my first suit, w. photos; looking for constructive criticism

[MyOtherLife]

Ballet performer? or just passing wind?

As previously stated, that shirt collar is far too big on you. It is possible your frame/ build may not be easy to fit with OTR but there is still time to try. -If you can, exchange the shirt for one with some texture or subtle micro-pattern in it, or a shirt in cream. -A meduim burgundy tie will provide better contrast to the suit. -For your interview, have no pocket square, but if you must, an off-white linen one will do. (Show only a sliver of the pocket square above the breast pocket line.) -The suit, from what I can see, is perfectly fine for your interview. -What are your intended shoes?

 

[saiyar1]

Do you have a Zara or H&M in Canada? They usually cut their suits for slim guys. If you can, stop by and see how they fit. The length of sleeves and overall jacket looks good, but the jacket is a bit too generously cut in the chest area. The two places mentioned may have something better.

If not, this isn't too bad. It will definitely work fine for the interview.

Also, here's a crazy technique I've learned and perfected for my own use: Usually I target shrink shirts by placing the torso area under the armpits in boiling water and then drying them. I need to do this since I have very broad shoulders but a small waist. For you, I see it's large everywhere, including the neck. If you're up for it, take your cheapest shirt and submerge it is a large pot of boiling water. Allow it to "cook" for 10 minutes while stirring it occasionally. Remove it and immediately submerge it in very cold water. Then throw it in the dryer under High/Cotton/etc and allow it to fully dry. It will shrink about 1 full neck size, the sleeves will shrink from, for example, 34-35 to 32-33, and the torso will be narrower. It might be especially good for you since I've never even seen sizes smaller than 14.5 neck.

 

[Gent]

Originally Posted by reidrothchild

I don't know, man. Those sleeves look a tad short to me. I've always heard they should come down to your wrist bone. OP's sleeves do not appear to meet his wrist bone.

It's quite impossible to tell from those pics. I was just guesstimating. The shirt is clearly too long and blocks the view.

The shirt should reach to where the thumb meets the wrist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:FPL.png

There you see where the thumb actually starts, so to speak. Right before that point, in the wrist, you see the slight indentation or thinner part. That is where your shirt should fall and end. It's not an exact science, though. Everyone's hands are a bit different. However, when I say "end", I do mean "end". Often I see shirts that sort of lean on the thumb in the correct position, while falling over the back of the hand on the opposing side. This is because they are too long and have too big cuffs. It always looks quite bad. The shirt should form a rather perpendicular line to the arm, and too long sleeves worn this way cause a messy look with their diagonal lines.

In a way, the length of the suit sleeve is measured just in proportion to the shirt sleeve. It is meant to be about 1 cm (whatever that is in inches) shorter than the shirt.

So, without a properly fitting shirt (or a naked wrist) it's quite impossible to say for sure.


Sleeve length: serious business.

 

[processing]

A general comment before I reply to everyone individually: Based on all the comments so far, I've come to the conclusion that my entire ensemble (minus, perhaps, the coat) is too large for me. I'm glad to have found that out here, before walking around on the street, or into an interviewing room. Thank you all for your input, it's been very educational so far. Armed with all the tips and knowledge accumulated from this thread and other parts of the forum, as well the advice offered up by a few other parties via PMs, I will be sure to do better the next time around. Thank you! @JohnyJohn: You are correct, the trousers are too large. I will see what the tailor says, but I'm going to look at other suits as well. Regarding the sleeves, I now think that my (white) shirt sleeves were too long, creating the illusion that the jacket sleeves were too short. But yes, there's definitely an incongruity there. @cdcd: Will do. @Franky: Interesting. You're the only poster with a positive comment so far. I would love to hear the rationale (unless it was meant to be sarcastic). @PaoloM: I will follow your advice regarding pecuniary matters; next time I'm shopping, I will be more conscious of fit and style, and less conscious of price tags. I think part of the reason why I was so frugal the first time around is because I was utterly clueless about the former. I will also have to add the double-four-in-hand knot to my repertoire; but would such a big prominent tie knot go with my beanpole physique? Conservative symmetry seemed like the safest approach, considering my sartorial ignorance, but I could be wrong, as I'm a complete novice. @Last Year's Man: Thanks for the clarification and expansion of the term. I will aim for a 1" break. I tried the jacket again with your Esquire checklist at hand. #1: My shoulder pads end just slightly past the shoulders; if that was the only problem, I think it would be fine--so a reluctant check here. #2: This seems to be the biggie; I can easily fit in both fists under the lapels, and the suit still barely pulls at the button. It seems I need a much tighter suit jacket. I don't know if a tailor can fix the current one to fit me. #3: The top button of the suit does not fall below the navel--check. #4: The knuckles are even with the bottom of the jacket--check. #5: The jacket sleeves fall where the base of thumb meets the wrist--check. #6: I need to purchase a new shirt, but I will keep in mind that the cuffs should fall between one quarter to one half inch below the jacket sleeve. #7: The pants obviously have much more than one inch of break, and they may also be too wide. @dapperheistman: Will do.

