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The Quintessential Dress Shoe: Black Cap Toe Oxford

Duke Santos

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Really? No problem in the snow? The snow just makes them slip and slide a lot for me, but they do fine in the rain, and unless the floor is soaking wet, works there, too.

No. None at all on a snowy field. On sidewalks, I'm cautious that there's not ice underneath though. All said, I'll probably convert my Islay over to commando or ridgeway for next year. Also increasingly confident in my hypothesis that AE specifies a softer, more grippy rubber compound in the dainite they purchase.
 

JFWR

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No. None at all on a snowy field. On sidewalks, I'm cautious that there's not ice underneath though. All said, I'll probably convert my Islay over to commando or ridgeway for next year. Also increasingly confident in my hypothesis that AE specifies a softer, more grippy rubber compound in the dainite they purchase.

My c and j and ae dainite feel the same to me.

I try to avoid walking over snowy fields, but the slipping has been experienced on pavement for me.

Might have to do with gait?
 

Duke Santos

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My c and j and ae dainite feel the same to me.

I try to avoid walking over snowy fields, but the slipping has been experienced on pavement for me.

Might have to do with gait?
I'm in Chicago, so my snow experiences are on purely flat terrain, so take that into consideration.

I've also noticed that my knees do not like dainite. I had a bone marrow contusion in one before the pandemic, and dainite definitely seems to aggravate it.
 

tarunds

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Thank you so much for such an in depth response to the post.
How I can summarise is that beyond a certain point yu get marginal improvements so amongst these top end shoes the fit should carry the prinary value followed by the looks.

Also, EG chelsea seems to be a crowd favorite although an overkill for some if price is the only metric to gauge.

G&G: I have read in other threads in the forum that they might be the ones with most flair amongst the English shoes but over long term people tend to be more satisfied with C&J or EG. Do correct me if this is an incorrect understanding.

2 other shoes
one shoe I forgot to mention in this range is by Norman Vilalta if anyone has any experience, it would be great to hear.


2. John Lobb City II

Hence, I plan to visit Jermyn street and if C&J handgrade fits the bill (fit and looks) then I"ll prefer that over EG.
Is there any specific C&J model one can look at which is classic yet chic?
 
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JFWR

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I'm in Chicago, so my snow experiences are on purely flat terrain, so take that into consideration.

I've also noticed that my knees do not like dainite. I had a bone marrow contusion in one before the pandemic, and dainite definitely seems to aggravate it.

Down in Champaign, I also experience flat terrain snow and the snow feels slippy in ways that rain doesn't.

But yeah, if dainite just hurts your legs, definitely don't wear it. I prefer leather for the same reason: makes my feet feel better. But sometimes, I just adopt a more pragmatic approach because I don't have pain from dainite, I just prefer to have more pleasure from leather, but sometimes pleasure isn't the good I'm seeking, but durability and the unlikelihood of slipping and breaking ******.
 

JFWR

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Thank you so much for such an in depth response to the post.
How I can summarise is that beyond a certain point yu get marginal improvements so amongst these top end shoes the fit should carry the prinary value followed by the looks.

Also, EG chelsea seems to be a crowd favorite although an overkill for some if price is the only metric to gauge.

G&G: I have read in other threads in the forum that they might be the ones with most flair amongst the English shoes but over long term people tend to be more satisfied with C&J or EG. Do correct me if this is an incorrect understanding.

2 other shoes
one shoe I forgot to mention in this range is by Norman Vilalta if anyone has any experience, it would be great to hear.


2. John Lobb City II

Hence, I plan to visit Jermyn street and if C&J handgrade fits the bill (fit and looks) then I"ll prefer that over EG.
Is there any specific C&J model one can look at which is classic yet chic?

If you were to exclusively ask me which I think is the most elegant, I'd probably go with the EG. EG Chelseas are really beautiful cap toed oxfords.

But then again, the difference here is relatively small. Like the difference between a lower-end, but good quality shoe like an Allen Edmonds and an Edward Green is going to be a lot smaller, because it is based on fineness and elegance and the touches of finishing primarily, than say, Allen Edmonds and contemporary Johnston and Murphy which are made of garbage and look like garbage and are garbage.

Ultimately, I'd say you can't go wrong with any of these good shoes.

Judge them by:

1. Fit.
2. Aesthetics.

In that order.

You probably can't go wrong going this way.
 

brax

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Thank you so much for such an in depth response to the post.
How I can summarise is that beyond a certain point yu get marginal improvements so amongst these top end shoes the fit should carry the prinary value followed by the looks.

Also, EG chelsea seems to be a crowd favorite although an overkill for some if price is the only metric to gauge.

G&G: I have read in other threads in the forum that they might be the ones with most flair amongst the English shoes but over long term people tend to be more satisfied with C&J or EG. Do correct me if this is an incorrect understanding.

2 other shoes
one shoe I forgot to mention in this range is by Norman Vilalta if anyone has any experience, it would be great to hear.


2. John Lobb City II

Hence, I plan to visit Jermyn street and if C&J handgrade fits the bill (fit and looks) then I"ll prefer that over EG.
Is there any specific C&J model one can look at which is classic yet chic?
I started with British brands like G&G, EG, and JLP (is JLP still British with French ownership?). I liked them and still use them frequently.

