Review: CEGO Custom Shirtmakers

Originally Posted by gdl203

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I think it certainly has potential. I mean, theoretically, what's the number of people who could "review" a shirtmaker they have not done business with or a shirt they've never actually bought? An infinite number, that's right!
Let's be fair here rather than getting defensive. No one in this thread has made any claims or expressed any opinions about Carl's work. In fact, both the OP and I mentioned specifically that the reason we first went to Carl was because we had thought highly of the work we'd seen from him on SF or in person.

Originally Posted by JohnnyCrockett

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I'm not a tailor, but please enlighten me as to what bespoke/MTM customer with his head on straight wouldn't ask a million questions of a prospective new tailor and perhaps even over-specify details in order to ensure that he was getting the right thing? He shouldn't accept new customers if he doesn't want discerning ones.

I don't know what happened with the OP (every story has two sides and all that) and I don't know what happened with you. I will say that a few (2-3) people in the business (shirtmakers/tailors) have told me that they are exasperated with internet geeks coming to them with a million and one questions/requests that they read about on the internet. I think the point of going to someone that knows what they are doing is to give them minimal instructions and then let them do their thing. Imagine someone coming to your job and telling you, in infinte detail, how to do something that you have been doing for 20 years? Anyway, I don't know what transpired and Carl is rather gruff but I would at least like to hear his side of the story before making any conclusions. Also, it is his business. I think GetSmart (TaT) said it on here once, eloquently, "at the end of the day, if I think you are going to be more trouble than you are worth, I just won't sell you a suit"

My review of CEGO:

I met Carl once. I didn't buy any shirts. He answered my questions and actually was helpful to point out some slight issues with the fit of my jacket with regard to my posture; it was eye opening. Carl was nothing less than a gracious if a little rough around the edges, in that grizzled veteran way, during the meeting.

How's that Greg?

Carl sounds like a dick. My kind of guy!

Originally Posted by Cayne-Abel

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Finally, Carl started taking my measurements. I was wearing a custom shirt that I just purchased from a downtown shirtmaker. I told Carl that although I liked the shirt, I was not very happy with the cut (still too blousy). Carl then began to explain that while it certainly is possible to make a slimmer shirt for me, the current shirt that I was wearing was already fairly slim. I said that I was looking for a very fitted, sleek look, although I don't want to go too far either - I don't want to take it to the point where I just look "odd" in an office setting, and I don't want to constrict my movement around the arms and chest either. Carl responded that there must always be some trade-off between slimness and movement, that I must be willing to accept some restriction if I am looking for a truly slimmer fit.

I then said "alright, in that case, I'm willing to accept some restriction if it'll make a slimmer fit, as long as you don't think I'm going overboard." Carl responds by saying, "look, I can make anything you want, but you have to know what you want. I make shirts that I think are too slim all the time, but it doesn't matter what I think, it's what you think." Me: "OK, I understand, I just wanted your professional opinion on it; I thought maybe you were hinting that I was asking for something that you thought I'd might regret." Carl: "I'm honestly about to tell you to take a hike, because I'm losing my patience."

At this point, if I was Carl I would have tased you.

I think that you've summed up too tidily what was probably for him an excruciating exchange which more likely looked like this (but much longer and repetitive):

You: I want the shirt slimmer.

Carl: we can go slimmer, but it's going to be too tight.

You: I want it slimmer, but only if you think it is a good idea.

Carl: I don't, really.

You: well, let's just make it slimmer anyways.... but only if you give the ok.

Carl:

Originally Posted by Cayne-Abel

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I've seen Carl's work from a couple of people in my office. His shirts are good. So go to Carl if you want good shirts.

Originally Posted by JohnnyCrockett

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No one in this thread has made any claims or expressed any opinions about Carl's work.

Sounds like a claim/opinion to me.

Originally Posted by JohnnyCrockett

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Let's be fair here rather than getting defensive. No one in this thread has made any claims or expressed any opinions about Carl's work.
You have! But you've edited your post 6 times since then. I'm not defensive, I don't work for Carl. I'm just entertained.

Also, the thread's title is "review"....

Originally Posted by whnay.

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Carl sounds like a dick. My kind of guy!

yeah, he's the NY version of you

Originally Posted by gdl203

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He's been doing this for a bloody long time and has a pretty good nose for time-wasters and difficult customers. It's pretty clear he doesn't want to bother with customers that don't know what they want and will never be happy.