@reidrothchild: Thanks for the detailed analysis. Yes, the soles of the shoes are rather thick. I might have to think about purchasing new shoes as well then, though I will make that my last priority, since I still haven't got the suit down. You are correct in regards to my prior habiliment. Most of the clothes I own are of a relaxed fit, and somewhat baggy, which is probably why I didn't spot how bad a fit the suit was on the first few tries. I've also never worn a tie in my life, except bowties on a few occasions during my childhood, and consequently I've never had to button the collar of the few (way too large, in retrospective) button-up shirts that I own. I believe you're right about the roominess of the pants. The jacket seems okay around the shoulder; perhaps a tiny bit too large. What you said about the roominess of the chest and waist, however, seems spot on, now that I've done some further research and looked at some of the pictures around this forum. I will definitely try on some other suits. @ALFAMALE: I will add further weight to the collar comments as a result of your input. Thanks. @Gent: I believe you are correct regarding the sleeves, both on the suit and on the shirt. Regarding the cuff of the shirt, it might just be too large for me, just like the collar. @Duff_Man: Your advice regarding shirts seems entirely spot on. I've always prioritized quality over quantity anyhow. I will add justwhiteshirts.com to my list of stores to check out when I hunt for a new shirt. @pvrhye: I guess I need to practice tying knots. I'll also keep an eye out for wider ties next time I'm out shopping. @Man Of Lint: Heh, I'm not entirely sure how that pose came about. Some questions regarding your advice: I thought the light-blue shirt colour was a good choice because of the tiny blue pinstripes on the suit (which may not be visible in that particular photo). Was I wrong? Also, I won't be wearing anything else burgundy; wouldn't the tie look out of place, especially on a cream colored shirt? I've read everywhere that the tie is supposed to match the shirt. Intended shoes can be seen here, though I've been advised to look for something with thinner soles. @saiyar1: We have both H&M and Zara. I hadn't thought of looking there, as I'm not familiar with those two stores. I will check them out next time very soon. Thanks! I may also try your shrinking technique, if I can't manage to find a better fitting shirt.

 

[saiyar1]

You'll be much happier with the slimness of Zara or H&M, trust me.

I think you should wear a solid white shirt, not cream, if possible. The cream isn't necessarily bad, but if it's not close enough to white, some may find it non-standard, and penalize you. I, and many others, wouldn't care, but who knows who you interview with.

It's probably a nice touch if there are faint blue pinstripes and the shirt is a shade of blue too. White shirt is more safe, but very light/pale blue is perfectly fine. The burgundy tie is perfect. I think you may be over thinking the need to match... at least when it comes to the thought that color needs to be found throughout your outfit in order to "match". The only rule here is belt and shoes need to be the same color leather. Shades of the same color in the pocket square and tie also look nice (never exact though), but don't wear a pocket square for an interview.

More streamline soled shoes would be better. I think since your very thin, once you get a slim suit, the shoes may look too clunky, but who knows. Wear them to the store when you try on the suit at H&M and Zara.

 

[Gibonius]

What's your height/weight, just for my edification? 14.5" neck is already extremely thin, I have a hard time envisioning an adult needing a significantly smaller collar.

 

[pvrhye]

By the way, do I see stripes on that suit. Thin as you are, if you're especially tall you may find your self in Jack Skellington territory if you aren't careful.

 

[suited]

Originally Posted by saiyar1

Do you have a Zara or H&M in Canada? They usually cut their suits for slim guys. If you can, stop by and see how they fit. The length of sleeves and overall jacket looks good, but the jacket is a bit too generously cut in the chest area. The two places mentioned may have something better.

If not, this isn't too bad. It will definitely work fine for the interview.

