Gen Z "Zoomers" and Classic Menswear

[DougDevious]

People talk a lot about how classic menswear is "dying", and that people "just don't dress the way they used to", but for everyone beating that drum, sometimes someone else will say something about menswear having a "resurgence", now that it's no longer required as a dress code, meaning that there is a renewed interest in it as a venue of self-expression and personal style. To the latter group of people, I have to ask: "where?" because, as an 18-year-old, going on 19, I haven't seen any such resurgence among my own "generation", Gen Z, more playfully dubbed "Zoomers". There are no big Instagram pages run by people my age who show an interest in classic menswear, and there's no visible burgeoning subculture of zoomers interested in classic menswear either. If I may ask any forumites viewing this thread, why do you think this might be? What do you think were the series of events that lead to this complete disinterest, and why is there not even a counterculture of people who are interested?
Maybe it really is just seen as old-fashioned and unnecessary.

 

[DougDevious]

When I was 18 I was wearing grunge and didn’t want to wear a tie either. I think dressing more formally is an evolution one goes through.

18-25 year olds take to soft body athleisurewear outfits better. They are in better shape. Once the dad-bod Hits, the benefit of a structured coat, the shoulder padding,the canvas chest, starts to pay dividends that 20 year olds don’t care about.

I think the resurgence, if there is one, won’t come from the 20 year olds now but rather those 35-40 year olds who are realizing that dockers and a polo shirt with loafers don’t look cool and/or that athleisurewear gives them man-boobs, as they enter the more professional stage of their career and want to present themselves with a little more authority or leadership or attention to detail or inspire confidence in their audience.

Dressing casually and looking good is hard, and can get real expensive. Generally you need a larger rotation, because while suits can be worn in shorter rotations (a 5-10 suit collection can last years), reloading on new shirts that look stylish and fresh is more of a chore and can get pricey. Many Goodyear welted shoes are popular because they stay in style forever and can be resoled as opposed to a new pair of Johnson and Murphy loafers every 6 months. There is a reason why the suit was such a standard for workwear: it’s easy and looks good. The sports coat with nice trousers is pretty easy, not sure it looks as good, but is a good substitute. But only so much Lululemon a man can wear to work day after day, and after that are you just wearing dockers and a button down?

Can't say I'd be too satisfied with that being the beginning and end of a resurgence, although it's a lot more realistic. I feel like that kind of mindset is just going to push menswear into yet-again becoming the wardrobe of the entrenched, old-hat middle-manager class, and not the universal canvas and template for self-expression I'd like to think it is. It's not as if suits and ties have NEVER been popular with young men as a deliberate style choice. Any look at Mods, 70/80s punks, teddy boys, or even some emo/garage rock bands in the 2000s is a clear demonstration of that, so I gotta wonder if I'll ever be lucky enough to see something like that again.
Personally, I'm rooting for there being a sort of re-introduction of not so much "classic" menswear, but more just tailoring and sartorial looks into the wardrobes of 16-25-year-olds through already-established style trends and subcultures that are (or at least were recently) popular with whatever portion of young men actually care about dressing as a form of self-expression (worryingly small these days, it seems). I could list some examples I have in mind if you're interested.
Here's an image that kind of gets at what I'm trying to say:

 

[Texasmade]

Most teens and zoomers can't afford tailored menswear. The look isn't cheap compared to athleisurewear or streetwear.

 

[dieworkwear]

Can't say I'd be too satisfied with that being the beginning and end of a resurgence, although it's a lot more realistic. I feel like that kind of mindset is just going to push menswear into yet-again becoming the wardrobe of the entrenched, old-hat middle-manager class, and not the universal canvas and template for self-expression I'd like to think it is. It's not as if suits and ties have NEVER been popular with young men as a deliberate style choice. Any look at Mods, 70/80s punks, teddy boys, or even some emo/garage rock bands in the 2000s is a clear demonstration of that, so I gotta wonder if I'll ever be lucky enough to see something like that again.
Personally, I'm rooting for there being a sort of re-introduction of not so much "classic" menswear, but more just tailoring and sartorial looks into the wardrobes of 16-25-year-olds through already-established style trends and subcultures that are (or at least were recently) popular with whatever portion of young men actually care about dressing as a form of self-expression (worryingly small these days, it seems). I could list some examples I have in mind if you're interested.
Here's an image that kind of gets at what I'm trying to say:
View attachment 1779982

Been blogging about men's style for over ten years, and that excerpt has gotten more traction than anything I've ever published. When that Waters quote first came out, I posted it at PTO and it got tens of thousands of like and reblogs. And about once a year, I still see it pop up on various channels, such as Twitter.

The quote is from a WSJ story, but from the formatting, you can see how it came from what I posted at PTO. It's crazy to me how much traction that has gotten.

Hippies. Punks. Gangsters. Now you’re a hacktivist.

