allowing you more opportunity to experiment with different looks, it's also a lot lighter than real tweed. I think Voxsartoria has a SBPL from one of the cloths in this range.

I'll think about some others and get back as my time is at premium today.

I'm pretty familiar with the Glorious Twelfth book. With all but maybe one or two of the cloths, if you have a complete suit made from them, you are going to look like Bertie Wooster visiting a country house.

But, hey, Bertie was indubitably upper class...and English into the bargain!

Originally Posted by dopey

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If it was an alpaca lining, that was it.

No, this was wool-poly and at least twenty years old. Alpaca sounds fantastic--if a bit improbably luxe for the true old school.

I do, however, very much like the notion of an underground railroad quietly spiriting away all of the UHB's hard-won wealth to the squalor of San Francisco's Tenderloin. Popular notions of thrifting often lack nuance. There's the shabby gentility of the charity shops, the middle class populism of the Goodwills, the crazy bible-grasping of the Salvation Army, and the groovy bohemianism of places like Out Of The Closet. I have an indefensible soft spot for the places where the thieves outnumber the paying customers and the men tend to sport neck tatoos and teardrops. But that's just me.

Originally Posted by DocHolliday

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Admittedly, this is a viewpoint very much informed by having been brought up in the South, where the past isn't as distant as in other locales.

it's not even past?

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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Just recently, we had a delightful dinner with acquaintances of secure and unimpeachable society. Early 1800s merchant money. A prominent abolitionist family. The most well known member of this family commanded the 54th Regiment in the Civil War, a topic that many of you would know from the movie Glory.

They are comfortable, but not what would be considered rich. So, yes, I agree that there are aspects to certain types of traditional type social standing that are immediately unrelated to money and that money cannot buy perhaps except through the passage of time and generations.

But, I also think that modernity has largely overswept this form of cultural prominence in America and put in its stead an amorphous and ever changing soup of money, mass celebrity, and maybe even a bit of manufactured meritocracy. But, as Poo noted earlier and perhaps this is what you mean as well, vestiges of the past are still mixed in with this.

The degree to which this is true probably continues to have some regional variation.

- B

When I see/hear class, right or wrong I think tribe. In any event the clothing is only one part of the puzzle, tribal recognition encompassing speech, manners, and a host of preferences -- religion, food, drink, entertainments, and, yes, dress. I am sure I left lots of axes of difference off this list.

My knowledge of biology is rudimentary, and at that wholly out of date. Nonetheless, I remember something one of my profs went on about concerning taxonomy that may be instructive: in the early 80s, the old system of Kingdom, Phylum, Class, Order, Family, Genus, Species was becoming unhelpful in the classification at the level of microorganisms. They began creating instead a massive matrix of binary characteristics against which a given organism could be tested, yielding a unique footprint, as it were, against the list of characteristics. I think this sort of system more accurately reflects the multivariant aspects of class/tribe in modern (sub)cultures.

It's the differences and boundary conditions that are interesting -- but the eiron in me is irrepressible such that I cannot take any tribe/class (including the various ones which represent my own intersections) seriously -- they are all equally ridiculous.

Originally Posted by Mr. Moo

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Two notes: 1) As I opened this thread I thought to myself "Moo, you will be mentioned by page 4." I was mistaken, as I was mentioned on page 5. Well done, Vox. EDIT: It was page 4! Ha.
Moo doesn't make the thread, he makes the thread better.

Originally Posted by Mr. Moo

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2) While I'm not a huge fan of the hopsack material, I don't really get the sanitation worker argument at all.
There's no argument, unless you mean a couple of drama queens losing their grip and reacting to a simple observation. I suppose it's good to remember that no one ever really has these reactions because if they did, I can only imagine how much more animated their reactions would've been. It was my impression and it stands. The OP should consider a more modern fabric anyway. These boards live in some sort of never ending retro-value-longevity reality where people choose fabrics based on whether they will "last forever". The results are often obvious, even in online photos, and they're not impressive.

Originally Posted by Mr. Moo

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It's a suit, and if NYR wears it he'll be much further along than 99% of the humani populi.
Then he really doesn't need anyone's opinion. Actually, based on that nugget, you all can go out and randomly pick any fabric you like without any thought about its effect..oh wait...

Originally Posted by Mr. Moo

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Sometimes one forgets that SF is a little tiny bubble of insignificance to everyone but a few awkward and strange members.
I try to forget but I am constantly reminded

Originally Posted by Mr. Moo

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If he wears a suit 999/1000 people will think "that guy is wearing a suit - nice" and not "hopsack? What a garbage man! Guffaw!".
Yeah, true. Truer for some than others.

Originally Posted by Mr. Moo

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And the one guy who does think that is truly a fantastic creep, so it really shouldn't matter.
Ah, he may be a creep but it may matter a whole lot.

Originally Posted by Wes Bourne

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Now would be a good time to tell us how you celebrated your 10,000th...

Corn-rows & manicured toes!

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

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There's no argument, unless you mean a couple of drama queens losing their grip and reacting to a simple observation. I suppose it's good to remember that no one ever really has these reactions because if they did, I can only imagine how much more animated their reactions would've been.

It was my impression and it stands. The OP should consider a more modern fabric anyway. These boards live in some sort of never ending retro-value-longevity reality where people choose fabrics based on whether they will "last forever". The results are often obvious, even in online photos, and they're not impressive.

Messr. Buff, I am very interested in your opinions on modern fabric. I have often meditated on the difficult juxtaposition between classic clothing and contemporary social expectations. How have you personally navigated these troubled waters? What fabrics do you consider modern, and how can I learn to identify them?

Originally Posted by whnoofan!

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Messr. Buff, I am very interested in your opinions on modern fabric. I have often meditated on the difficult juxtaposition between classic clothing and contemporary social expectations. How have you personally navigated these troubled waters? What fabrics do you consider modern, and how can I learn to identify them?
It's not necessarily an easy thing to explain. Sometimes, the same sort of fabric can be modern because it is made finer, smoother or softer like with flannel. Sometimes the exact same fabric weave but with a different finish can look more contemporary. I didnt think I had to be too specific beause when I think of Hopsack suit, I also think of serge and old fashioned postal uniforms. The OP never showed us the actual swatch of hopsack nor described its qualities but my off the rack reaction to hopsack is that old skool jacketing. If the hopsack were say, Harrisons "Mystique" or "Frontier" book, that would have always been acceptable.

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

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It's not necessarily an easy thing to explain. Sometimes, the same sort of fabric can be modern because it is made finer, smoother or softer like with flannel. Sometimes the exact same fabric weave but with a different finish can look more contemporary. I didnt think I had to be too specific beause when I think of Hopsack suit, I also think of serge and old fashioned postal uniforms.

I have read on another forum that one can assess the quality of a fabric by rubbing it between his fingers. Using this method, will I be able to identify the modernistic qualities that you describe? Are you familiar with Michael Alden? It seems that two experts such as yourselves would have a lot to talk about.

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

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The OP never showed us the actual swatch of hopsack nor described its qualities but my off the rack reaction to hopsack is that old skool jacketing. If the hopsack were say, Harrisons "Mystique" or "Frontier" book, that would have always been acceptable.

Harrisons is a brand or a type of cloth? I have not seen it in stores.