Outright lies about education

[Soulshine]

I remember reading some study where they said that 85% of people lie or embellish on their resume in some capacity big or small.

 

[Kiwi Man]

Originally Posted by AR_Six

Even I heard about this.

I wonder the problem will be solved if this Jeffrey Chiang changes his name. I understand he will have to go through a lot of processing such as changing his ID or passport, but it is possible, isn't it?

I don't think any big company would go so far to check if this guy ever had his name changed.

 

[ektaylor]

Originally Posted by Lord-Barrington

So when does embellishment turn into lying? How much is too much?

When you stop relying on your commanding use of the English language.

 

[slycedbred]

Originally Posted by Lord-Barrington

Lying on your resume is a loser's game, plain and simple. Way to easy to be found out and the cost can be steep.

unless you pretend to be a pro-islam group and speak with NPR's ceo

 

[rach2jlc]

Originally Posted by Soulshine

I remember reading some study where they said that 85% of people lie or embellish on their resume in some capacity big or small.
There's "selling" yourself, and then there is lying. I doubt 85% "lie," though you have to decide how/where/what are the limits of "self-marketing." It doesn't help to sell you if you spent 40 hours organizing a meeting/workshop for your colleagues, and then say, "Had meeting with 5 sales colleagues" on your resume, or just say nothing at all. On the other hand, "Facilitated and organized professional workshop related to corporate sales" sounds both professional and shows that you put in some effort. NOW, if they ask you about it directly, you just say, "I organized a workshop for our sales team, related to corporate blagh blagh blagh." If they ask how many people, say it was five. The problem is not in showing that you worked hard to do a good job; the problem is when you say, "I ran our entire sales team, and then did a conference for 400 sales reps from around the known universe." Does that make sense? Don't sell yourself short or be "scared" of marketing yourself on your CV... just be professional and don't make **** up. Perhaps it's a thin line, but basically I'd say don't put anything on there you can't justify/explain if they ask you in person. "Tell us about this workshop you faciliated" is easily justifiable/explainable... because it's what you DID. "Tell us about running your 400 person sales team" is NOT.

 

[rach2jlc]

Also, keep in mind that not all "mistakes" on a CV are intentional, or lies, or for self-marketing. Nevertheless, they can still come back to bite you. The safest bet, therefore, is to treat it like a "sacred" document, and go back over it with the same detail you would for any important form (tax, loan application, etc.)

Of course, make sure your degrees are accurate (with accurate dates), but also, if you are listing conferences, publications, workshops, WHATEVER that you attended/presented, go back and find the program or hard-copy of the materials to make sure the date and such are accurate. Don't just "guess" or assume it is correct. ALSO, don't necessarily trust what you are told by conference organizers or editors; FIND THE HARD COPY.

I got into trouble with this once when applying for my first job because I didn't have the conference program in front of me, and typed "march" instead of "may." Later, I got the program, but just forgot to fix it. Obviously, it wasn't "lying" because I did the conference, it was just a hasty mistake that I shouldn't have listed until I had the program in front of me.

People WILL check on things, and even though it's an easy "fix," it's an embarrassment to have someone call you and say, "Um, there wasn't even a conference in March, dude." I DID have someone call me, and I had to provide documentation. Easy fix, again, but still embarrassing because it makes you look foolish and unprofessional.

Going back over every element of your CV to check for those details is useful. Again, do it just like you would an important application. You wouldn't just write your address randomly or your age, or just "guess" your date of birth.

Nobody ever really teaches you how to write or how to "treat" a CV. All the way through undergrad, grad, and even my doctoral program, everybody kept saying "do your CV" and yet NOBODY ever said how you go about doing one, and what the "priorities" should be in terms of checking all the details.

Learn from our mistakes, and go back through it all with a fine-tooth'd comb.

 

[edinatlanta]

Originally Posted by rach2jlc

p.s. if you need more "scaring" into NOT fudging on this stuff, feel free to request horror stories about what has been fudged, and how it came out, and the repercussions. I've seen just about all there is to see, thanks to time spent working with the Coordinator of our Program and also serving on some search committees and such.

Spill them!

