Classic Menswear Lounge

[archibaldleach]

I think the jacket length above is fine. I also suspect that @Montesquieu is taller than me or @AJL. The idea that shorter men benefit from a jacket that is on the shorter side (provided it covers one's ass) biases me to shorter jackets (not just my opinion either, I can cite Astaire and Manton's book off hand and I'm sure there are others). A longer jacket does have a bit more margin for error, however, even if it is a tiny bit less flattering. I think the 28-28.5 inch length is ideal for me (this is the range for both my MyTailor stuff and the one Steed MTM I have), 29 is a bit more of a classic length (two BB MTM odd jackets). Were I taller, I would probably go for a length that was a bit more classic and a bit less short. Of course, the difference between such lengths is really about an inch.

 

[kulata]



I think the jacket length above is fine. I also suspect that @Montesquieu is taller than me or @AJL. The idea that shorter men benefit from a jacket that is on the shorter side (provided it covers one's ass) biases me to shorter jackets (not just my opinion either, I can cite Astaire and Manton's book off hand and I'm sure there are others). A longer jacket does have a bit more margin for error, however, even if it is a tiny bit less flattering. I think the 28-28.5 inch length is ideal for me (this is the range for both my MyTailor stuff and the one Steed MTM I have), 29 is a bit more of a classic length (two BB MTM odd jackets). Were I taller, I would probably go for a length that was a bit more classic and a bit less short. Of course, the difference between such lengths is really about an inch.

If memory serves me correctly, I think I remember @Montesquieu describing himself as very short i.e. around your height or even shorter. Will search...

 

[archibaldleach]

^ Serves me right for trying to make an inference based on a photo.

 

[EliodA]

A long skirt (quarters) is part of the Attolini silhouette. It creates a more even balance between the part above the buttoning point and the part below. If you compare it with e.g. Formosa, you'll see the difference: there, the top is a lot longer than the bottom. To me, that looks a bit unbalanced and is the reason why I'm not so enthusiastic about the Formosa cut as the majority here on SF.




And then of course, there's this: http://mostexerent.tumblr.com/post/11058463975/cover-your-ass-there-is-a-common-misconception

 

[kulata]

Hmmm. You raise some points about the Formosa silhouette but does that apply to all Formosa fits? I think @Murlsquirl has the best RTW Formosa fit that I have seen. Let me go check his pic

 

[Murlsquirl]



Hmmm. You raise some points about the Formosa silhouette but does that apply to all Formosa fits? I think @Murlsquirl has the best RTW Formosa fit that I have seen. Let me go check his pic

Thanks.

The trousers in the Allotini pic look terrible....

 

[Murlsquirl]

This one?

 

[Mr. Six]

In my limited experience, the Formosa silhouette isn't as long above the buttoning point as some of the photos posted suggest. It absolutely has a lower buttoning point than a lot of current jackets, but it's basically right on my bellybutton. I might have a better photo tomorrow, but this is a sport coat right out of the box with no alterations (I only had the sleeves shortened). Since it's not full-length, it's not as informative as it could be, but I think it illustrates my point.

With regard to AJL, I wonder whether his arms are shorter than average for his height. As I keep seeing his photo, I think the position of his hands relative to the coat create an impression of it being longer than it actually is.

 

[Murlsquirl]

Here is another one..different size than the first.

 

[kulata]

Yup. It looks balanced on you though.

Concur on the pants 100%.

 

[EliodA]

Somehow, those Formosa's look better on you than on anybody else, @Murlsquirl . Maybe you can get a contract to endorse their brand?
And yes, those trousers in the Attolini pic look horrible....

 

[Murlsquirl]

I appreciate it guys. I don't even bother looking for suits elsewhere anymore, The navy is a 52 and the grey 50. My MTO in the works is a 50L, which I think will be the sweet spot.

 

[Cleav]



Somehow, those Formosa's look better on you than on anybody else, @Murlsquirl
. Maybe you can get a contract to endorse their brand?
And yes, those trousers in the Attolini pic look horrible....

Elio, I think you're right. But why would that be? Is it because Murl is a tall, muscular yet lean fella and it hangs so well on those shoulders?


@Murlsquirl, you always look stella in them

 

[unbelragazzo]



 

Spoiler: Warning: Nerd Talk

Unbel

My suggestion that we in fact agree was intended as a friendly gesture for you to reinterpret my post more charitably. I admit that I write in a way that can make that difficult. I do not think I ever claimed that there were rules about length, indeed quite the opposite in this thread (I would use "advice" in all cases we are inclined to say "rule"), but the polemic seems to be about the suffocation such talk induces. I agree (again) but not what I meant.

I'm not sure why you saddle me with silly views. "Articulation" doesn't mean that you explicitly thought those things in your head, or spoke to yourself in a logician's voice before you dressed on waking up (again, I realize I write like that).

You are not insensitive to psychological reality in your line of work. Why then foist on me a psychologically implausible proposal? When you learn to see, you learn to generalize not because you say to yourself that "oh, jacket lengths should be this long", but because you visually learn to categorize good and bad lengths just like you can learn to categorize any object. For many of us, that is because other people pointed out things to look for. Our visual learning reflects these salient features and we slowly come to balance them in our own judgments even if we don't reason about them before hand or even explicitly realize that we balance them.

Despos set Patrick R's jacket length in a visually balanced way. It looks great! I strongly suspect that Despos will be very consistent in how he sets jacket lengths for bodies of certain types for good taste (and of course, listening to his clients). I have no doubt he can tell you what he's balancing when he sets a jacket length. It does not mean he ran through some rationalization in his head, but his judgment is informed by his visual skill. There's no reverse engineering here.

The original proposal, which is dead in the water now, was just to invite people to reflect on how their own visual judgments mirror how they have learned to see things. It was also to point out a kind of failure in talk of jacket lengths on SF: we feel like we are arguing about length when really, what we are arguing about is the contextual features which we all weight, unconsciously, in different ways. So people end up just talking past each other (cf. the dialog about AJL's jacket). I strongly suspect, however, that I'm too pedantic.

On the positive side: I don't think we disagree.

I don't mean to be uncharitable or unfriendly. Articulation of why somebody likes something a certain way can be interesting and valuable. But I don't think this is an obligation that anybody has, as I understood your original post in this discussion to suggest:

There are many ways we balance these factors. We should be clear to ourselves which matter for us and be able to articulate them.

 

[Murlsquirl]



Elio, I think you're right. But why would that be? Is it because Murl is a tall, muscular yet lean fella and it hangs so well on those shoulders?


@Murlsquirl, you always look stella in them

Thanks!

For me, it's a about the shoulder. Not many 50's come with a 19" shoulder and 43ish chest and that is why it's works perfectly for me (19" shoulders/41" chest). I didn't touch the 50 (grey) and have a 10" drop so you can see that taper from the chest down to the waist is fairly significant. I could bring it in a touch, but I like to wear things for a bit before I decide...I've only worn it 4-5 times. The trousers were just cuffed and fit damn near perfect, but they are 2 sizes smaller than what normally come with the jacket...which is why I have to go MTO. I consider myself very lucky that they fit so well.