Do Hand Welted sole shoes need special skill to Resole than GoodYear Welted sole ?

[mottykytu]

I know handwelted sole feel better and have ( in theory ) many more times to reslove compare to a GY.

But do not know if resole for handwelted shoes need special skill than GY welted ? And can be done by 3rd party ?

Since if I buy a Vass handwelted sole and don't live in Budapest, can shoesmaker in US or UK resole it and do is cost much more than GY welted resole ?

 

[mottykytu]

Ulpp

 

[Son Of Saphir]

I know handwelted sole feel better and have ( in theory ) many more times to reslove compare to a GY.

But do not know if resole for handwelted shoes need special skill than GY welted ? And can be done by 3rd party ?

Since if I buy a Vass handwelted sole and don't live in Budapest, can shoesmaker in US or UK resole it and do is cost much more than GY welted resole ?

If you own a Vass then avoid having a cobbler resole it with a machine.
Vass has hand stitched sole which is very different from a machine stitched sole.
Send it back to Vass to retain the benefits of the handmade shoe and have them resole it on their proper lasts.
Hungarian costs are lower so it should not cost too much.

 

[mottykytu]

If you own a Vass then avoid having a cobbler resole it with a machine.
Vass has hand stitched sole which is very different from a machine stitched sole.
Send it back to Vass to retain the benefits of the handmade shoe and have them resole it on their proper lasts.
Hungarian costs are lower so it should not cost too much.

Yah , I know it is an option, but the wait time is very very long !

 

[JohnMRobie]

I know handwelted sole feel better and have ( in theory ) many more times to reslove compare to a GY.

But do not know if resole for handwelted shoes need special skill than GY welted ? And can be done by 3rd party ?

Since if I buy a Vass handwelted sole and don't live in Budapest, can shoesmaker in US or UK resole it and do is cost much more than GY welted resole ?

No special skills to do a resole. Finding a cobbler who can do it to the original specifications is another question though. There are a few in the US who can do a hand sewn sole. Especially for Vass that have a relatively low SPI compared to a lot of other higher end handmade makers doing outsoles by hand.

 

[JFWR]

I know handwelted sole feel better and have ( in theory ) many more times to reslove compare to a GY.

But do not know if resole for handwelted shoes need special skill than GY welted ? And can be done by 3rd party ?

Since if I buy a Vass handwelted sole and don't live in Budapest, can shoesmaker in US or UK resole it and do is cost much more than GY welted resole ?

Unlike GYW which uses a machine, hand welting...is done by hand, so if you want it done right, it might be worth it to foot the bill (and wait the time) and let the original maker do it.

With GYW stuff, I think "return to manufacturer" is mostly just BS and a way for some companies *cough* Edward Green *cough* to fleece people for money when a competent (emphasis on competent) cobbler can do the same thing locally.

But for HW? Let the Hungarians handle your Vass, friend.

 

[paxonus]

Depending on who does the resole, you can actually damage the shoe if it isn't done properly. The trick is that when a full resole is done and the welt strip is replaced, the same holes in the upper need to be used when attaching the welt strip. The best way to ensure this is done is to do it by hand.

 

[Son Of Saphir]

The other issue is how a resole changes the shape of a shoe when it is not resoled on the original last.
Dominic Casey refused to resole one of my shoes for this very reason.
Better to wait for the original maker to do it and have it done properly on the right last.

 

[TheSuitBurnsBetter]

@jssdc had his Vass shoes resoled by a cobbler in the DC area named Aram who does hand sewing at a very reasonable price.

 

[Anachronist]

Personally, I think it is entirely a question of the price you are willing to pay and the degree of perfection you expect, meaning how close should the shoes look like they did when new. The original makers are, if they offer the service at all (shame on brands like Carmina that don’t), those who do the best job. I have experience with Crockett & Jones and Edward Green who send you the shoes back in near new condition (assuming they haven’t been worn out completely and always kept with shoe trees). Yes, they are expensive, but they are unsurpassed. I would always go this route with top end shoes.

On the other hand, if you just want a resolve with a good leather sole for a pair of less expensive shoes or ones that have seen a good amount of wear, a good cobbler will do a sufficient job for around 100€ over here in Germany (a third of the price that makers will charge and only a third as good). No the GY machine won’t sew into the same holes, but even if you did this re-soling twice (which means the shoes are then over 20 years old given decent rotation and not wearing them every day), this will not have any impact. They won’t fall apart.

Just my five cents

 

[Tried and True]

As Son of Saphir mentioned, resoling the shoe on its original last is paramount to returning the shoe to its original fit. Any deviation from a factory resole is hit or miss, mostly miss. I know this through personal experience.

 

[TimothyF]

Depending on who does the resole, you can actually damage the shoe if it isn't done properly. The trick is that when a full resole is done and the welt strip is replaced, the same holes in the upper need to be used when attaching the welt strip. The best way to ensure this is done is to do it by hand.

Unless the welt is damaged somehow, I don't see why it needs to be replaced upon resole. I thought the whole point of having a welted construction is so that the resole can be done without the original shoemaker's last.

No question if the cobbler available to you sews at a lower quality than the original maker, and you require the resole to be more-or-less a restoration of the shoe to its original delivered state. But that should not be a matter of welts and lasts

 

[Enfusia]

Yes, the wait time is long and costs are higher. But, there are no cobblers that just do Goodyear welting that you could trust with your hand welted.

You were speaking of Vass. There is not going to be anything close to sending them back to them for a resole.

It is the same with Patek Philippe. Nothing compares to their refurbishment of their own product.

 

[JohnMRobie]

People seem to be confusing hand welting with outsoles/resoling. Because the vast majority of RTW or MTO hand welted shoes have soles sewn on by machine with a curved needle machine it’s the same machine that sews an outsole onto a Goodyear welted shoe. They’re not sewn on by hand. Theres no special skill or special machinery needed compared to a GYW resole. There also shouldn’t be a need to replace the welt simply to sew a new sole onto the welt. And there’s less need for the original last because the structure of the welt being sewn to the insole provides more stability and a lower likelihood to slip/warp than gemming.

There are some brands sewn on by hand which makes it more complicated *if* you want them resoled by hand but honestly Vass hand stitch density is comparable to most entry-ish level GYW. ACME, Yearn and the top tier of Bemer come to mind for hand sewn outsoles. Most other stuff though is machine outsoles.

 

[mottykytu]

People seem to be confusing hand welting with outsoles/resoling. Because the vast majority of RTW or MTO hand welted shoes have soles sewn on by machine with a curved needle machine it’s the same machine that sews an outsole onto a Goodyear welted shoe. They’re not sewn on by hand. Theres no special skill or special machinery needed compared to a GYW resole. There also shouldn’t be a need to replace the welt simply to sew a new sole onto the welt. And there’s less need for the original last because the structure of the welt being sewn to the insole provides more stability and a lower likelihood to slip/warp than gemming.

There are some brands sewn on by hand which makes it more complicated *if* you want them resoled by hand but honestly Vass hand stitch density is comparable to most entry-ish level GYW. ACME, Yearn and the top tier of Bemer come to mind for hand sewn outsoles. Most other stuff though is machine outsoles.

Thanks, but Are you 100% sure about that ? Since John Lobb England 9 saint James claim that bespoke/hand welted shoes should be resole by hand and on the same last otherwise will damge the shoes?

Are they trying to charge customer more after service money ? Or because the outsole construction of handwelted bespoke is different from handwelted RTW ?

P/s: I attach a screenshot from John Lobb England website