The Watch Appreciation Thread - Part two (Rolex, Patek Philippe, Audemars Piguet, Jaeger LeCoultre,

[LA Guy]

Why settle for boring, look alike watches? Just walked through multibrand duty free store at Zurich airport. The shop is filled with polished metal watches of no particular character. Mass produced, generic and thus useless products .

Nearly all watches are mass produced. Unlike, say, clothes, it makes nearly no sense to produce small runs of watches the way you can with say, clothes, because from my very limited understanding, there is certainly is no inexpensive way to do this without requiring the manufacturer to have both a dedicated factory space for this, and even then, without commanding a premium on those products. The only way that you could do this relatively painlessly is probably in case, dial and hands customization - sort of the pick your own adventure type of process that independents do when they subcontract.

Watches are "generic" because most people who buy watches are not Saudi princes, and if you are going to buy just one watch, or maybe a handful of watches, you probably want it/them to go with most things. This goes for most products. It's a common thing to say that the best stuff goes during sale time. I strongly disagree. By far, the most interesting pieces stay around, at least in clothing, until deep discount, because it takes a special customer to go against the grain.

Useless? To you maybe. But apparently, most watch consumers find some utility in them.

That said, with a few exceptions, I typically greatly prefer vintage watches to modern ones.

 

[LA Guy]

Pictures please

Will do after a much needed post Christmas workout. I promised my wife that I would let my battered body rest these next two weeks, but I still needed to drive the car around the block a few times, just to keep the engine working, so to speak.

 

[Medwed]

Some companies , will not name names not to upset cognoscenti, would produce unique watches in runs of 100s, those are the most fun watches I have seen. Modern automated manufacturing allows for that. It seems to be not what majority of consumers prefers. Although people like to pay lip service to being unique individual the opposite is true when they come to their wrist jewelry preferences. Most men like to conform and blend in , not to stand out. Not unexpected but shame really.

 

[Mr. Moo]

Water is wet.

 

[Scuppers]

Water is wet.

Ummm...

 

[LA Guy]

Some companies , will not name names not to upset cognoscenti, would produce unique watches in runs of 100s, those are the most fun watches I have seen. Modern automated manufacturing allows for that. It seems to be not what majority of consumers prefers. Although people like to pay lip service to being unique individual the opposite is true when they come to their wrist jewelry preferences. Most men like to conform and blend in , not to stand out. Not unexpected but shame really.

Most people, men and women, like to fit in. I used to think that it was a bad thing, but I've come to the conclusion that it's just me, and for the most part, not a moral failing.

 

[patrickBOOTH]

I watched this true crime show with my mother this weekend about a woman who was killed in Moscow, Idaho. I thought of you, LA Guy.

 

[Dino944]

Limited runs of 100 watches- I guess I don't see what makes that fun. Unless one is saying exclusivity makes them fun? I believe it was Roger Dubuis who used to make watches in a limited series of 88 or less. A few of his designs, were interesting and nice, but many were just weird and unattractive. It was as though, if there was a great idea, or a great design, after 88 pieces, they had to do something else with it, or modify it sometimes ruining the look just for the sake of keeping production limited to 88 pieces.

Sometimes, a design is just a good design. One can spend a lot of time reinventing the wheel, and have something different. Different is quite easy, what is difficult is to make something that is better or an improvement, be it in terms of appearance, function, or both. I know there is a big camp of Rolex haters here, but as an example- there is a reason why there are so many GMT watches from various companies, that all look like a sibling or cousin to the Rolex GMT Master. It is simply its a good design.

Sure some people purchase a GMT Master to fit in, but perhaps some just buy it as it does what it needs to do, and it does it quite well. Why buy some offshoot or overly contrived watch that is trying very hard to be different, when you can buy the modern descendant of the original piece that everyone borrows from or copies?

I get that some people want to show their own taste, be an individual, be different, and not buy what everyone else normally chooses. With clothing, some people have a great eye for colors, textures, fabrics, and they can put things together in a way many people can't. Yet far too often I see people striving to be different, and the look or idea just doesn't work. For the most part it is harmless and if it makes them happy that is all that matters. But it can be a costly mistake...I've told the story several times, of a friend that didn't want a Rolex because almost everyone at the office wore a Datejust. My friend bought a Ulysse Nardin, and it turned out to be a tremendous headache...going back for warranty repairs 3 times in 18 months. My friend then regretted not simply buying the more common DJ.

 

[city74]

Speaking of limited editions I ordered this today. There are 100 being made and should arrive in February. My first Stowa and wow I’m excited

 

[Mr. Moo]

Dunno about 88 but RD usually made runs of 28, and this was at a time when his watches were both mechanically and visually stunning.

 

[am55]

Limited runs of 100 watches- I guess I don't see what makes that fun. Unless one is saying exclusivity makes them fun? I believe it was Roger Dubuis who used to make watches in a limited series of 88 or less. A few of his designs, were interesting and nice, but many were just weird and unattractive. It was as though, if there was a great idea, or a great design, after 88 pieces, they had to do something else with it, or modify it sometimes ruining the look just for the sake of keeping production limited to 88 pieces.

