Why Lesser has some hegemony on Savile row ?

George · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by courty

I understand that so far as it goes. What I am trying to understand is what role "impurities" or other variable play in cloth performance and durability after weight, weave, tension, etc. are controlled for. Based upon the posts above, a Super 150's cloth would be more delicate than a Super 90's cloth even in the same weight, same weave, made on the same looms, set to the same tension, etc. Are the longer fibers weaker because they are thinner?
Firstly, he needs to define exactly what he means by "impurities" Finer fibres will be weaker in tension, but you would have to look at how the fabric failed. That is, did it fail due to being stretched at the stress points (your knees, elbows etc.) or has it failed due to abrasion (wearing out at the crotch for example) Both have different failure mechanisms. It's not easy.

epa · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by Mauro

I am not explaining myself well enough and my grammar and spelling sucks...lol ( not funny)

I am not saying 150's and higher aren't worth it. we have to look at this in scientific terms. The higher the micron count the more pure the fiber is. When impurities become so fine you gain a wonderful cloth but it becomes dainty. Walking and sitting take a toll on the cloth faster than something with a bonding agent like nylon, silk...etc or a cloth with a ower micron count.
weight has something to do with it but not like the purities or impurities of the yarns.
We should save weight for later conversation.
Does this make sense?

I don't get it. I thought that pure wool was pure wool, be it 100 or 150. I thought that the high number had something to do with the caliber, not with the composition. But now you are telling me that lower numbers include nylon and/or silk? I am confused.

lasbar · Mar 24, 2010

George;3080358 said:
Firstly, he needs to define exactly what he means by "impurities"

Finer fibres will be weaker in tension, but you would have to look at how the fabric failed. That is, did it fail due to being stretched at the stress points (your knees, elbows etc.) or has it failed due to abrasion (wearing out at the crotch for example) Both have different failure mechanisms. It's not easy.[/QUOTE

It is quite difficult to make an informed choice regarding fabrics .

That's the reason why experts and tailors posting here are great sources of information.

I tend to prefer super 100's or 120's at maximum..

Regarding flannel , we know that worsted is more solid than woolen..

Can you recommend some woolen flannel ?

epa · Mar 24, 2010

lasbar;3080368 said:
Originally Posted by George

Click to expand...

Firstly, he needs to define exactly what he means by "impurities"

Finer fibres will be weaker in tension, but you would have to look at how the fabric failed. That is, did it fail due to being stretched at the stress points (your knees, elbows etc.) or has it failed due to abrasion (wearing out at the crotch for example) Both have different failure mechanisms. It's not easy.[/QUOTE

It is quite difficult to make an informed choice regarding fabrics .

That's the reason why experts and tailors posting here are great sources of information.

I tend to prefer super 100's or 120's at maximum..

Regarding flannel , we know that worsted is more solid than woolen..

Can you recommend some woolen flannel ?

Don't get this either. I thought that flannel was almost the contrary to worsted, and that the two terms were at least are incompatible. Is there something like worsted flannel?

George · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by epa

Don't get this either. I thought that flannel was almost the contrary to worsted, and that the two terms were at least are incompatible. Is there something like worsted flannel?
There are two types of Flannel. a) Worsted Flannel which uses worsted yarns Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worsted b) Wollen Flannel which uses wollen yarns Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woolen There are worsted Flannels, you can always tell them by looking closely at the cloth as you'll see a subtle twill weave (diagonal ribs) under the cloth nap, which becomes more prominent with wear. Hope this helps

George · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by lasbar

Firstly, he needs to define exactly what he means by "impurities" It is quite difficult to make an informed choice regarding fabrics . That's the reason why experts and tailors posting here are great sources of information. I tend to prefer super 100's or 120's at maximum.. Regarding flannel , we know that worsted is more solid than woolen.. Can you recommend some woolen flannel ?
Minnis Flannel book.

voxsartoria · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by George

Minnis Flannel book.

Really great stuff.

- B

lasbar · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by George

Minnis Flannel book.

Manton agrees with you guys on that one..

George · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

Really great stuff. - B
They do worsted flannels as well. The last few in the Classic book are worsted flannels. I've got the Glen Plaid (0666).

lasbar · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by George

They do worsted flannels as well. The last few in the Classic book are worsted flannels. I've got the Glen Plaid (0666).

Great number...Love their woolen flannels like 0302/0308/0318/0321/0322..

And Smiths? I know about the fragility of the superb Fox flannels.

George · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by lasbar

Great number...Love their woolen flannels like 0302/0308/0318/0321/0322.. And Smiths? I know about the fragility of the superb Fox flannels.
I have a few from that book. The dark Blue Glen Plaid, The dark Brown glen plaid and a number of grey suits and odd trousers. I also have a suit length of one of the blues at the back of the book, ready to be made up when I find fetch it back. The two killer ones though, are the Brown chalkstripe and the Blue chalkstripe. In that order. I've never seen Smiths offerings

lasbar · Mar 24, 2010

Originally Posted by George

I have a few from that book. The dark Blue Glen Plaid, The dark Brown glen plaid and a number of grey suits and odd trousers. I also have a suit length of one of the blues at the back of the book, ready to be made up when I find fetch it back.

The two killer ones though, are the Brown chalkstripe and the Blue chalkstripe. In that order.

I've never seen Smiths offerings

Quite nice...I have a few solid 13oz wollen samples somewhere in my magic box...The rreference starts with a 2 and is 4 digits...
I still love the Fox ..Pity is so fragile.

Lowndes · Mar 24, 2010

I am about to place an order for Minnis 0301 and 0329 myself. Glad to hear Minnis gets such rave reviews.

apropos · Mar 25, 2010

Originally Posted by George

There are two types of Flannel.

a) Worsted Flannel which uses worsted yarns

Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worsted

b) Wollen Flannel which uses wollen yarns

Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woolen

There are worsted Flannels, you can always tell them by looking closely at the cloth as you'll see a subtle twill weave (diagonal ribs) under the cloth nap, which becomes more prominent with wear.

Hope this helps
Excellent post, and if I may clamber onto my soapbox - woolen yarns:

1. do not have their constituent fibres aligned in parallel, unlike worsteds
2. are usually spun less 'tightly' (lower 'twist') than worsteds
3. usually use fibres of greater variance in length than worsteds

So a worsted yarn will certainly have its constituent wool fibres more tightly packed (as they are parallel to each other) than a comparable woolen yarn, while a woolen yarn will have fibres of varying length in varying directions, which explains why they feel so much fuzzier (and all things being equal are less hardy) than a worsted yarn when woven into flannel.

Mauro · Mar 25, 2010

I just finished posting probably my longest post ever and my power went out! lost everything.

impurities can mean a lot of things. that's when microns and other agents come into play.
a longer fiber does equal a stronger yarn in the weaving process. I beleive that goes for almost everything i.e. denim, twill, worsted...
now technology has advanced and things are getting tricker.

I am visiting a mill and one of my factories so I will try to take picstures and ask more questions than my normal **** load. I will get them to explain it in a way I can type it out and have it make sense.

weight- different animal all together and has it's purpose.

I hope this helps a little better.

Why Lesser has some hegemony on Savile row ?

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