any public defenders here?

[rjakapeanut]

i'm a sophomore in college right now, and i plan on attending law school. i won't have any problems getting into the two best law schools in louisiana: tulane law school (ranked about 45th overall) and LSU (ranked like 80th). so 2nd and 3rd tier law schools, i suppose.

i really enjoy the law. i'm already studying for the LSAT (i'll take it next june) and in my free time i study the law -- specifically reading old supreme court cases and researching random areas and topics of the law. it's actually a passion of mine. i truly want to become a lawyer -- and not for the money (its arguable that there's even money out there right now). i've also considered teaching the law one day. one of my professors -- really a mentor -- is a public defender who teaches paralegal classes on the side. i'd love that.

rather than vie for t14 excellence and a $160k biglaw salary, i dream of becoming a public defender. i especially enjoy criminal law, and i want to be a "real" lawyer -- in the sense that i actually spend time in the court room, mingling with judges and arguing before juries. i think after some years i'd be interested in trying out different things, maybe getting in with a firm -- but for the time being, i think i want to become a public defender off the bat. $45k a year is no sweat off my back -- i was born poor.

i'm trying to get an idea of what the life of a public defender is like. i know the caseload is barbaric and the stress is high, but i don't have a real good idea of what the lifestyle is like.

i'm looking for anyone on here who knows the lifestyle, and could give me an idea of what the job is like.

i'm also trying to figure out which law school i should focus on -- $40k a year at tulane or $12k a year at LSU.

 

[FLMountainMan]

I dated a very "successful" public defender. Go to Tulane. Your student loan debt really isn't going to be a factor if you only take out public loans. COnsolidate them with the Feds, pay about $450 a month for ten years, and if you've worked for some form of government those ten years, the whole thing is forgiven.

Public defender jobs are actually getting more and more competitive, as the flood of new lawyers begins to enter the market and wages are depressed industry-wide.

The job itself blows. I know six public defenders, kids I went to law school with, and the aforementioned ex. The range from uber-liberal to right-wing. All absolutely hate it.

Ungrateful clients continually filing bar complaints against you while asking you to lie for them.

 

[Steve Smith]

You sound a little bit starry-eyed about this public defender gig. I suspect that dealing with the scum of the earth for a year or two would take the fun out of it.

 

[KObalto]

Most public defenders I know enjoy the work. If they didn't, they would find another legal job. It is a high stress roller coaster, though, with accompanying highs and lows. The clients are generally unappreciative, it's true, but a not guilty verdict will quickly change that for some. It takes a certain perversity to get paid by the state to represent the ungrateful by pointing out the flaws of the state.If you want to be a public defender, I would recommend keeping your student loans to a minimum, although the Feds will forgive a percentage of them.

 

[rjakapeanut]

Originally Posted by Steve Smith

You sound a little bit starry-eyed about this public defender gig. I suspect that dealing with the scum of the earth for a year or two would take the fun out of it.

Hard for me to give a good response because I don't really know what's it's like -- but I don't think every single client will be that bad. I think I'd get over it.

 

[Ataturk]

Most lawyers, when they know they have losing cases, will tell their clients and their clients will make the rational decision to settle. It's in everybody's best interest. So as a defense attorney, most of your job will consist of trying to convince your clients to plead guilty. Does that sound like fun? If you're able to do it, they'll change their minds (or they'll get their suspended sentences revoked, etc.), come back later and claim you bullied them or lied to them to make them plead out. If you can't convince them to plead, they'll make you to go to trial and find a way to make you look like an asshole. Then they'll get convicted and claim you were incompetent, crooked or worse. Along the way, you'll get to traumatize victims and witnesses, insult police officers, etc. It's just a load of fun.

 

[rjakapeanut]

Originally Posted by Ataturk

Most lawyers, when they know they have losing cases, will tell their clients and their clients will make the rational decision to settle. It's in everybody's best interest. So as a defense attorney, most of your job will consist of trying to convince your clients to plead guilty. Does that sound like fun? If you're able to do it, they'll change their minds (or they'll get their suspended sentences revoked, etc.), come back later and claim you bullied them or lied to them to make them plead out. If you can't convince them to plead, they'll make you to go to trial and find a way to make you look like an asshole. Then they'll get convicted and claim you were incompetent, crooked or worse. Along the way, you'll get to traumatize victims and witnesses, insult police officers, etc. It's just a load of fun.

I know a public defender very well and his job doesn't consist of trying to convince his clients to plead guilty.

He advises deals when they're beneficial. But the entire process as a whole -- yes -- does sound very fun to me.

 

[Bradford]

My best friend is a public defender. He's in court sometimes, but mostly just ends up negotiating with the prosecutors in order to get plea deals for his clients. He freely admits that its rare that he actually gets someone off. Typically he considers it a success if he gets someone's charges or sentence reduced.

However, he's been doing it for nearly 20-years now and he likes it. He makes a good living, has job security and never had to put in the hours expected at BigLaw.

 

[intent]

Why do you think you know any different, as an undergrad, from the collective experience of many other seasoned attorneys who actually know people in the field?

 

[magogian12345]

Work for a biglaw firm that encourages pro bono. That way you get the awesome pay for your clothing obsession and can pick and choose your pro bono clients.

 

[rjakapeanut]

Originally Posted by intent

Why do you think you know any different, as an undergrad, from the collective experience of many other seasoned attorneys who actually know people in the field?
first of all i don't think i've made any statements in this thread that really contrasted what anyone else has said in any way. if you've noticed anything weird, let me know and i'll elaborate on my opinion. and anything i say regarding this topic i'm basing on the seasoned attorneys who actually know the field -- in my area.

Originally Posted by Bradford

My best friend is a public defender. He's in court sometimes, but mostly just ends up negotiating with the prosecutors in order to get plea deals for his clients. He freely admits that its rare that he actually gets someone off. Typically he considers it a success if he gets someone's charges or sentence reduced. However, he's been doing it for nearly 20-years now and he likes it. He makes a good living, has job security and never had to put in the hours expected at BigLaw.
yeah, that's what i've gotten from the PDs i know -- a vast amount of your work is cutting deals and such. i don't expect to get a bunch of people off, regardless.

 

[Threak]

I worked at a courthouse for a few years, and everything Bradford describes sounds about right. Also, a huge percentage of the cases were DUI's. It seemed all they did was guide the defendants through guilty pleas, since the sentences for those were pretty consistent.

 

[rjakapeanut]

Originally Posted by Threak

I worked at a courthouse for a few years, and everything Bradford describes sounds about right. Also, a huge percentage of the cases were DUI's. It seemed all they did was guide the defendants through guilty pleas, since the sentences for those were pretty consistent.

i see. i've been told similar things -- but i don't mind much. i find the entire process very interesting.

what do you guys know about becoming a federal pd?

 

[IUtoSLU]

No offense, but the general view on public defenders is that they are the people who finished at the bottom of their class in law school. I only knew one girl in my class that worked for the public defender's office. She was a great person, pretty liberal and a mediocre student.

 

[rjakapeanut]

Originally Posted by IUtoSLU

No offense, but the general view on public defenders is that they are the people who finished at the bottom of their class in law school. I only knew one girl in my class that worked for the public defender's office. She was a great person, pretty liberal and a mediocre student.

none taken, obviously. i've heard people say that before, but i've found -- and i know many people on this board who would agree with me here -- that some people are willing to take less money to work a job they genuinely enjoy.