Sometimes, a design is just a good design. One can spend a lot of time reinventing the wheel, and have something different. Different is quite easy, what is difficult is to make something that is better or an improvement, be it in terms of appearance, function, or both.

As a former artist I would offer an alternative explanation and that is that for some artists, great work stands on a giant pyramid of dead, discarded bad work; in other words it is through volume that you iterate your way towards your voice and vision. Now Dubuis is not at all my kind of watch but I can see why his kind of very visually busy work might benefit from a lot of risk taking. It reminds me somewhat of the intricate patterns of old Indonesian knives (keris) whose complexity seems to follow abstract but consistent rules derived from experience, and where no two blades look alike, yet most look coherent and purposeful.

 

[am55]

I've told the story several times, of a friend that didn't want a Rolex because almost everyone at the office wore a Datejust. My friend bought a Ulysse Nardin, and it turned out to be a tremendous headache...going back for warranty repairs 3 times in 18 months. My friend then regretted not simply buying the more common DJ.

Sorry for double quoting - missed the anecdote at the end until now.

Without disagreeing with your statement and defence of the idea of objective quality in design being at least somewhat correlated with popularity, the anecdote itself is I think flawed in that
1. your friend just hopped from mega brand to smaller but still big brand (UN - which you can buy in many airports, the SYD ones are near Seiko and Citizen!)
2. the issue is one of mechanical failure, not aesthetic quality i.e. a manufacturing issue (unless you are arguing that UN's designs are inherently likely to break due to their bad engineering, in which case my apologies for not fully understanding your point).

 

[Riva]

Speaking of limited editions I ordered this today. There are 100 being made and should arrive in February. My first Stowa and wow I’m excited

View attachment 1096171

I love my el cheapo LE 100 pieces blue flieger Stowa more than any other blue dialed watches I got. Exciting colored dials always come in limited numbers with Stowa.

 

[Riva]

Popularity has no bearing on the qualities and aesthetics of an item. GM cars outsold many more reliable and exciting foreign brands for decades once. Supreme shirts were the **** a few months ago.

A single example of a bad experience in product ownership doesn't automatically make a certain brand that uses a myriad of inhouse and outsourced movements a bad alternative to another brand. He could've bought the Rolex and had the same bad experience due to abusive usage or the universe just wants to make him the lucky one so not quantitative enough. What is only true is the resale of the Rolex is much better than the UN which obviously makes it the more popular choice among his "conservative" resale minded friends. Jon could've bought a Jaguar F Type but got a Cayman instead.

 

[LA Guy]

Limited runs of 100 watches- I guess I don't see what makes that fun. Unless one is saying exclusivity makes them fun? I believe it was Roger Dubuis who used to make watches in a limited series of 88 or less. A few of his designs, were interesting and nice, but many were just weird and unattractive. It was as though, if there was a great idea, or a great design, after 88 pieces, they had to do something else with it, or modify it sometimes ruining the look just for the sake of keeping production limited to 88 pieces.

Sometimes, a design is just a good design. One can spend a lot of time reinventing the wheel, and have something different. Different is quite easy, what is difficult is to make something that is better or an improvement, be it in terms of appearance, function, or both. I know there is a big camp of Rolex haters here, but as an example- there is a reason why there are so many GMT watches from various companies, that all look like a sibling or cousin to the Rolex GMT Master. It is simply its a good design.

Sure some people purchase a GMT Master to fit in, but perhaps some just buy it as it does what it needs to do, and it does it quite well. Why buy some offshoot or overly contrived watch that is trying very hard to be different, when you can buy the modern descendant of the original piece that everyone borrows from or copies?

I get that some people want to show their own taste, be an individual, be different, and not buy what everyone else normally chooses. With clothing, some people have a great eye for colors, textures, fabrics, and they can put things together in a way many people can't. Yet far too often I see people striving to be different, and the look or idea just doesn't work. For the most part it is harmless and if it makes them happy that is all that matters. But it can be a costly mistake...I've told the story several times, of a friend that didn't want a Rolex because almost everyone at the office wore a Datejust. My friend bought a Ulysse Nardin, and it turned out to be a tremendous headache...going back for warranty repairs 3 times in 18 months. My friend then regretted not simply buying the more common DJ.

Clearly you hav a lot more experience than do I re watches, but some of the Speedmasters (one of my curent interests - I like the idea of a robust, hand wound movement) that immediately caught my eye were extremely limited in distribution, for example. I think that when you have limited editions is small quanities, you are more prone to experimentation, because well, if things don't work out, so be it, and so it frees you from the trepidation of the possibility of being stuck with 50K watches that won't move off the shelves. Just as a small sample of the Speemasters that I want/have some version of:
Mitsukoshi (still not sure why only 300 of these were made.)
Apollo 15 35th anniversary in rose gold and black (1971 made)
Italian Grail (500 were made, iirc.)

These are, of course, mid-priced watches (and I feel slightly weird saying that, seeing that the median American salary, which is considerably higher than most other countries, is around $38K, and the median HHI is about $58K), but I assume that at the very high end, that an entire different set of considerations and stressors apply.