Dinner Jacket/Tuxedo

[Sator]

Originally Posted by Manton

1) I have never had a flower stain the underside of my lapel, ever. Maybe I'm just lucky.

2) I prefer the old fashioned look of fewer studs. My marcella evening shirt takes three. If I had it to do over, I might opt for two. Old fashioned wing collar shirts often took only one. My RTW wing collar shirt takes four.

Traditionally the more formal the dress the less the display of jewelry. With proper full dress, one shirt stud is the most elegant configuration. Two or three are fine with 'informal dinner clothes' but no more.

Emily Post has some advice which is definitely still highly relevant:

In your jewelry let diamonds be conspicuous by their absence. Nothing is more vulgar than a display of "ice" on a man's shirt front, or on his fingers.

There is a good deal of jewelry that a gentleman may be allowed to wear, but it must be chosen with discrimination. Pearl shirt-studs (real ones) are correct for full dress only, and not to be worn with a dinner coat unless they are so small as to be entirely inconspicuous. Otherwise you may wear enamel studs (that look like white linen) or black onyx with a rim of platinum, or with a very inconspicuous pattern in diamond chips, but so tiny that they can not be told from a threadlike design in platinum"”or others equally moderate.​

Amen to that.

 

[UnFacconable]

Originally Posted by j

But if the stance is high, and the material is not lightweight, then a vest is going to be either pointless (won't show) or so high as to look odd (covering a lot of shirt), IMO, and probably will just serve to overheat you.

So I'd say don't bother.

Re the extra button, I don't think it would be worth the trouble/risk of reweaving the front to take out the buttonhole from the wool side, and from the silk side it would be even more risky if it's even possible at all. So just leave it - almost no one will know the difference, let alone care in this world of four-button notch lapel single vented dinner jackets.

Thanks J! This assuages my concerns. I did take another look last night and think that just about the only difference in cut would be that the quarters are slightly more closed than if it were a 1 button. I'll also skip out on the vest for the reasons you described.

 

[macuser3of5]

While on the subject, are satin lapels required in dinner jacket land? I've seen with and without, and wanted to get some clarification here.

 

[Edward Appleby]

Originally Posted by macuser3of5

While on the subject, are satin lapels required in dinner jacket land? I've seen with and without, and wanted to get some clarification here.

I was under the impression that satin or grosgrain facing was the essential and distinguishing feature of formalwear.

 

[j]

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

You say this like it's a bad thing.

Would you prefer wearing a well cut 4 notch lapel single vented dinner jacket in luxurious fabric or a rental in 100% dacron polyester that was otherwise "correct" in every detail?
Good question. Is there a box on the floor?

 

[ortolan]

Originally Posted by Sator

Traditionally the more formal the dress the less the display of jewelry. With proper full dress, one shirt stud is the most elegant configuration. Two or three are fine with 'informal dinner clothes' but no more.

Emily Post has some advice which is definitely still highly relevant:

In your jewelry let diamonds be conspicuous by their absence. Nothing is more vulgar than a display of "ice" on a man's shirt front, or on his fingers.

There is a good deal of jewelry that a gentleman may be allowed to wear, but it must be chosen with discrimination. Pearl shirt-studs (real ones) are correct for full dress only, and not to be worn with a dinner coat unless they are so small as to be entirely inconspicuous. Otherwise you may wear enamel studs (that look like white linen) or black onyx with a rim of platinum, or with a very inconspicuous pattern in diamond chips, but so tiny that they can not be told from a threadlike design in platinum"”or others equally moderate.​

Amen to that.

Sigh, will we get into quoting Emily Post for fashion advice? I would not recommend pearl (the spherical ones, mother of pearl is okay) studs or cufflinks for general black tie wear since they are somewhat effeminate, in my view.