Also, here's a crazy technique I've learned and perfected for my own use: Usually I target shrink shirts by placing the torso area under the armpits in boiling water and then drying them. I need to do this since I have very broad shoulders but a small waist. For you, I see it's large everywhere, including the neck. If you're up for it, take your cheapest shirt and submerge it is a large pot of boiling water. Allow it to "cook" for 10 minutes while stirring it occasionally. Remove it and immediately submerge it in very cold water. Then throw it in the dryer under High/Cotton/etc and allow it to fully dry. It will shrink about 1 full neck size, the sleeves will shrink from, for example, 34-35 to 32-33, and the torso will be narrower. It might be especially good for you since I've never even seen sizes smaller than 14.5 neck.

If you've come to the point that you're boiling your shirts on the stove I think it's time to bust out that receipt and go ahead and make that exchange for a better size.

To the OP, get some different shoes. They don't need to be expensive, but get something that looks more professional. I also agree with the other comments about the shirt/suit.

 

[emptym]

I think the suit looks good, particularly for the money. It's a nice, conservative fit, perfect for interviews. I would just get the pants tapered a bit and hemmed.

The shirt sleeves could be a little shorter, or the shirt cuffs could be tightened. You could do this by buttoning the inner button if it has two, or moving the button inward (cut the thread, reposition the button, sew the button in new location). The shirt shouldn't cover your hand at all. And it should stick out past your jacket sleeve by 1/8 to 1/2 inch. I'd give the boiling trick a try, but it will shrink the shirt in length more than in width. If you want a different shirt, try thrift stores. You'll find plenty of decent choices for very cheap.

The tie is fine. And a single four-in-hand is fine too.

For shoes, I suggest trying for a new pair of Aldens, Allen Edmonds, Alfred Sargents, etc., on B&S here or on eBay for under $120. Or, you could go w/ a used pair for under $50. Make sure you get the right size. It should be snug -- tighter than you're used to but not painful. If you don't find anything before the interview, the ones you have are fine.

You're wise not to spend a lot of money when you don't have a lot of knowledge. The vast majority of people will think you look great in the outfit as is. Take your time and spend your money well. Don't take the opinions of every member here with equal weight. Thrift stores should be your friends while you're experimenting.

Good luck with the interview and welcome to the forum.

 

[saiyar1]

Originally Posted by suited

If you've come to the point that you're boiling your shirts on the stove I think it's time to bust out that receipt and go ahead and make that exchange for a better size.
Normally agreed, but I've never seen a shirt smaller than 14.5". Well, I recently have now that I'm on Style Forum, but they are often expensive, Italian made or designed shirts out of this guy's price range. He could get them tailored, but for the money he pays for a shirt, the tapering of waist and arms would cost more than the shirt itself! Plus, no big harm done (at least financially) in experimenting on his cheapest shirt as I suggested. Gotta get creative...

 

[CYstyle]

everything is too big. need to size down.

need a proper pair of dress shoes.

4 button jacket is hideous

 

[emptym]

^The jacket is two button. His overcoat has four. Again, everything except the pant legs (width and length of lower leg) and shirt sleeve length are fine. Actually, from the pic w/o the jacket we can see that the sleeve length is fine, but the cuff needs to be tightened. This is another common problem w/ RTW along with loose arm holes. People think loose is more comfortable. But a snug sleeve cuff -- as long as the sleeve is long enough -- will keep your sleeve in place no matter how you move your arms. So when your arms are at your side, you should see a little cuff, but when your arms are raised, your jacket's sleeves will raise and your arm sleeve will stay at your wrist, resulting in more sleeve to be shown. And no, you don't need to size down in other things as others have said, unless you're interviewing for a fashion job. If you haven't taken a look at Manton's conservative business dress or his Blazersuit threads, you should. Finally, the tie knot you had with the blue shirt is perfect. A common mistake among people who are beginning to care about clothes is to try to distinguish themselves from others by a fat knot. More advanced dressers tend to favor the basic four in hand and consider other knots to be trying too hard. Edit, ps, don't forget to take off the labels if you keep the suit and overcoat, including the ones on the sleeves.

 

[ktrp]

I doubt boys clothes fit because of height, but if boys clothes fit ... rejoice.

You'll pay 40% less for the same quality just because they price kids clothes cheaper.

 

[SkinnyGoomba]

The smallest mens shirt size readily available is 14.5". Alot of department stores wont carry them, but they should be able to order one for you. I made the mistake of sizing up for a little while and while a 15" collar is passable on me one it's shrunk down I found that it did not look nearly as nice as a 14.5.

This will probably be the case for you as well, I can't tell you your collar size over the net but I'm going to go out on a limb and say you're probably wearing a collar 1 to 1.5" too big.