The perils of overdoing it.

[Film Noir Buff]

Originally Posted by yachtie

Ditch the Hermes and get a Pancaldi

Those are like replicas of the bold look of the late 1940s and i would imagine a great source for period reenactment. Actually I prefer those to that link that Andy put up a while back with the Simpsons and Jesus ties. How many do you ow?

 

[yachtie]

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

Those are like replicas of the bold look of the late 1940s and i would imagine a great source for period reenactment.

Actually I prefer those to that link that Andy put up a while back with the Simpsons and Jesus ties.

How many do you own?

More than I care to admit to here

 

[Film Noir Buff]

Originally Posted by yachtie

More than I care to admit to here

I hadbt known much about these until you brought them up. I only saw the ones on Amazon which had tha bold look too them; very Film Noir. They have a website, which you are undoubtedly aware of: http://www.pancaldities.com/Online_Store.html Interesting and quite avant garde. They carry an attention grabbing price as well. Is there something about them that you like and would care to comment on?

 

[John Ellis]

Originally Posted by DocHolliday

Thank goodness I don't need to do any of these things. Though I can't imagine my girlfriend would be impressed by children's storybook illustrations on my tie.

Well lucky for you. Quite few Americans do actually live in this sort of world including me I suppose. And some of the Hermes motifs are quite clever, one of mine, admittedly purchased some ten years ago, has some very interesting Mughal horse images.

 

[John Ellis]

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

I hadbt known much about these until you brought them up. I only saw the ones on Amazon which had tha bold look too them; very Film Noir.

They have a website, which you are undoubtedly aware of:

http://www.pancaldities.com/Online_Store.html


Interesting and quite avant garde. They carry an attention grabbing price as well. Is there something about them that you like and would care to comment on?

Is FDR wearing a film noir Pancaldi tie in this shot?

 

[Film Noir Buff]

Originally Posted by John Ellis

Is FDR wearing a film noir Pancaldi tie in this shot?
I cant really make it out. I doubt it though, he died before the bold look grabbed the country by the short and curlies. However, when FDR was alive, there was a long standing chic for Charvet style prints. These in turn provided inspiration for the "Bold Look" versions that Pancaldi does. In that respect he may have worn a proto-film-noir-pancaldi sort of tie. The only reason I would also call some of the pancaldi "bold look" ties film noirish is because of the tail end of the genre being filmed when that look was at its zenith.

 

[John Ellis]

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

I cant really make it out. I doubt it though, he died before the bold look grabbed the country by the short and curlies. However, when FDR was alive, there was a long standing chic for Charvet style prints. These in turn provided inspiration for the "Bold Look" versions that Pancaldi does. In that respect he may have worn a proto-film-noir-pancaldi sort of tie.

The only reason I would also call some of the pancaldi "bold look" ties film noirish is because of the tail end of the genre being filmed when that look was at its zenith.

If you enlarge the pic you can just about see he's wearing a bold motif on his tie and I've seen other pics of him full frontal in similar ties. When you say the look was at it's zenith do you mean late forties. I seem to remember Edward G wearing some fairly bold ties while Fred McMurray was studying Phyllis's ankle chain and I thought that movie was made in about 1945.

 

[mr monty]

Originally Posted by JayJay

I like to dress so that no particular item stands out. I don't try to be noticed but if I am, then I like for my overall appearance to be considered very well dressed.

You will stand out in Indianapolis if your shoes are polished

 

[Film Noir Buff]

Originally Posted by John Ellis

If you enlarge the pic you can just about see he's wearing a bold motif on his tie and I've seen other pics of him full frontal in similar ties. When you say the look was at it's zenith do you mean late forties. I seem to remember Edward G wearing some fairly bold ties while Fred McMurray was studying Phyllis's ankle chain and I thought that movie was made in about 1945.
Styles rarely come out of nowhere. I imagine there were some around in the mid 1940s. This still from Laura shows Webb wearing something that approaches the bold look. I think that ties were like socks back then, an impulse item that you wore then discarded. People wore their ties for everything back then, like fumbling for popcorn in a movie theatre so there was ampler opportunites to soil or snag them.

The bold look itself I think of as having more asymetrical patterns and a starburst of colors. There is a difference between the "Charvet abstract" and the Bold Look with the former usually starting off with better quality ingredients. Bold look ties were often shorter and wider while the Charvet school remained longer and somewhat standard in length. Having said that, some of the bold look ties have interesting designs/colors and were put on good silks; a lot of bold look went on man made fibers. I could see Bold Look ties as reinterpreted by Pancaldi having a following today as an example of the "Bubble gum" gangster/Elliot Ness look

 

[John Ellis]

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

Styles rarely come out of nowhere. I imagine there were some around in the mid 1940s. This still from Laura shows Webb wearing something that approaches the bold look. I think that ties were like socks back then, an impulse item that you wore then discarded. People wore their ties for everything back then, like fumbling for popcorn in a movie theatre so there was ampler opportunites to soil or snag them.

