The SF Martial Arts Thread

[Clouseau]

Is it just the angle, or are you really tall?

I am tall.
196cm…

 

[am55]

 

[double00]

@LA Guy and anyone else with significant experience rolling with others. I've always wondered about some of these tiny historical figures, that could easily manage much larger, experienced fighters with just good technique. The best example I can think of is Kyuzo Mifune. To what extent is he actually avoiding getting thrown around, as opposed to respectful students being careful around the 70+yo sensei of senseis? Unlike aikido promotional videos, I mean, demonstrations, it looks like some of the throws are pretty hard and not entirely expected.

I'm not familiar with the art obviously, but it is odd that modern (IJF) judo is dominated by these huge, strong judoka (Teddy Riner probably the best example, go France! but still). Is it a case of the opposition having become sufficiently technical? In the same way that women's MMA caught up with Ronda eventually.

fwiw my wife used to train (bjj) with cleber luciano who is a little guy and well competed

why would a throw be unexpected in judo ?

 

[LA Guy]

@LA Guy and anyone else with significant experience rolling with others. I've always wondered about some of these tiny historical figures, that could easily manage much larger, experienced fighters with just good technique. The best example I can think of is Kyuzo Mifune. To what extent is he actually avoiding getting thrown around, as opposed to respectful students being careful around the 70+yo sensei of senseis? Unlike aikido promotional videos, I mean, demonstrations, it looks like some of the throws are pretty hard and not entirely expected.

I'm not familiar with the art obviously, but it is odd that modern (IJF) judo is dominated by these huge, strong judoka (Teddy Riner probably the best example, go France! but still). Is it a case of the opposition having become sufficiently technical? In the same way that women's MMA caught up with Ronda eventually.

Size clearly matters. It takes a lot of technique to overcome a big size and strength differential. This matters in judo, jiujitsu, boxing, kickboxing, MMA, whatever, and why there are weight categories. It's also the reason that bigger guys nearly invariably win the absolutes. I mean, if you are 200 lbs, you might beat a 230 lber, but you just don't see 135 lbers winning against the big guys.

If you go to Youtube and look up Lucas Lepri and European championships (either 2018 or 2019) you will see how well the best smaller guy in the world did against giants of considerably lower skill. While he did not win, he had a great run in the absolutes against huge people, And he is not even that small. He is a lightweight, which is 168 lbs with the gi (which weighs 2-3 lbs for the lightweight competition gis). He lost his matches the second day because the first day took such a toll on his body. And he was not in any matches against guys anywhere near his skill level. Just for reference, he is one of the most technical, winningest, lightweights in the history of modern BJJ.

When you see old dudes throwing young, highly skilled, guys, it's because of respect. There is nothing to be gained from tossing around a 70 year old, smaller man. I've seen modern, competitive BJJ black belts roll lightly with the top guys in the older generation. They roll technically and lightly, and give up throws and submissions, just to keep things light and also, respectful.

I happen to suck at judo, so I'm sure that a good black belt judoika, considerably older and lighter than me, can absolutely murder me. My instructor, who is a two time Brazilian champion and Olympic alternate, plays with me on the feet like a white belt, which I am. The best that I can do is to do the "put your hips way back
and stiff arm and stall" that you sometimes see jiujitsu guys who are not great at throws do. Sometimes I'll try to close the distance with some mediocre wrestling, but it's super hard in a gi. Sometimes I'll attempt an arm or collar drag or snap down, and sometimes he lets me work a bit before dumping me on my back.

I'm shockingly mediocre in jiujitsu as a brown belt, and I regularly tool white and blue belts who are 20 years my junior and 40+ lbs + heavier than am I. But decent purple belts and other hobbyist brown belts who are considerably larger and younger? It's an uphill battle. By the same token, I usually roll light with female brown and even black belts, because even if they are the same size, I'm just that much stronger, and they are unlikely to be able to break down my posture. pass my guard, break my grips or frames, etc... if I just decide to go hard. I know good female purple belts who freely admit that a larger white belt can give them issues. Sex, size, strength, are very important factors.