In that case, Carl's nose is off. I mentioned the shirt I came in with, to offer a comparison for Carl. I got that custom shirt two days before coming to Carl. The shirtmaker I got it from was incredibly nice and welcoming. And yet, because I didn't want to be a pain or an annoyance, I didn't even bother coming back to him and asking him to adjust the slimness.

As for my dealing with Carl, I was anything but a time-waster - right off the bat, I told him that I was in a bit of a rush and needed to be out the door by 6 pm, "unless that would be rushing you." I had my swatches picked out and ready to go, before he even started measuring me. I had NO questions about cuffs, collars, buttons, fabric, etc. My ONLY issue was with slimness.

A thousand apologies for making the preposterous assumption that I could ask my shirtmaker for his opinion on proper fit. When paying such high premiums for bespoke clothing, one would think that asking simple questions is part of the package. If not, potential clients should be given the courtesy of being informed that Carl does not wish to deal with newbies.

Originally Posted by Vintage Gent

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Sounds like a claim/opinion to me.

How cute. So the OP actually said something GOOD about Carl and now you are feeling clever noting that my statement was incorrect.

I don't know about all this, but my wife has observed of our bespoke experience out there that

1 - There are those who make you their shirts/suits/jackets/trousers/shoes.

2 - And there are those who make you your shirts/suits/jackets/trousers/shoes, but with their signature.

It probably is chemistry in the end, but your experience with CEGO is more 1 than 2.

That said, there are many, many, many other makers out there [e.g. Geneva].

Find 2 and you'll be happy.

- M

Originally Posted by JohnnyCrockett

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How cute. So the OP actually said something GOOD about Carl and now you are feeling clever noting that my statement was incorrect.

"It's such a fine line between stupid and clever." - David St. Hubbins Edit: And no offense meant. Just being a bit silly today.

Originally Posted by Vintage Gent

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"It's such a fine line between stupid and clever."
- David St. Hubbins

Edit: And no offense meant. Just being a bit silly today.

I'm laughing. Sorry I took things a bit too seriously...and great quote.

Originally Posted by edmorel

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I don't know what happened with the OP (every story has two sides and all that) and I don't know what happened with you. I will say that a few (2-3) people in the business (shirtmakers/tailors) have told me that they are exasperated with internet geeks coming to them with a million and one questions/requests that they read about on the internet. I think the point of going to someone that knows what they are doing is to give them minimal instructions and then let them do their thing. Imagine someone coming to your job and telling you, in infinte detail, how to do something that you have been doing for 20 years? Anyway, I don't know what transpired and Carl is rather gruff but I would at least like to hear his side of the story before making any conclusions. Also, it is his business. I think GetSmart (TaT) said it on here once, eloquently, "at the end of the day, if I think you are going to be more trouble than you are worth, I just won't sell you a suit"

I can sympathize with Carl when people are coming in with more "knowledge" than they know what to do with, but it doesn't seem right to be openly rude to a customer regardless of the circumstance.

Yes, I'd be annoyed if someone came in to my work and told me how to do things. However, if I were in a customer service-based trade, I'd think this would be expected. I wouldn't throw a hissy fit if a vegetarian came into my restaurant and I was asked to whip up a chicken salad with portabella instead of chicken.

Originally Posted by somatoform

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At this point, if I was Carl I would have tased you.

I think that you've summed up too tidily what was probably for him an excruciating exchange which more likely looked like this (but much longer and repetitive):

You: I want the shirt slimmer.

Carl: we can go slimmer, but it's going to be too tight.

You: I want it slimmer, but only if you think it is a good idea.

Carl: I don't, really.

You: well, let's just make it slimmer anyways.... but only if you give the ok.

Carl:

My OP was an almost word-for-word account of what was said. Besides, the question that set him off didn't even have anything to do with my "fit" questions. I was asking him about pricing. In hindsight, his outburst would have been no less surprising had I asked him if I could use the bathroom.

Even if I was annoying him with (*gasp*) questions, there are more tactful ways to clue me in rather than telling me "I'm about to tell you to take a hike, I'm losing my patience." All he had to say was "As a shirtmaker, I can't make your decision for you, because I honestly don't want to be held responsible if you don't like how the shirt turns out." In fact, he did say almost exactly that, at which point I was nodding my head and saying "ok, understood"....he then felt the need to add the unnecessary "...take a hike..." comments, then bite my head off when I asked about pricing a few minutes later.