 

[rach2jlc]

Originally Posted by edinatlanta

Spill them!
The one I shared above actually was worse than I mentioned. As I said, it was a simple oversite/typo. Basically it looked like this. Paper "Writing Threads on SF" presented at 23rd Annual SF Pink Dolphin Society Conference, March 2004. Error was that it should have said May 2004. Everything else was correct. It was a real conference, real presentation, etc. WELL, turns out that I had a colleague who was a horrendous, evil, psychotic *****, who hated men and especially hated gay men, and triply hated professional/smart gay men. She hated me. ANYWAY, somehow she got my CV and went through everything, and found that mistake. Instead of saying, "it was a typo" or emailing me to say, "found a mistake; you might want to fix it" she sent a notice to the dean claiming "serious and deliberate falsification of credentials" and tried to get me in major trouble for it. Yes, seriously. Obviously, the Dean laughed her out of his office and called her a psychotic ***** (in PC language, of course!), but I still had to provide documentation that I did the conference, and also had to admit that I mistakenly typed "march" instead of "may." Even though the colleague looked worse, I still looked unprofessional because I should have caught it on my own. How can you really "prove" that it was just a typo? You can't. There really isn't any substantive difference between a mistake and an outright lie. You just have to "hope" that people won't **** you over, and (secondly) have to take extra care in making sure your details are accurate. Want more stories? Luckily, that was my only/worst one to happen personally, but I've got lots about others (related to "real" lying and falsification.) MORAL OF THE STORY: Even if your bosses don't catch it, if you do a good job, you may have people who hate you and want to **** up your life. Don't let them; and be above reproach in all ways related to "official" documents. Even if a mistake is justifiable, it's still a mistake that makes you look unprepared/unprofessional.

 

[edinatlanta]

Originally Posted by rach2jlc

The one I shared above actually was worse than I mentioned. As I said, it was a simple oversite/typo. Basically it looked like this.

Paper "Writing Threads on SF" presented at 23rd Annual SF Pink Dolphin Society Conference, March 2004.

Error was that it should have said May 2004. Everything else was correct. It was a real conference, real presentation, etc.

WELL, turns out that I had a colleague who was a horrendous, evil, psychotic *****, who hated men and especially hated gay men, and triply hated professional/smart gay men. She hated me.

ANYWAY, somehow she got my CV and went through everything, and found that mistake. Instead of saying, "it was a typo" or emailing me to say, "found a mistake; you might want to fix it" she sent a notice to the dean claiming "serious and deliberate falsification of credentials" and tried to get me in major trouble for it.

Yes, seriously. Obviously, the Dean laughed her out of his office and called her a psychotic ***** (in PC language, of course!), but I still had to provide documentation that I did the conference, and also had to admit that I mistakenly typed "march" instead of "may." Even though the colleague looked worse, I still looked unprofessional because I should have caught it on my own. How can you really "prove" that it was just a typo? You can't. There really isn't any substantive difference between a mistake and an outright lie. You just have to "hope" that people won't **** you over, and (secondly) have to take extra care in making sure your details are accurate.

Want more stories? Luckily, that was my only/worst one to happen personally, but I've got lots about others (related to "real" lying and falsification.)

MORAL OF THE STORY: Even if your bosses don't catch it, if you do a good job, you may have people who hate you and want to **** up your life. Don't let them; and be above reproach in all ways related to "official" documents. Even if a mistake is justifiable, it's still a mistake that makes you look unprepared/unprofessional.

****. That's an awesome story (I mean, not in a good way...you get what I'm saying).

Glad it worked out for you. I love how you built up this great ideal of who your colleague hated and then slipped in that it was you.

Keep the stories coming. As FLMM's threak showed, we love that ****. And academia has even better stories (or at least you do).

 

[taxgenius]

Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH

My current employeer definitely checked because my school notified me they were checking. They called every one of my references as well.

+1

 

[Flieger]

My employer hires a company that goes through your whole life basically. Very annoying yet very effective.

 

[Soulshine]

Apparently employers are having a harder time with confirming information on a resume these days and so many people who do lie on their resume are still getting hired. The reason for this is that privacy laws have changed recently in many countries and for legal reasons, people are just not willing to talk to some company looking to clarify information on someone. On the other side, you can't give a bad reference anymore - because it could bite them ********** later with a lawsuit.

In some ways, I think this is a good thing. Not in the sense that people have a loophole to lie, but I don't think a company should be able to use some service to find out everything there is to know about someone before they hire them. If I don't work out within the probation period, then they can fire ******. If I do a fantastic job, then they will be happy they hired me.

 

[Douglas]

has conne mentioned his princeton law degree ITT?

 

[yjeezle]

Originally Posted by Kiwi Man

I wonder the problem will be solved if this Jeffrey Chiang changes his name. I understand he will have to go through a lot of processing such as changing his ID or passport, but it is possible, isn't it? I don't think any big company would go so far to check if this guy ever had his name changed.
Probably what he'll end up doing. have you read this guy's resume? it's a joke. I had the misfortune of meeting this guy IRL. He's exactly what's wrong with Asian Americans today.

 

[mintyfresh]

I was #1 on the waiting list for a position at a BB right out of school. I eventually got the job b/c the person above me, was found to have lied on his resume (was informed of this after the HR associate and I became friends).