My new Home Theater is open!

[A Y]

Originally Posted by gorgekko

Get millions of people off 56K connections before you start talking about fibre optic.

You don't need everyone off 56K before you can do useful things. Case in point: the popularity of Youtube and other high-bandwidth streaming video today. FIOS is going in lots of areas, and it won't be long before there will be a critical mass of users.

Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim

So... you don't subscribe to the theory that MS, by backing HD-DVD, is playing a spoiler game by supporting a Blu-Ray/HD-DVD format war? (that they don't actually expect to win...)

I've read that too, and while that may be possible, I think if MS could be organized enough to be this devious, they would have taken over the world by now. I think it's just the usual tech industry scrum where everyone is convinced their technology is better, and egos get in the way of cooperation. I'm sure everyone has a next-gen codec in the works, too.

--Andre

 

[gorgekko]

Originally Posted by Andre Yew

You don't need everyone off 56K before you can do useful things. Case in point: the popularity of Youtube and other high-bandwidth streaming video today. FIOS is going in lots of areas, and it won't be long before there will be a critical mass of users.

I keep coming back to the same point because you continue to fail to answer it (I'll ignore the YouTube thing, the web site is a sideshow). Last mile high bandwidth is inevitable, yes, but the question isn't "if" but "when", and based on adoption rates of garden variety high bandwidth connections, it's going to be a very long time before FIOS is in a tipping point of American homes.

If regular high bandwidth connections are failing to grab Americans, why do you think that FIOS is suddenly going to engage their attention and the adoption rate to be incredible enough to warrant planning for HD streaming/downloading.

Believe me Andre, I hope you're right. I have little use for physical media. I only use it now when I have to. While I'm not enamored of giving Apple or Microsoft control of the format, it's better than futzing around with physical media.

 

[Artisan Fan]

I like physical media since I enjoy having a library of titles for instant access whether they be DVDs, BluRays, or CD/SACDs. My guess is that we are many years away from convenient downloadable movies, especially in a 1080P format.

There's something to be said about ownership benefits that come with entertainment media.

 

[A Y]

Originally Posted by gorgekko

I keep coming back to the same point because you continue to fail to answer it (I'll ignore the YouTube thing, the web site is a sideshow). Last mile high bandwidth is inevitable, yes, but the question isn't "if" but "when", and based on adoption rates of garden variety high bandwidth connections, it's going to be a very long time before FIOS is in a tipping point of American homes.

I don't think I'm failing to answer your point. You don't need widespread adoption of a technology before people start offering useful things for it. I have friends who don't subscribe to cable or satellite (the only ways to get TV around here), and who download the TV shows they want to watch either from a Torrent feed or iTunes, and they don't have FIOS. Both are usually much better quality than VHS.

I think people with current broadband bandwidths (1 Mb/sec) are catching the big companies' attention. The NBC-Apple split-up was one example of that.

I don't think Youtube can be ignored either. It may be crappy quality, but it's not very useful over 56K modems. Yet lots of media companies are paying a lot of attention to it, so they must think it's got an important audience.

The market is also changing --- the Internet-driven TV market's not necessarily going to look like the current TV market we have. Anyone relying on that is in for a big surprise. People are going to find new ways to use all this stuff.

Originally Posted by Artisan Fan

I like physical media since I enjoy having a library of titles for instant access whether they be DVDs, BluRays, or CD/SACDs.

Downloadable content can be even more instant, since it's on your computer ready to go already. No need to hunt around looking for a disk, assuming your computer is part of your home entertainment system.

--Andre

 

[Tokyo Slim]

Originally Posted by Andre Yew

Downloadable content can be even more instant, since it's on your computer ready to go already. No need to hunt around looking for a disk, assuming your computer is part of your home entertainment system.

--Andre

You are assuming that the downloadable movies of the future:

A: actually belong to you and you can use them however you want (I.E. not overloaded with DRM or are a temporary lease basis file)

B: exist as a complete file on your hard drive

All of which, in this day and age, seem like a stretch into "unreasonable expectation". Any distribution company willing to license movies for digital download or streaming are going to try to make DAMN sure you aren't just going to turn around and put them on torrent.

Either it will be a completely new compression format full of DRM, capable of playing only on specific hardware and/or software, or it will be an incomplete file that requires a minimal packet transfer w/ I.P. and hardware tracking.

Yes, it will only be a matter of time before the DRM, software, or whatever is hacked, but most people don't steal tv shows or movies off torrent sites either, so this isn't really a convenient solution for the masses.

