Mad Men season 2 discussion

[Flambeur]

Originally Posted by Flambeur

I am really really waiting for the return of a badass don draper.. I am hoping that he is going to come back as a force to be reckoned with, perhaps throwing the merger talks upside down, grabbing for power, etc... We'll see...
Well well well Guess I called it.. Great finale. I love the storyline with Betty, very interesting. I wonder how her relationship with don is going to progress. The reality of it is that nothing is going to get better unless she gets to meet Dick. The conference room was priceless. I was waiting for the contract showdown. Beautiful. My feeling is that Duck might get pushed out, put back in his place, or he might get to drink himself to death. Speaking of death, how about Pete and the rifle at the end? Interesting foreshadowing? In any way, Dan has leverage in form of money (enough to start his own agency) and reputation - he will definitely play a role in the direction of the agency. I doubt that he will leave to start his own for the sake of the show, so I am assuming Duck will leave or be forced to let Don do his thing. Anyway, what the hell am I supposed to watch now until the new season?

 

[Flambeur]

Originally Posted by Get Smart

that was a good finale. I'm glad they finally got Peggy and Peter on the same page about the existence of their lovechild

Betty has really gotten to be an interesting character over this season and her bathroom fling was hot


yes and yes

Betty is probably the most subtle and the most psychologically interesting character in the show.

 

[bcate3]

Just watched the finale. Struck the right notes of ambiguity and uncertainty explored through parallel storylines. Merger. Pregnancy. Cold War Standoff. Marital Reconciliation. Quitting a job? Breakup of an office romance. Disclosure of Paternity. Uncertainy over paternity? Bastards: Don & now Betty's chid? Still digesting it all.

 

[jakejake]

Originally Posted by bcate3

Just watched the finale. Struck the right notes of ambiguity and uncertainty explored through parallel storylines. Merger. Pregnancy. Cold War Standoff. Marital Reconciliation. Quitting a job? Breakup of an office romance. Disclosure of Paternity. Uncertainy over paternity? Bastards: Don & now Betty's chid? Still digesting it all.
So was Don doubtful about the fetus is not his? I didn't get his look at the end of the show.

 

[Jacques Cousteau]

Originally Posted by Flambeur

yes and yes

Betty is probably the most subtle and the most psychologically interesting character in the show.

Loved how the doctor said, "[abortion] is only for young girls who have no other options."

 

[Baron]

I thought that last episode was incredibly clumsy. The show is often a little thick fingered with it's plot points, but this was pretty bad. Duck was so stupid in that meeting - he'd been striking every right note up to then - why fall apart? And the Peggy-Pete talk felt forced. I suppose the missile crisis loosening lips, but that still felt a little pat. And Don showed up out of the blue - no resolution to his California stuff? It felt a little underwritten to me.

 

[Joffrey]

Originally Posted by Baron

I thought that last episode was incredibly clumsy. The show is often a little thick fingered with it's plot points, but this was pretty bad. Duck was so stupid in that meeting - he'd been striking every right note up to then - why fall apart? And the Peggy-Pete talk felt forced. I suppose the missile crisis loosening lips, but that still felt a little pat. And Don showed up out of the blue - no resolution to his California stuff? It felt a little underwritten to me.

Uhh, how do you not have a forced conversation when telling your former fling and co-worker that you had his baby and you gave it away so you could be one of the big boys?

I thought it was a solid episode. I too wondered whether Don was looking at betty questioning if the baby was his or his look was simply hope that the new baby would give the family a fresh start. Plus during the scene I realized she only allowed Don home because she didn't want to deal with a new baby on her own and after getting some random play.

I furious that I missed the meeting scene.

 

[bcate3]

Originally Posted by jakejake

So was Don doubtful about the fetus is not his? I didn't get his look at the end of the show.

Not demonstrably. But the way the scene played out hinted at uncertainty. That's why I put the question mark. Yes, they are having marital problems, but they were also having sexual troubles. I can only think of two sex scenes between them this season: at the hotel where Don couldn't perform and Betty's parent's place. That scene cut away so it's possible Don couldn't perform again. As to who else could have been the father, how about the riding partner or another anonymous partner? Betty's bar sex may not have been the first time.

The choice of using a bathroom for Betty's romp was great. I also liked the focus of the Don look- alike taking off her panties. Reminded me of when Don followed Bobbie Barret to the bathroom and grabbed her vag.

The other scenes I liked included Pete leaking his knowledge of the merger to Don. Didn't quite understand Pete's action other than Pete likes and admires Don and finally got his approval a few scenes before. Don then asks why are you telling me this? Later, when Peggy tells Pete about their kid but tells him it's over, Pete says why are you telling me this? Tight writing and a very well-done scene.

