2012 50 Best Restaurants in the World List

[ehkay]



TFL at 43 and Amber (Hong Kong) at 44, which I just went to recently - I find that strange. I haven't been to TFL but I imagine just the experience of driving out to wine country and eating in TK's little fine dining shack is more memorable than pushing an elevator button and eating anonymous pseudo-French in a Chinese luxury hotel.

I really don't understand how TFL went from #1 restaurant in (all of) the Americas to something like 40 on the list. Having dined there, I put it easily in my top 3. Is Per Se that much better?

You're making the mistake of using the list how they want you to use/interpret it.

I have very little experience with Chang and none beyond Ma Peche but isn't Ko supposed to be his flagship? So what is this Ssssam Bar or whatever that is on the list?

Ssam is wrapping stuff in lettuce like hand rolls; I think at Ssam bar he makes things like his Bo ssam (pork shoulder with lettuce wraps) and the $100 fried chicken.
At Ko he makes things like an amuse bouche of a pork rind sprinkled in the lowest quality S and B brand shichimi tougarashi, and a 'kimchi consomme' that is like the strained version of a broth that Korean $2 noodle shops serve.

Ssam bar was for some time a pretty good restaurant when his old number 2 was running it (like an ex Craft/Cafe Boulud guy I think) for the time around when Bruni gave it three stars in the times. What made it popular/famous were the actual composed dishes, and not the bo ssam/pork buns/asian burritos. But it has seriously declined post-2009ish, and the prices have skyrocketed.

ETA: It's certainly not, and was not, the 40th best restaurant in the world.

 

[indesertum]

neither of you have actually been to ssam or ko...

 

[erictheobscure]

I've been to Ssam. It was fine. But if it were really the 37th best restaurant in the world, I'd start saving my money by eating off of fast food 99-cent menus.

 

[A Y]

I wonder if the social dynamics of the voting aren't dissimilar to MC when people discuss the best bespoke or the best shoes or whatever. There are lots of people extrapolating from other people's experiences, and there's a lot of backlash cliquey stuff based on personalities of the various parties involved.

:foo:

 

[indesertum]

^yeah prolly. i'im sure even within the food critic world there are cycles of hype and backlash and backlash against backlash

 

[nmprisons]



In other words, neither one deserves to be on the list ...

I have been to Ko, Ssan Bar, and Noodle Bar multiple times each. Ko is bar seating, tasting menu, composed dishes. Ssam Bar is a slightly fancier, more expensive, version of noodle bar with slightly more complicated composed dishes. Ssam Bar, which I like a lot, isn't close to the 40th best restaurant in the United States, or, as the list would have it, a top 5 restaurant in NYC. Per Se, EMP, Corton, The Modern, Le Bernardin, Craft, Ko, and many others provide better food, some even in a better atmosphere and for a better value.

 

[Manton]

How is it possible to go to Ko multiple times given the reservation policy? Chang said it took his own mother a year to get a reservation and she only went once.

 

[ehkay]



How is it possible to go to Ko multiple times given the reservation policy? Chang said it took his own mother a year to get a reservation and she only went once.

Reservations aren't really that hard to come by. It's been open for almost 4 years now, and the initial 10 AM login buzz has died down, and there are often cancellations. I got in twice the summer it opened by checking the reservations site for ***** and giggles when I happened to be in town. There are people on other parts of the interwebs who claim >100 visits.

As to his mother not getting in, I wouldn't really take anything he says to the media particularly seriously.

 

[foodguy]



^yeah prolly. i'im sure even within the food critic world there are cycles of hype and backlash and backlash against backlash

pre-hype, discovery, hype, pre-backlash, backlash, resurrection.
lather, rinse, repeat.

 

[ThomSquared]

If they simply want to add Chang somewhere on that list just to have him on it I would have assumed it would be Ko. not Ssam Bar... Being that I am a sucker for culinary mogul hype I was thinking of at least checking one of his spots out in a couple weeks when I'm in NYC. Should it be Ko. or Ssam Bar?

 

[nmprisons]



How is it possible to go to Ko multiple times given the reservation policy? Chang said it took his own mother a year to get a reservation and she only went once.

As others have said, it just isn't that hard. Between my fiance and I, we never spend more than two mornings before we get one (i.e., we both might miss on day 1, but one of us gets one on day 2). The trick is to know what the grid looks like ahead of time and to know the difference between an unavailable and available box so that you can immediately click on an available one. Then sort the rest out (i.e., making sure you have that night free, etc.) later.

Heck, once a buddy of mine walked into noodle bar only to find out that, if he wanted, there was a stool waiting for him at Ko due to a last-minute cancellation.

 

[SField]



1. Noma, Denmark
2. El Cellar de Can Roca, Spain
3. Mugaritz, Spain
4. D.O.M., Brazil
5. Osteria Francescana, Italy
6. Per Se, New York
7. Alinea, Illinois
8. Arzak, Spain
9. Dinner by Heston Blumenthal, U.K.
10. Eleven Madison Park, New York
11. Steirereck, Austria
12. L'Atelier de Joël Robuchon, France
13. The Fat Duck, U.K.
14. The Ledbury, U.K.
15. Le Chateaubriand, France
16. L'Arpege, France
17. Pierre Gagnaire, France
18. L'Astrance, France
19. Le Bernardin, New York
20. Frantzén/Lindeberg, Sweden
21. Oud Sluis, Netherlands
22. Aqua, Germany
23. Vendome, Germany
24. Mirazur, France
25. Daniel, New York
26. Iggy's, Singapore
27. Les Creations de Narisawa, Japan
28. Nihonryori Ryugin, Japan
29. Quay, Australia
30. Schloss Schauenstein, Switzerland
31. Asador Extebarri, Spain
32. Le Calandre, Italy
33. De Librije, Netherlands
34. Fäviken Magasinet, Sweden
35. Astrid y Gaston, Peru
36. Pujol, Mexico
37. Momofuku Ssäm Bar, New York
38. Biko, Mexico
39. Waku Ghin, Singapore
40. Quique Dacosta, Spain
41. Mathias Dahlgren, Sweden
42. Hof Van Cleve, Belgium
43. The French Laundry, California
44. Amber, China
45. Vila Joya, Portugal
46. Il Canto, Italo
47. Bras, France
48. Manresa, California
49. Geranium, Denmark
50. Nahm, Thailand
.

PerSe isn't even the best restaurant in New York, far less the US. And no offense to my old boss but L'astrance and Chateaubriand are better and more exciting than L'atelier... and L'Arpege being that low is a joke. It's the best french restaurant on the planet.

These lists are actually offensive. I can't believe I opened this thread.

 

[Bhowie]

I assumed Japan would've had the top 20 spots locked down.

 

[kwilkinson]



I assumed Japan would've had the top 20 spots locked down.

Brits run this thing. So they probably found the food overwhelmingly bland.

 

[impolyt_one]



I assumed Japan would've had the top 20 spots locked down.

tough call between Tokyo and cutting-edge Boston.