MTM/Bespoke versus RTW.....

[rnoldh]

Originally Posted by Eustace Tilley

Not really. IMO, people with a good physique benefit even more from bespoke suits, as most RTW suits are cut from a standard pattern in order to suit the average consumer. Thus, the diminished chest-waist differential on RTW suits does not flatter the well-built.

Yes you are right and the opposite applies too.

What I mean is that most RTW suits are made with a 6-8 drop, correct?

If you have a 2-4" drop, like a 46" chest and a 42" waist, you would look much better in a bespoke suit than a RTW.

 

[Piobaire]

Originally Posted by Dragon

RTW jackets often use safe (not too bold or weird) materials. The cut and design options are safe too. The people that make RTW jackets are professionals that are selling to a mass.

With bespoke you make the choice of fabric. You could pick fabrics that really look great on you, but you could also make some choices that look like garbage. Same goes for the cut and design issues.

Exactly what I was getting at in my post. Unguided choice can be a scary thing.

 

[yachtie]

Originally Posted by dopey
ooops. I voted without controlling for "on SF". Had I noticed, I might have gone with RTW.

That actually points to a big part of the issue. Much of the not-so good bespoke posted on SF is low-end bespoke or first try-bespoke. Those can often give you spotty results. But high-end bespoke, especially once the relationship has settled down, almost always beats RTW.

Originally Posted by Eustace Tilley

I agree 100% with the statement above.


+1. With an excellent tailor, bespoke beats MTM & OTR virtually every time. Especially if you don't look like a male model.

 

[chorse123]

One of the problems with the discussion on a site like this is static pictures. I have some RTW that looks a lot better from the front, or in a static pose, but the back doesn't fit as well, or the collar pulls a little when I move.

 

[Eustace Tilley]

Originally Posted by chorse123

One of the problems with the discussion on a site like this is static pictures. I have some RTW that looks a lot better from the front, or in a static pose, but the back doesn't fit as well, or the collar pulls a little when I move.

This is very true. My first MTM was a Corneliani from Saks NY. During my first (and only) fitting, the salesmen would pull the coat down to have it sit correctly at the collar. With such a manipulation, the coat cut a beautiful silhouette in the mirror. However, it was only later that I noticed that it was impossible to have the coat sit correctly as I moved about.

 

[vitaminc]

Not everyone is equipped to be his own clothing designer. The TaT thread has a lot of examples of how people picking the wrong silhouette for their body type.

 

[whacked]

Originally Posted by vitaminc

Not everyone is equipped to be his own clothing designer. The TaT thread has a lot of examples of how people picking the wrong silhouette for their body type.

The same people would do equally erroneously, according to you, going into a store and buy the latest Dior Homme, Costume National or Spencer Hart RTW suits, which is what a typical TAT customer would have done had they had the means. The difference: they would be out of 2-3 grands instead of $450 per TAT styleforum pricing.

 

[Eustace Tilley]

What is TaT?

 

[danyllau]

Isn't some MTM more like a RTW than bespoke? I thought for MTM, a lot just use pre-cut/designed pieces from the big designers and make the suit following that those big designer's idea, but for your specific measurements.

 

[vitaminc]

Originally Posted by whacked

The same people would do equally erroneously, according to you, going into a store and buy the latest Dior Homme, Costume National or Spencer Hart RTW suits, which is what a typical TAT customer would have done had they had the means. The difference: they would be out of 2-3 grands instead of $450 per TAT styleforum pricing.

They wouldn't be able to fit (or find their size) in RTW suits from Dior Homme. MTM allows them to fit into some horrendous silhouettes for themselves.

 

[houserichichi]

I've seen some masterpieces on yfyf and the few that RSS posted to the Savile Row discussion that are mtm/bespoke (I think exclusively the latter (both cases, but I could be wrong). I'm still unsure whether iammatt's stuff is bespoke, mtm, otr, or a combination of the lot but I think his stuff appeals to me as much as the other two if not more often. Looking To Improve's morning coat is another fantatic example of what appeals to my eye, personally and was bespoke. I'm sure there are others who run the gamut like these four, but they're the powerhouses of fit that I look forward to posting pictures of their clothing and whose style I generally tend toward as well.

That said, there have been a plethora of god awful bespoke/mtm pieces I've seen floating around the board (at least to my eyes anyway, but then who am I). In general I'd say RTW done properly will suit the purposes of more than 90% of the planetary population and, if done very well, can top some of the mtm/bespoke. Again I turn to my favourite four above and say that whoever their tailors are would be a fantastic starting point with attempting mtm/bespoke but would probably not reach that caliber on the first attempt.

Thus, in general I'd most often suggest RTW and after a successful bout of that determine whether MTM is an option and if so then pursue. After MTM then decide whether bespoke is an option and if so then pursue. I couldn't imagine going bespoke without initially trying RTW first to see what one even likes or how clothing is supposed to fit, or at worst how it isn't.

 

[Cantabrigian]

Such a subtle push poll - getting ready for November?

You don't see much bespoke stuff posted and what is posted is usually pretty good - certainly well above the average RTW outfit.

I've personally posted some bespoke that sucks but that's because I've spent a lot of time messing around with discount bespokers. Most of the bespoke people bother to post is the high dollar stuff and generally fits like you'd expect.

 

[aportnoy]

If I'm speaking from my own experience with Raphael and Shattuck vs. the numerous Kiton, Brioni, Isaia, RLPL etc suits that I have there is no comparison. The bespoke garments fit is light years ahead of anything that I've found via RTW. It's not even close.

I can add RTW suits to my closet and my wife never notices when I'm wearing a new one. Every time I put on a bespoke suit no matter how many times she's seen it, she notices and comments.

As for what's posted on SF, like in life, there's some good, some not so good.

 

[RJman]

Originally Posted by aportnoy

As for what's posted on SF, like in life, there's some good, some not so good.
The shoe fairy is wise...

 

[sartort]

I rationalize the fact that I will most likely never own a bespoke piece (due to a lack of discretionary means of that magnitude) by telling myself that RL Black Label fits me better off the rack then anything I have tried on.

The silhouette is darn near perfect (imo of course). However, if I were to do bespoke, of course I could have my choice of fabrics. Additionally, if I were doing bespoke and starting with the RL Black Label Anthony coat as a base, I would raise the button stance .5" and maybe soften the roping in the shoulders just a smidge and lastly elongate the rear slits about an inch.

But I can and will be perfectly happy in black label. Ignorance is bliss they say. Perhaps even monetarily forced ignorance.