Authenticity

[Steve Smith]

Type 1: Stolen valor. The wearing of insignia of some association (regimental, masonic, philanthropic, etc.) which one does not have the “right” to wear, as determined by that association. Alternatively, consciously purchasing "fakes".

'Stolen valor' is a grossly overused term, and I disagree with the use of the term for the types of examples mentioned above. If someone is somehow representing that he is a recipient of an award which is received for heroism, then I get it. If you are fasely claiming to have received a Navy Cross or a Congressional Medal of Honor then that is stolen valor.

Beyond that, people need to lighten up. A kid wearing a few camouflage uniform items is not necessarily claiming to be a veteran or military hero. He probably just thinks the stuff is cool. I know that if a kid is wearing an old-style flight jacket with a B-25 patch on it he is not claiming to have flown on Doolittle's raid. Someone can wear a Marine Corps Emblem t shirt without being a Marine, just like you can wear a New England Patriots shirt without having played for the team.

Wrongful appropriation, but not 'stolen valor' because IMO there is no valor implied, is when you are wearing full uniforms. Or if you are wearing something which expresses or implies rank, example: a military issue flight jacket with a name/rank patch and/or a squadron patch. Even in these two examples I see it as just being goofy or in poor taste and I'm certainly not interested in calling anyone out about it.

And while we're at it, let's get over this dumbass practice of calling every run of the mill veteran, cop or firefighter a hero.

 

[thatboyo]

And while we're at it, let's get over this dumbass practice of calling every run of the mill veteran, cop or firefighter a hero.

thank you for your service

 

[efta]

thank you for your service

thank you for your cervix

 

[upsett1_spaghett1]

thank you for your cervix

Well folks this thread has officially arrived here.

 

[cb200]

A bit of a lateral jump on the topic of authenticity out of the more political aspects. Read a nice piece of writing in the New Yorker that spoke to moving on and giving up things that no longer represented who you are... or thought you'd be in life.

How to Practice

I wanted to get rid of my possessions, because possessions stood between me and death.

www.newyorker.com

 

[pasadena man]

'Stolen valor' is a grossly overused term, and I disagree with the use of the term for the types of examples mentioned above. If someone is somehow representing that he is a recipient of an award which is received for heroism, then I get it. If you are fasely claiming to have received a Navy Cross or a Congressional Medal of Honor then that is stolen valor.

Beyond that, people need to lighten up. A kid wearing a few camouflage uniform items is not necessarily claiming to be a veteran or military hero. He probably just thinks the stuff is cool. I know that if a kid is wearing an old-style flight jacket with a B-25 patch on it he is not claiming to have flown on Doolittle's raid. Someone can wear a Marine Corps Emblem t shirt without being a Marine, just like you can wear a New England Patriots shirt without having played for the team.

Wrongful appropriation, but not 'stolen valor' because IMO there is no valor implied, is when you are wearing full uniforms. Or if you are wearing something which expresses or implies rank, example: a military issue flight jacket with a name/rank patch and/or a squadron patch. Even in these two examples I see it as just being goofy or in poor taste and I'm certainly not interested in calling anyone out about it.

And while we're at it, let's get over this dumbass practice of calling every run of the mill veteran, cop or firefighter a hero.

A personal anecdote: I was in college during the Vietnam War, and had a surplus M-65 jacket then, as many students did. I liked it a lot, it was comfortable, versatile, functional, etc.

I still like the style, but would not consider wearing one now, because of the connotations for my generation, that is, of military service. Conversely, for someone in their 20's & 30's, who was too young to wear it when it was in active service use, I wouldn't think twice about seeing them in one. And I know that the "authentic" M- 65 has become a bit of a slightly sub rosa timeless choice for some.

 

[smittycl]

A personal anecdote: I was in college during the Vietnam War, and had a surplus M-65 jacket then, as many students did. I liked it a lot, it was comfortable, versatile, functional, etc.

I still like the style, but would not consider wearing one now, because of the connotations for my generation, that is, of military service. Conversely, for someone in their 20's & 30's, who was too young to wear it when it was in active service use, I wouldn't think twice about seeing them in one. And I know that the "authentic" M- 65 has become a bit of a slightly sub rosa timeless choice for some.

The M-65 has morphed into a commonly used item now like the WWI trench coat, WWII leather bomber jacket, Navy pea coat, and such. All considered classics I think. I usually stay away from military-looking garb since I retired but even I have a field jacket in green linen from PVT White VC. I just stay away from camouflage patterns and any modern stuff.

 

[upsett1_spaghett1]

A bit of a lateral jump on the topic of authenticity out of the more political aspects. Read a nice piece of writing in the New Yorker that spoke to moving on and giving up things that no longer represented who you are... or thought you'd be in life.

How to Practice

I wanted to get rid of my possessions, because possessions stood between me and death.

www.newyorker.com

I tend to be one of those "try everything" folks in life and that carries over to my wardrobe. I like to experiment, and so my closet is often getting full as hell, but one of the great things of 2020 is I could do so without much input from other folks, really figure out what I really love and actually sticks. Part of the process has been selling or donating the stuff I don't use much. Except for some pieces that are truly special I've adopted a "if you don't wear this more than 5x a year chuck it" rule with my wardrobe.

I just stay away from camouflage patterns and any modern stuff.

I have seen a lot of cool outfits with camouflage, but when I tried it personally it just didn't feel right, so same. That being said, military style bombers and trenches are great for just about anyone. The M-65 I am not sure about. It seems to be a certain kinda person who pulls it off.

I still like the style, but would not consider wearing one now, because of the connotations for my generation, that is, of military service. Conversely, for someone in their 20's & 30's, who was too young to wear it when it was in active service use, I wouldn't think twice about seeing them in one. And I know that the "authentic" M- 65 has become a bit of a slightly sub rosa timeless choice for some.

I think this sort of personal acknowledgment is what OP was attempting to engender on this thread.

 

[pasadena man]

The M-65 has morphed into a commonly used item now like the WWI trench coat, WWII leather bomber jacket, Navy pea coat, and such. All considered classics I think. I usually stay away from military-looking garb since I retired but even I have a field jacket in green linen from PVT White VC. I just stay away from camouflage patterns and any modern stuff.

That those items are now classics to many is without doubt. You bring up a good distinction though. My reaction is not to the M-65 design, but simply to the actual olive green mil spec M-65 that saw service.

I wouldn’t have the same response to reworks of the field jacket design, and I know that a lot of good firms have taken a crack at that.

It goes back to the earlier discussion in this thread with R. O. Thornhill on the risks of wearing British regimental repp ties in England ,when you didn’t serve with the unit in question.

Wearing a Burberry, I don’t expect someone to ask if I served in the trenches with the Coldstream Guards. I don’t want someone to ask if I served in the 101st Airborne though, because I had on an authentic M-65.