longtime lurker, first time poster i love the cut of vacca + other italian fitted pants (not too fitted, but you get the idea). shorter rise, slightly more fitted flat front pants are good. however, as an nyc commuter + father, i can't imagine the abuse most pants get worth the $500+ price tag. or $200+. what other brands at a more down to earth price tag can forum-ites recommend? seize sur vingt? kabay? is linus in soho any good? nyc preferred but online retail ok too. thanks.