The bold look itself I think of as having more asymetrical patterns and a starburst of colors.

There is a difference between the "Charvet abstract" and the Bold Look with the former usually starting off with better quality ingredients. Bold look ties were often shorter and wider while the Charvet school remained longer and somewhat standard in length. Having said that, some of the bold look ties have interesting designs/colors and were put on good silks; a lot of bold look went on man made fibers.

I could see Bold Look ties as reinterpreted by Pancaldi having a following today as an example of the "Bubble gum" gangster/Elliot Ness look

That's exactly how I see these ties; bold abstract patterns and starbursts. In Key Largo Robinson who is playing a gangster wears classic bubble gum ties. In Double Indemnity he's an insurance investigator but still wears loud ties. As I recall it in The Woman in the Window where he's a lawyer he also had loud ties. The Blue Dahlia which was made in the late forties is also full of loud bubble gum ties as I recall.

 

[Film Noir Buff]

Originally Posted by John Ellis

That's exactly how I see these ties; bold abstract patterns and starbursts. In Key Largo Robinson who is playing a gangster wears classic bubble gum ties. In Double Indemnity he's an insurance investigator but still wears loud ties. As I recall it in The Woman in the Window where he's a lawyer he also had loud ties. The Blue Dahlia which was made in the late forties is also full of loud bubble gum ties as I recall.
I have a book in called "Fit to be Tied" which is a photo book of ties of this sort. Not a lot of text but tons of piccies and captions. If I remember, not only was there such a demand for new and innovative ties for the bold look that artists were encouraged to create and submit designs; including Dali!

 

[John Ellis]

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

I have a book in called "Fit to be Tied" which is a photo book of ties of this sort. Not a lot of text but tons of piccies and captions. If I remember, not only was there such a demand for new and innovative ties for the bold look that artists were encouraged to create and submit designs; including Dali!

Oh yes Dali definitely designed ties, but not Picasso. I can't imagine myself in them but then I'm an uber traditionalist but when you see pics of FDR wearing them it does lend a certain cachet to the practise since he's one of the two most stylish presidents of the last hundred years.

 

[JetBlast]

I don't understand the purpose of this conversation.

As far as I'm concerned (as with many other members of this forum, I would hope) I wear what looks good to me. If someone else doesn't happen to like the tweed I am wearing, so be it. Even if it may not be sartorial perfection, it still fits my own personal style and that's just how it works.

JB (proud owner of several eccentric suits fitting to 1986)

 

[Film Noir Buff]

Originally Posted by JetBlast

I don't understand the purpose of this conversation. As far as I'm concerned (as with many other members of this forum, I would hope) I wear what looks good to me. If someone else doesn't happen to like the tweed I am wearing, so be it. Even if it may not be sartorial perfection, it still fits my own personal style and that's just how it works. JB (proud owner of several eccentric suits fitting to 1986)
If you wear ecclectic things, then this conversation may not be for you but the purpose is finding a line that will allow a man to display his personality and not be perceived as peculiar. Sometimes that involves knowing oneself and sometimes it requires understanding the messages items of clothes or their combinations emit. I suppose I am always treading the line between nettling the Sherlock Holmes set and trying to appeal to the majority of men that want to wear clothes. They usually want to wear things that get them respect, a semblance of prosperity and admiration from their romantic interests. Thus, unless this is a website solely celebrating the tailoring of uphostery and the wearing of imperial moustaches with monocles, that's why we discuss the details of dressing well without being spectacular.

 

[DocHolliday]

Originally Posted by John Ellis

Well lucky for you. Quite few Americans do actually live in this sort of world including me I suppose. And some of the Hermes motifs are quite clever, one of mine, admittedly purchased some ten years ago, has some very interesting Mughal horse images.

This, though, is the point I've been trying to make. Not everyone shares the same situation. Were I a Wall Street banker, I would dress very differently than I do. Thankfully, I can afford some latitude others might not. At the same time, I don't indulge my tastes for suits often, as I simply don't have a good reason to wear them.

I resorted to snippiness to get my point across, and for that, I apologize. But I'd have enjoyed this thread a lot more had it been a question for forumites to answer rather than an edict from on high. The question itself is very valid, and I'd like to see more discussion of it around here.