Same with my kickboxing. I used to be very fast in and out, and I still have good strategy. I know how to use footwork to control the ring/cage and trap people so that I have more options. However, my knees are just not the way that they used to be, and my in and outs are just not as good. I can toy around with the heavyweights when we spar lightly, but even guys who are considerably less skilled and experienced than I am, if they are not complete noobs, and have a year or two of dligent training under their belts, they don't have to connect flush too many times for me to call the round, while they can absorb many more of my more precise, more powerful for my size, shots. But a dude who is 6'3" and 250 lbs? Yeah, he hits a lot harder than my 5'11", 185 lb frame.

 

[FlyingMonkey]

I think I mentioned earlier that I assisted coaching judo in a Japanese high school I taught in, and our judoka were very skillful, but all relatively small and/or skinny. They did fine in the weighted categories but got crushed (sometimes literally) by enormous kids in the open categories: skill rarely came into it when there were seriously uneven weight match-ups.

 

[am55]

WWII style. Thoughts on Applegate's book @LA Guy ?

 

[LA Guy]

View attachment 1765603

WWII style. Thoughts on Applegate's book @LA Guy ?

I’d say that stuff like this definitely works, but that the secret sauce is in the training. If you don’t train against a fully resisting opponent regularly, nothing is likely to work, regardless of the martial art. However, some martial arts are inherently less practical. This is practical but difficult to use in live, unchoreographed sparring, and thus would be inherently more difficult in a high stress situation. Your instincts aren’t going to kick in unless you’ve done the same thing, in a similar situation, thousands of times.

That dagger, on the other hand, is amazing.

 

[Clouseau]

Another picture of my last training in Japan a couple years ago.
Until the war it was frequent to see a Kendo bout transforming into Jujutsu, if one adversary lost his saber he would try to grab.
It has been forbidden after the war, but leg sweeps are still frequent in Police training or at certain university (Kokushikan for example).
Some old schools (ryuha) still maintain that practice too.

 

[Clouseau]

One example during a Japan Police competition



at least it’s one against one @LA Guy

 

[LA Guy]

One example during a Japan Police competition



at least it’s one against one @LA Guy

We always joke that tripping is plain rude. Fun though.

 

[LA Guy]

Do any of the rest of you suffer from joint pain? Every few months, I have to take a week or two break from weights, and have to decrease the number of pullups and pushups that I do because my elbows realy start to feel it.

This isn't from kcikboxng or BJJ, though I've had my knee stomped kicked out in competition (no fun, definitely not recommended) in an MMA match. I have also have had my right arm popped hard from arm bars and kimuras in competition enough times and that when I wake up, or am just not in constant motion, I can just throw my arm, and there will be a loud "pop pop" as everything goes back into place. During this times, I can still roll, though I won't do stand up and take downs, and I'll avoid guys who always want comp intensity level rolls, something I'm usually happy to do, and also, guys who are just much bigger (say, over 225 lbs - I'm 180-185), just because not matter your jiujitsu, size is size.

The joint pain is more like joint ache, but it definitely has become acute pain when I've just tried to push through. It is from strength and conditioning training, and I've had this issue since my 20s. Every so often, I've had to pause weights and dial down bodyweight exercises just to give my body a bit of time to stop aching.

I'd ask @razorfrazer to pop in with any ideas, except... do you even lift bro? Or do strength and conditioning? lol. I think that if you did, you'd go up 2 weight categories nearly immediately. That, or you'd get shredded and go down one. I'm mostly just messing with you.

 

[razorfrazer]

Do any of the rest of you suffer from joint pain? Every few months, I have to take a week or two break from weights, and have to decrease the number of pullups and pushups that I do because my elbows realy start to feel it.