Either way, the benefits of hard media still vastly outweigh downloadable content. I know, I do both with impunity. I'd rather have a hard copy of everything I steal, but my finances just won't allow it.

 

[A Y]

Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim

You are assuming that the downloadable movies of the future:

A: actually belong to you and you can use them however you want (I.E. not overloaded with DRM or are a temporary lease basis file)

B: exist as a complete file on your hard drive

That is true, but current content today is technically licensed to you as a user, so you don't actually own it, even if you own the physical media. With HDCP, your ability to play back hard media can be revoked as well, so hard media's no guarantee of playback.

For instant access, I was thinking/hoping that download movie software would be smart enough to cache stuff on your local machine. iTunes does let you keep the file, but of course, it's DRMed to your machine.

I haven't seen a lease or temporary model work well yet. I hope the movie industry doesn't go that way.

--Andre

 

[Artisan Fan]

Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim

You are assuming that the downloadable movies of the future:

A: actually belong to you and you can use them however you want (I.E. not overloaded with DRM or are a temporary lease basis file)

B: exist as a complete file on your hard drive

All of which, in this day and age, seem like a stretch into "unreasonable expectation". Any distribution company willing to license movies for digital download or streaming are going to try to make DAMN sure you aren't just going to turn around and put them on torrent.

Either it will be a completely new compression format full of DRM, capable of playing only on specific hardware and/or software, or it will be an incomplete file that requires a minimal packet transfer w/ I.P. and hardware tracking.

Yes, it will only be a matter of time before the DRM, software, or whatever is hacked, but most people don't steal tv shows or movies off torrent sites either, so this isn't really a convenient solution for the masses.

Either way, the benefits of hard media still vastly outweigh downloadable content. I know, I do both with impunity. I'd rather have a hard copy of everything I steal, but my finances just won't allow it.

These are good points. Based on prior experience, I would expect the entertainment biz will run roughshod over the customer in a fully shortsighted manner like they have done in music.

 

[Tokyo Slim]

Originally Posted by Andre Yew

That is true, but current content today is technically licensed to you as a user, so you don't actually own it, even if you own the physical media.

True, but in reality, nobody can really stop you from taking your HD-DVD/Blu-Ray/DVD/VHS/Laserdisk/Videodisk/filmstock to your buddy's house and playing it there, letting him borrow it, giving it to him for Christmas, or etc.

Things like this become problematic when you are talking about a downloaded file, which may not be complete, may be unburnable to disk, and may have already used the hardware profile of the computer you downloaded it on as an encryption algorithm that basically renders the file useless on any other computer.

That is what is going to keep people from adopting the format, and likely the one sticking point that the distro companies are going to INSIST upon as a condition of licensing their movies.

 

[Artisan Fan]

Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim

True, but in reality, nobody can really stop you from taking your HD-DVD/Blu-Ray/DVD/VHS/Laserdisk/Videodisk/filmstock to your buddy's house and playing it there, letting him borrow it, giving it to him for Christmas, or etc.

Things like this become problematic when you are talking about a downloaded file, which may not be complete, may be unburnable to disk, and may have already used the hardware profile of the computer you downloaded it on as an encryption algorithm that basically renders the file useless on any other computer.

That is what is going to keep people from adopting the format, and likely the one sticking point that the distro companies are going to INSIST upon as a condition of licensing their movies.


All good points. Downloadable movies may be around the corner (however not in 1080P) quality as several papers are reporting Apple will make a big announcement at the January MacWorld. Perhaps another example of iTunes making another major shift in the landscape. Convenience may also sadly trump quality again as AAC/eMPty3s have done.

 

[johnapril]

I see those cheap vinyl clad windows.

 

[eg1]

Originally Posted by johnapril

I see those cheap vinyl clad windows.

You like it, the painting and scraping?

 

[johnapril]

Originally Posted by eg1

You like it, the painting and scraping?

I finished my windows with clear coat varnish.

 

[Artisan Fan]

Originally Posted by johnapril

I see those cheap vinyl clad windows.

You would be wrong there sport. Wooden frames painted in gloss white.

 

[Bhowie]

Originally Posted by Artisan Fan

Sorry to disappoint you but its just a saddle holder. We have a dressage horse.

I hope the horse is used by your wife and daughter. (no letterman)

 

[Artisan Fan]

Originally Posted by Bhowie

I hope the horse is used by your wife and daughter. (no letterman)

My wife rides the horse twice or more a week. I don't have a daughter yet.