“When I was young there were beatniks. Hippies. Punks. Gangsters. Now you’re a hacktivist. Which I would probably be if...

putthison.com

 

[JFWR]

Can't say I'd be too satisfied with that being the beginning and end of a resurgence, although it's a lot more realistic. I feel like that kind of mindset is just going to push menswear into yet-again becoming the wardrobe of the entrenched, old-hat middle-manager class, and not the universal canvas and template for self-expression I'd like to think it is. It's not as if suits and ties have NEVER been popular with young men as a deliberate style choice. Any look at Mods, 70/80s punks, teddy boys, or even some emo/garage rock bands in the 2000s is a clear demonstration of that, so I gotta wonder if I'll ever be lucky enough to see something like that again.
Personally, I'm rooting for there being a sort of re-introduction of not so much "classic" menswear, but more just tailoring and sartorial looks into the wardrobes of 16-25-year-olds through already-established style trends and subcultures that are (or at least were recently) popular with whatever portion of young men actually care about dressing as a form of self-expression (worryingly small these days, it seems). I could list some examples I have in mind if you're interested.
Here's an image that kind of gets at what I'm trying to say:
View attachment 1779982

As someone who teaches 18-21 year olds, I can sadly say that there is virtually nothing about that generation that is oriented towards a classic menswear look, at least in the setting (a university) where I have my most frequent interactions with, nor in the city at large (such as the local restaurants and such) surrounding it. Admittedly, I wouldn't place where I teach as any epicenter of dressing well, as even the older people around here really don't dress in a CM-like manner, or anything approaching stylish or hip outside of save, perhaps, some people who probably dress well by streetwear standards in a general hip-hop way.

But excluding the rare occasion where students are called to wear suits (such as for big presentations in the business or law schools) there is just no place for that kind of dress here. It's all relentlessly casual, even to the point of sometimes being ridiculous - as in crocs and pajamas to class. Even leather shoes are infrequent, with the only exceptions I generally see being Doc Martens, and then (mostly) on girls.

So I am afraid that yeah, right now, there isn't much in the way of a "let's wear classic looks in a hip way" movement. That's not the trend right now at all.

Also, I don't think the fact that Green Day wore ties at one point really qualifies as any real resurgence, amongst youth culture, being interested in suits at that point in the 2000s. American Idiot was fun and all, but it wasn't a big fashion statement.

I mean, I should add: When I return to NY frequently, I also don't see younger people really oriented towards wearing CM stuff. It just isn't what's in right now.

I agree with the above posters that millenials might be the more likely generation to begin to orient towards a CM look as they begin to veer into the younger parts of their middle age.

 

[dieworkwear]

As someone who teaches 18-21 year olds, I can sadly say that there is virtually nothing about that generation that is oriented towards a classic menswear look, at least in the setting (a university) where I have my most frequent interactions with, nor in the city at large (such as the local restaurants and such) surrounding it.

Classic menswear isn't even popular among people who are into classic menswear. A lot of what passes for CM nowadays is just business casual with crazy shoes, hashtag menswear, and internet dandyism.

 

[JFWR]

Classic menswear isn't even popular among people who are into classic menswear. A lot of what passes for CM nowadays is just business casual with crazy shoes, hashtag menswear, and internet dandyism.

Can we please not have another thread where you go on a 30 page rant about how everyone who doesn't share your sense of style hates classic menswear?

We're all aware that you don't think CM is having a good go of things right now.

 

[dieworkwear]

Can we please not have another thread where you go on a 30 page rant about how everyone who doesn't share your sense of style hates classic menswear?

We're all aware that you don't think CM is having a good go of things right now.

Is this comment different from you saying how young people dress like slobs and "hip hop?"

 

[JFWR]

Is this comment different from you saying how young people dress like slobs and "hip hop?"

I won't derail every thread I enter into with this. You, on the other hand, like to chime in on this everywhere. We get it. You've made your point. It's not even a bad point, it just has been done.

Also, I was saying that those that dress in a hip-hop oriented way actually tend to dress well for that style. That's about the only style I see represented in this city that anyone puts effort into wearing.

 

[dieworkwear]

I won't derail every thread I enter into with this. You, on the other hand, like to chime in on this everywhere. We get it. You've made your point. It's not even a bad point, it just has been done.

Also, I was saying that those that dress in a hip-hop oriented way actually tend to dress well for that style. That's about the only style I see represented in this city that anyone puts effort into wearing.

If we're discussing whether CM has declined, I think the largest indication is that it's not popular even among people who are supposedly into CM.

The only place where I see CM ascendant is in East Asia.

 

[steveabdn]

I’m afraid I’m not in your target demographic for the opening statements but will offer my view regardless. I’m a 41 year old guy and classic menswear is an interest of mine rather than a lifestyle I live. I appreciate seeing how other people have taken the time, consideration and the investment in achieving it. Unfortunately, I don’t have the resources to partake and other things take priority for now in a financial sense. I aim to be in a better position to reflect my personal style choices in the future but in the meantime, I’m a jeans and sneakers guy with an affection for tailoring

 

[Nyarlathotep]

ˆˆYou're talking like the 'dad bod' i.e midriff obesity is inevitable.

 

[JFWR]

I’m afraid I’m not in your target demographic for the opening statements but will offer my view regardless. I’m a 41 year old guy and classic menswear is an interest of mine rather than a lifestyle I live. I appreciate seeing how other people have taken the time, consideration and the investment in achieving it. Unfortunately, I don’t have the resources to partake and other things take priority for now in a financial sense. I aim to be in a better position to reflect my personal style choices in the future but in the meantime, I’m a jeans and sneakers guy with an affection for tailoring

Thrifting is a good option for those on a budget. You can at least find some nice sports coats and such.

 

[steveabdn]

Thrifting is a good option for those on a budget. You can at least find some nice sports coats and such.

Thanks for the reply. I’ve tried to pick things up in the past but I’m something of an irregular shape, I’ve had limited success thrifting. I’m getting ready to go down the Proper Cloth route

 

[Spinster Jones]

ˆˆYou're talking like the 'dad bod' i.e midriff obesity is inevitable.

Not inevitable, but a growing concern for many:

1. Young adults were half as likely to have obesity as middle-aged adults. Adults aged 18-24 years had the lowest self-reported obesity (19.5%) compared to adults aged 45-54 years who had the highest prevalence (38.1%)
   
   
2. And this is obesity, not just dad bods, which would probably be a much higher percentage.