Where to buy box calf in England?

[josh1233]

If the leather was plated, a process where the leather is rolled between two smooth steel tubes that are heated, you will not see much if any of a hair cell grain. This is especially true if the leather is dyed and then plated. If the later, it also makes the dyed leather shiny and helps to set the dye.

 

[DWFII]

Originally Posted by bengal-stripe

Chrome tanning produces soft leathers which drape well, suitable for shoe uppers or upholstery, while vegetal tanning produces stiff leathers for cases, bridle work or shoe bottoms (soles). That's the rule, there are a few exceptions.
Let me expand upon that if I may. At one time...and not too long ago...every part of the shoe was made of vegetable tanned leather. Since WWII chrome tanning has pretty much superseded veg for uppers, at least in lower end shoes. Vegetable tanning takes longer...a lot longer...to go from raw hide to finished product. But much of the leather being used for high end shoes that sport antique finishes and such are vegetable tanned...and aniline dyed and full grain. As I understand it most (if not all) of the "crust" that is used for high-end Italian shoes is veg. Museum Calf is veg. Some are even glazed...a finish technique that most chrome tannages sport and does not necessarily indicate corrected grain. Vegetable tannages are not as stretchy as chromes but they do not have to be stiff or brittle. They take the shape of the last better than chromes and hold that shape better. As time has gone by, I have come to admire a good vegetable tan as much or moreso than the chromes I see. I have access to and have used vegetable tans that are every bit as soft as chromes and as nicely finished. I have actually come to prefer them for shoe uppers. But in the US vegs suitable for making uppers are hard to come by...although that is slowly changing. Parenthetically, most commonly available insole and outsole leather is a "vegetable" tannage but it is synthetic--it is chemicals that emulate the action of natural barks ordinarily used for vegetable tanning but speed the process up from many months to a few weeks. It's also cheaper than Baker--which has been in the pits for up to a year.

 

[josh1233]

DWFFII, are there any more tanneries in the US that produce sole leather anymore? Westfield was the last one that I know of and they went out of business. I used to get veg tanned shoulders from them.

 

[DWFII]

Originally Posted by josh1233

DWFFII, are there any more tanneries in the US that produce sole leather anymore? Westfield was the last one that I know of and they went out of business. I used to get veg tanned shoulders from them.
There are companies that offer soling leather--Keystone (most of the old Westfiled crew) and Milton-Sokol come to mind, but AFAIK everything they offer is imported.

 

[I. Gentantithesis]

Hermie uses box calf as Kelly, Birkin bags, etc., should that calm qualms. Ditto ***'s Yard.

If you're apprehensive about buying Crack, these folks might be able to point you in the direction of a single hide or remnant source www.hewit.com Yes, one's aware it's a book-binding supplier.

Genuine 'Box' calf uses a process of graining smooth leather via 'boarding'. The calf is rubbed in two directions with a board to give it a finely creased square shaped grain. Willow calf is rubbed in one direction to impart a finely creased long grain. Box calf derives its name from Joseph Box, who also invented 'Joe Boxers'. Lobb, St. James has probably sustained the term as it acquired Joe's business.

http://www.powerhousemuseum.com/coll...se/?irn=135865

http://cool.conservation-us.org/don/dt/dt0387.html

And you thought I's just a pretty face.

Be careful, there's a lot of misinformation floating about out there. One has to be discerning.

 

[Tomasso]

László Vass loves it, the box calf..............

 

[MyOtherLife]

bengal-stripe, thank you for the information. I sit er...corrected (no pun intended).

 

[Max Inseam]

Originally Posted by Tomasso

László Vass loves it, the box calf..............

I have noticed that too, and Vass shoes do seem to come with and take a high shine. I have seen Vass shoes in scotch grain. Do they use corrected grain too?

 

[supershoefan]

Who knows what leather does G&G use? I like the feeling of their calf a lot.

 

[RIDER]

Can't help you looking for a jobber in the UK that might be able to sell in small quantities, but there is still box being produced. The only one I know of, besides the old Freudenburg people, that is making box for uppers is Annonay. Most the others make it for leathergoods. You can try to make contact with Roux, Perlinger, Hoffmann or Hoffmans. Your best bet might be Hoffmann as, if I recall, they have a commercial shop somewhere in Germany.

If you don't have experience with Box, it is very hard. All it means is that the hide has been boarded a couple different ways to open up the grain into a 'box'......and Bengal is correct - used to only be used for Black Calf. Similiar tannage in colors was called 'Willow'. Funny....jogged my memory, as we discussed this probably 5+ years ago now.

Anyway, good luck - best bet might be to ask who in your region might be ordering this calf and try to piggy-back on an order.

 

[RIDER]

Originally Posted by DWFII

But much of the leather being used for high end shoes that sport antique finishes and such are vegetable tanned...and aniline dyed and full grain.

As I understand it most (if not all) of the "crust" that is used for high-end Italian shoes is veg. Museum Calf is veg.

Hi DW -

No.....Museum is just JL's name for Radica. It's a chrome calf....comes from Ilcea. For the burnishable uppers, I don't think so. Might be a retan, but I think are all chrome.....mostly Betis. Depends I suppose.

 

[bengal-stripe]

Originally Posted by DWFII

But much of the leather being used for high end shoes that sport antique finishes and such are vegetable tanned...and aniline dyed and full grain.

As I understand it most (if not all) of the "crust" that is used for high-end Italian shoes is veg. Museum Calf is veg.

Some are even glazed...a finish technique that most chrome tannages sport and does not necessarily indicate corrected grain.

Here is the technical description of all Weinheimer (Freudenberg) leathers currently available:

http://www.weinheimer-leder.com/prod...nge/index.html

All of them are chrome tanned, many are in addition vegetable re-tanned (including crust).

But their box calf is ’classic chrome tanning’, and it is only the versions for leather goods (Maro) and belts (Ceinture) that are also boarded.
The box calf for shoes, is not boarded but is finished with casein and gets ‘glazed’ (with steel or glass rollers).

 

[RIDER]

Originally Posted by bengal-stripe

Here is the technical description of all Weinheimer (Freudenberg) leathers currently available:

http://www.weinheimer-leder.com/prod...nge/index.html

All of them are chrome tanned, many are in addition vegetable re-tanned (including crust).

But their box calf is 'classic chrome tanning', and it is only the versions for leather goods (Maro) and belts (Ceinture) that are also boarded.
The box calf for shoes, is not boarded but is finished with casein and gets "˜glazed' (with steel or glass rollers).

HI Bengal -

Yeah.....most of the traditional definitions have gone by the wayside I suppose. I know of one Italian tannery selling spray painted splits as 'box calf'. Goes on those cardboard J&M shoes made by Lady Kent.

 

[SABATE]

Hello sir,

I'm writing from Portugal. I know that the question is old but we can supplier to you Box calf.

Mail: [email protected]
Phone: 00351 912756473

Thank you for your time
Xavier Sabate Moreira