But I moved to Italian (Paolo Scafora and Stefano Bemer) and Spanish-Argentine (Norman Vilalta). I recently took delivery of SB black captoes and NV dark brown capotes. They are really a step or two better than the British.

N.B. NV and SB make shoes at different quality levels. I am speaking of their bespoke quality (absent personal last) level.
 

JohnMRobie

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Thank you so much for such an in depth response to the post.
How I can summarise is that beyond a certain point yu get marginal improvements so amongst these top end shoes the fit should carry the prinary value followed by the looks.

Also, EG chelsea seems to be a crowd favorite although an overkill for some if price is the only metric to gauge.

G&G: I have read in other threads in the forum that they might be the ones with most flair amongst the English shoes but over long term people tend to be more satisfied with C&J or EG. Do correct me if this is an incorrect understanding.

2 other shoes
one shoe I forgot to mention in this range is by Norman Vilalta if anyone has any experience, it would be great to hear.


2. John Lobb City II

Hence, I plan to visit Jermyn street and if C&J handgrade fits the bill (fit and looks) then I"ll prefer that over EG.
Is there any specific C&J model one can look at which is classic yet chic?
The EG chelsea is just very classic and well done. It’s easy to pair with a wide variety of styles of suit.

I’d disagree with the take on being less satisfied with the G&G over time. The biggest hang up I’ve seen is that their stuff tends to be relatively narrow so if it doesn’t fit your foot when you try it, it probably won’t fit your foot when you wear it. Longevity-wise they’re on par with anything else on your list.

Lobb City II is fine to include in the mix and worth trying on.

NV I think is a little more experimental/modern most of the time. Their shoes are fairly sleek and I think require a certain type of tailoring to really pull off. They work best, IMO, if your tailor is Italian or named Michael Browne.

Re: Handgrade - There are two plain cap toes they have in the collection. One is a modern almond, one is a soft square/more chiseled. The 337 and 373 lasts if I recall. I’d try both on and compare the fits and then pick which one you like the look of.
 

brax

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The EG chelsea is just very classic and well done. It’s easy to pair with a wide variety of styles of suit.

I’d disagree with the take on being less satisfied with the G&G over time. The biggest hang up I’ve seen is that their stuff tends to be relatively narrow so if it doesn’t fit your foot when you try it, it probably won’t fit your foot when you wear it. Longevity-wise they’re on par with anything else on your list.

Lobb City II is fine to include in the mix and worth trying on.

NV I think is a little more experimental/modern most of the time. Their shoes are fairly sleek and I think require a certain type of tailoring to really pull off. They work best, IMO, if your tailor is Italian or named Michael Browne.

Re: Handgrade - There are two plain cap toes they have in the collection. One is a modern almond, one is a soft square/more chiseled. The 337 and 373 lasts if I recall. I’d try both on and compare the fits and then pick which one you like the look of.
NV has his roots in bespoke thus some of his work is modern by client demand. But check out how soporific (in the old SF sense) these captoes are. But they are executed perfectly. These work great with any conservative business suit (British or Italian).
E26D5CA2-966F-4F9A-8DDD-A33CDBE3AD41.jpeg

25B44430-5A33-4AE3-8380-C9CF77A521A2.jpeg
 
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jonathanS

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jonathanS

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I started with British brands like G&G, EG, and JLP (is JLP still British with French ownership?). I liked them and still use them frequently.

But I moved to Italian (Paolo Scafora and Stefano Bemer) and Spanish-Argentine (Norman Vilalta). I recently took delivery of SB black captoes and NV dark brown capotes. They are really a step or two better than the British.

N.B. NV and SB make shoes at different quality levels. I am speaking of their bespoke quality (absent personal last) level.
Norman vilalta was trained at stefano bemer, if I recall correctly. Again, I could be totally off. I really like some of his stuff & have considered making the plunge, but with a shoe closet that is full, including a black whole cut from foster & sons in their short lived high end rtw that are still unworn, I can’t justify anymore shoe expenditures.
 

brax

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How much are those Stefano bemers? I think that’s their top line which starts at 2k. But I could be totally off. They’re handwelted and great shoes, but I have a hard time beyond 2k unless it’s bespoke.
Correct. I have a second pair on order and they were a touch over USD$2000. Prices can change with the USD-Euro exchange.

The NV are a bit more.
 

brax

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Norman vilalta was trained at stefano bemer, if I recall correctly. Again, I could be totally off. I really like some of his stuff & have considered making the plunge, but with a shoe closet that is full, including a black whole cut from foster & sons in their short lived high end rtw that are still unworn, I can’t justify anymore shoe expenditures.
You are correct. NV trained under SB so there is some obvious similarity.

I‘m going to clear out some business shoes soon. Although I granted myself a very generous allotment, I’m going to get down to sixteen pairs. They will be divided into six captoe and six wingtip (two each in black, dark brown, and medium brown); then I get four wildcards like my Vass dark plumb museum and Vass medium brown floating medallion and a couple of others.
 

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