This isn't from kcikboxng or BJJ, though I've had my knee stomped kicked out in competition (no fun, definitely not recommended) in an MMA match. I have also have had my right arm popped hard from arm bars and kimuras in competition enough times and that when I wake up, or am just not in constant motion, I can just throw my arm, and there will be a loud "pop pop" as everything goes back into place. During this times, I can still roll, though I won't do stand up and take downs, and I'll avoid guys who always want comp intensity level rolls, something I'm usually happy to do, and also, guys who are just much bigger (say, over 225 lbs - I'm 180-185), just because not matter your jiujitsu, size is size.

The joint pain is more like joint ache, but it definitely has become acute pain when I've just tried to push through. It is from strength and conditioning training, and I've had this issue since my 20s. Every so often, I've had to pause weights and dial down bodyweight exercises just to give my body a bit of time to stop aching.

I'd ask @razorfrazer to pop in with any ideas, except... do you even lift bro? Or do strength and conditioning? lol. I think that if you did, you'd go up 2 weight categories nearly immediately. That, or you'd get shredded and go down one. I'm mostly just messing with you.

I dont have the same level of joint pain at the moment although its getting worse. No i dont really lift just like KB’s once in a while. I do a lot of mobility work and running though. I had a buldged disx that was very painful though!

ill start postung more here I enjoy or talks! Competing this friday in a superfight ebi rules and lasy weekend i won a FUJI Open nogi.

some highlights!

Morgan Frazer on Instagram: "Irimi Ashi reap to double outside Ashi roll though. Outside Heel hook finish with false heel grip. @mtheorymartialarts @rebelbjjmn @fujibjj Oss! @blacklotusjj @shoyoroll #bjj #leglocks #brownbelt #brazilianjiujitsu #heel

163 likes, 7 comments - razorfrazerjjMay 2, 2022 on : "Irimi Ashi reap to double outside Ashi roll though. Outside Heel hook finish with false heel grip. @mtheorymartialarts @rebelbjjmn @fuji..."

www.instagram.com

Morgan Frazer on Instagram: "Entering into reverse Ashi Garami then finishing with a joint lock. Here I concentrated on knocking my opponent onto one hip using strong frames and off balanacing techniques. Landing on the trapped leg side made it easi

142 likes, 12 comments - razorfrazerjjMay 2, 2022 on : "Entering into reverse Ashi Garami then finishing with a joint lock. Here I concentrated on knocking my opponent onto one hip using stron..."

www.instagram.com

 

[razorfrazer]

You are totally right. In nogi i will sit back into leg entanglements too . False reap, kani basami or just step in 50/50

 

[Clouseau]

Do any of the rest of you suffer from joint pain? Every few months, I have to take a week or two break from weights, and have to decrease the number of pullups and pushups that I do because my elbows realy start to feel it.

This isn't from kcikboxng or BJJ, though I've had my knee stomped kicked out in competition (no fun, definitely not recommended) in an MMA match. I have also have had my right arm popped hard from arm bars and kimuras in competition enough times and that when I wake up, or am just not in constant motion, I can just throw my arm, and there will be a loud "pop pop" as everything goes back into place. During this times, I can still roll, though I won't do stand up and take downs, and I'll avoid guys who always want comp intensity level rolls, something I'm usually happy to do, and also, guys who are just much bigger (say, over 225 lbs - I'm 180-185), just because not matter your jiujitsu, size is size.

The joint pain is more like joint ache, but it definitely has become acute pain when I've just tried to push through. It is from strength and conditioning training, and I've had this issue since my 20s. Every so often, I've had to pause weights and dial down bodyweight exercises just to give my body a bit of time to stop aching.

I'd ask @razorfrazer to pop in with any ideas, except... do you even lift bro? Or do strength and conditioning? lol. I think that if you did, you'd go up 2 weight categories nearly immediately. That, or you'd get shredded and go down one. I'm mostly just messing with you.

I have a bad knee for years, i take once a year a Hyaluronic Acid injection, and it works pretty well to treat join pain without any secondary effects.

 

[LA Guy]

@razorfrazer - one of the best leg draggers in the game, and the details there and the level of control you can achieve from the grips and the friction, is one of th=e reasons that I love the gi.

That said, I've been working on my false reap entry from reverse DLR to get te inside sankaku position.