I'm not sure if your quote is direct from the book or not. Perhaps I am showing my age when I dig out some of my references, but these are direct quotes:

"For evening wear, mother of pearl cufflinks are usually accompanied by matching studs. They may or may not have a circle of tiny diamonds around the edge. Darker pearl and black onyx are handsome with a tuxedo, and white gold or platinum may be worn. But other colored stones are to be avoided, especially if they are large and conspicuous. "[The New Emily Post's Etiquette, 1975, p. 838]​

In this version, she doesn't recommend colored stones, but allows for pearls, diamonds, and other white or black precious stones, and also on tie pins.

[...]"However, if you attend several black-tie events a year, you may want to invest in a set of studs and cufflinks. [...]" [The Amy Vanderbilt Complete Book of Etiquette, 1995, p. 79]​

"A watch is usually a man's first important jewelry purchase; cufflinks to wear with French cuffs come next; then finally, when and if he needs evening clothes, studs and matching cufflinks for his evening shirt."​

"`The well-dressed man,' to quote my well-dressed New York friend Edward Russell, is `someone whose jewelry you don't really quite notice, but when you finally do see a flash of something, it is always something of great quality and very quiet.'" [Letitia Baldridge's Complete Guide to Executive Manners, 1985, p. 143]​

Going to style books now:

"Around 1931, along with the new backdrop of Palm Beach's white dinner jacket, dress studs, and matching cuff links with colored stones created a stir. Cuff links with bright, colorful rubies, emeralds, or sapphires are still considered too ostentatious for day wear and reserved for after dark ceremonies. Sooner or later, every well-dressed man should acquire an antique set of studs. A proper dress set of jewelry includes a pair of double sided cuff links, two or three matching shirt studs, and no fewer than three waistcoat buttons." [Dressing the Man, Flusser, 2002, p. 228]​

"For dinner, theater, or the symphony, a simple black shift-style cocktail dress or a dinner suit dressed up with dazzling jewelry and other accessories." [Your Executive Image, Seitz, p. 106. Don't trust this book too much, though]​

"You still must wear cufflinks when you wear a tuxedo, and you should wear them with matching shirt studs. Black onyx cufflinks are appropriate for formalwear and for business attire. Other stones, such as emeralds, also can be tastefully worn with black tie attire, although they may be a bit flashy for businesswear. Mother of pearl cufflinks are most appropriate for white tie.'" [Indispensable guide to classic men's clothing, Karlan and Sulavik, 1999, p. 144]​

"studs: Removable decorative buttons, sometimes made with precious metals or gems, worn with a gentleman's formal shirt." [A Gentleman Gets Dressed Up, 2003, Bridges and Curtis, p. 96]​

I don't have all the style books on my bookshelf, I must confess, and the pedantic exercise of finding quotes and preaching them as gospel is tiresome. Perhaps you can furnish your own.

I cannot see where a man will go wrong with 4 studs for his basic set matched to his cufflinks, as I had originally pointed out. The preponderance of the evidence suggests that 3 or 2 or 1 may serve just as well, Manton always bringing great weight; hence, I will retract my generalization with some amusement. Nevertheless, I point out that 4 studs give the greatest flexibility.

There are very few items of jewelry a man is allowed to wear. There's a diamond on all Patek platinum watches since 2001, for example, at the 6 o'clock position, discretely placed (a hint for what happens at 6

)? Get the few things you can wear in the highest quality, and in the fashion you see fit, and with that flash of something, yes, in my view. Your comments on other people's jewelry are a bit strong, I would say, without seeing them directly. They can look fantastic, and white or black diamonds, quite elegant. Style and taste are not always the same, and while I may disagree with some of your comments, I respect them nonetheless.

--ortolan

 

[16520Man]

I am also ordering a bespoke black, single-button, peak lapel dinner jacket. My tailor suggests that I may use bone buttons, while I maintain that the buttons must be covered in fabric that matches the satin facing. What say The Rules?

I might have the answer on hand had I not lent out my copy of a certain book on the subject...

 

[Anthony Jordan]

Either, as far as I know; personally I prefer horn.