 

[Get Smart]

while I agree there were spots that seemed underwritten, overall it was an engaging episode. I suppose the problem with it might be the pacing, as the season has been moving around 25mph and suddenly the last episode it steps on the gas and hits 55. But I like where it left everything, and gives you a cliffhanger ending without an actual cliched cliffhanger. I know that I'm gonna have a hard time waiting for the new season next year.

 

[Baron]

Originally Posted by Jodum5

Uhh, how do you not have a forced conversation when telling your former fling and co-worker that you had his baby and you gave it away so you could be one of the big boys?
What I meant was that the way the conversation was stuffed into the plot felt forced. Pete suddenly becomes sentimental and tells Peggy that he loves her, and always has? Maybe it's just that I don't find Kartheiser to be a very compelling actor in this role (as opposed to almost the entire rest of the cast, which is great). Whatever, it's still my favorite show. I just get a little frustrated with it sometimes. I wonder if they have a really small budget compared with similar shows? The editing was a little jumpy again this week for one thing. AMC isn't a huge network. I'd love it if this show moved to HBO or Showtime.

 

[limping_decorum]

Originally Posted by Baron

HBO ...
HBO would do its best not to promote this show if they had it.

 

[Flambeur]

Originally Posted by Baron

Duck was so stupid in that meeting - he'd been striking every right note up to then - why fall apart?

Duck was craving the chance to put Don in his place. He was waiting for that moment to win, to prove himself superior to Don, to justify all the time he spent depressed by his position at work and in life.

And then Don dashed his dreams with one sentence. In front of everyone. How do you not blow up? Especially since you probably dropped half a bottle of gin that afternoon in anticipation of the meeting.

I loved that scene, although it was easily predictable.

 

[Flambeur]

Originally Posted by bcate3

The other scenes I liked included Pete leaking his knowledge of the merger to Don. Didn't quite understand Pete's action other than Pete likes and admires Don and finally got his approval a few scenes before. Don then asks why are you telling me this?

Pete worships Don and really really wants to be like him and on his side, and hates him at the same time because Don is a superior man to him. This conflict pushes him to try and connect to Don despite having the opportunity to sit back and enjoy the fireworks. At the same time, he is seeking approval and dying to tell someone he might actually be promoted and have the power, finally, despite not understanding the situation at all.

Anybody else see the parallel of Duck being an older version of Pete? (Lonely, awkward, depressed, divorced, loser, etc) That scene with him letting the dog go would totally be something Pete would do.

 

[bcate3]

Originally Posted by Baron

What I meant was that the way the conversation was stuffed into the plot felt forced. Pete suddenly becomes sentimental and tells Peggy that he loves her, and always has? Maybe it's just that I don't find Kartheiser to be a very compelling actor in this role (as opposed to almost the entire rest of the cast, which is great).

Whatever, it's still my favorite show. I just get a little frustrated with it sometimes. I wonder if they have a really small budget compared with similar shows? The editing was a little jumpy again this week for one thing. AMC isn't a huge network. I'd love it if this show moved to HBO or Showtime.

I actually thought the Pete-Peggy scene was set up nicely. Pete tells his wife that if she loved him, she would stay with him and not leave him for her parents. She leaves anyways. Her departure makes him feel moody, and in his liquored state he sees Peggy leaving the office. He stops her and confesses his love, still thinking that she is still the demure secretary who easily fell for him before and would do so again. He has nothing to lose with his wife gone and the end of the world looming. Little does he know that Peggy is as ambitious as he is, but is as cold and self-interested as Don.

Peggy, on the other hand, is confronted earlier by Father Hanks to confess her sins. On the eve of a nuclear war, she's told that the time to tell the truth is now. She's taken aback by the priest's confrontation and rejects his plea. It's a nice juxtaposition since Peggy earlier (or was it later) adviced Pete to tell the truth to Duck about Clearisil. The idea of coming clean is planted, however, and she ultimately confesses to Pete about their bastard (another!) son. She leaves him like she did with the priest, dumbfounded and confused.

 

[gorgekko]

Originally Posted by Flambeur

Duck was craving the chance to put Don in his place. He was waiting for that moment to win, to prove himself superior to Don, to justify all the time he spent depressed by his position at work and in life.

And then Don dashed his dreams with one sentence. In front of everyone. How do you not blow up? Especially since you probably dropped half a bottle of gin that afternoon in anticipation of the meeting.

I loved that scene, although it was easily predictable.

+1. That and the Peggy-Pete scene were the best.

I wasn't as impressed by Betty's story arc this season.