Chelsea boots – a little embarrassing?!

[JohnMRobie]

AE gets a lot of ****, but nearly every shoe thread is like this now. People want to talk about the SPI on the uppers, but not how the design is ugly or can't be worn in a tasteful way. If you bring up how something is potentially unwearable, people will suddenly be libertarian about it (e.g. "let him be," "everyone has their own taste," or "I'm sure he's already thought about it, so let's drop it"). They are not as libertarian when it comes to shoe construction, only design and how things can or should be worn.

The thread for Meccariello's shoes is just as bad as Allen Edmonds. Basically, any time a company lets you design your own shoe, people come out with the footwear equivalent of guys who order suit jackets with contrast buttonholes.

At least on the Meccariello thread people occasionally get bullied for buying weird shooz.

 

[Monsieur de Givenchy]

@dieworkwear you are kind of the doyen of this forum. What do you think should be the goal of the forum – what do you feel should be the etiquette. Let's try and formulate a kind of rule book. For instance, a few things I gleaned from your previous posts might be:
1) You cannot use the libertarian line of defense ("don't criticize another member's post and purchase") against style criticism for which the critic gives a stylistic, aesthetic or historical justification.
2) You should not praise a shoe or piece of clothing or accessory based on its technical merits alone. SF is about style. Style should always be part of the equation.
3) You would ideally try and always think holistically in terms of an overall look – when discussing shoes, consider what outfits they would go with. When discussing suits, consider what shoes would complement them.
4) Personal attacks are contrary to SF etiquette.

Why don't you use your expertise to perfect a list of these points and once you have them, you could post them as a new thread, like Luther nailed his 95 theses to his church door.

That could bring the change you want to see in the SF world?

 

[apShepard]

I think the Basic Bastard uniform is fine. You're not going to win any fashion awards with this uniform, but it's better than a lot of the hashtag menswear and shoe dandy stuff that's popular nowadays. That stuff makes guys look like the menswear version of furry.


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The first image is not a particullarly flattering version of the basic bastard. If you elevate the quality and fit of every piece you get something great. Besides the chelseas, @breakaway01 is wearing just come chinos and a button down.

 

[breakaway01]

The first image is not a particullarly flattering version of the basic bastard. If you elevate the quality and fit of every piece you get something great. Besides the chelseas, @breakaway01 is wearing just come chinos and a button down.

I think in defense of the basic bastard it is literally a place to start. What I wore today was totally boring in concept but I have been trying to execute these simple looks better.

However, it's hard to tell someone new to men's clothing that what they really need instead of an OCBD from Uniqlo and cotton chinos from J. Crew is a custom chambray shirt (and the requisite shirt or two to dial the fit in first), a pair of Doppiaa 5-pocket trousers that have this velour-ish finish so they are not-quite-chinos, and a pair of Chelsea boots. There are some faint echos of Western wear without looking obviously Western.

I have to echo DWW's recommendation to look at a lot of images of outfits. I am by no means a great dresser but I think I've come a long way from spending (way too much) time here. Really appreciate @dieworkwear 's contributions and his many photos.

 

[nh10222]

@dieworkwear you are kind of the doyen of this forum. What do you think should be the goal of the forum – what do you feel should be the etiquette. Let's try and formulate a kind of rule book. For instance, a few things I gleaned from your previous posts might be:

3) You would ideally try and always think holistically in terms of an overall look – when discussing shoes, consider what outfits they would go with. When discussing suits, consider what shoes would complement them.
4) Personal attacks are contrary to SF etiquette.

That could bring the change you want to see in the SF world?

Does he really want to see that change, or just to use 'rules' against others where socially expedient? He just drew attention to boots with a purple shaft that's invisible unless the wearer deliberately wants to show them off. That was judging footwear independently of an outfit.

 

[breakaway01]

Does he really want to see that change, or just to use 'rules' against others where socially expedient? He just drew attention to boots with a purple shaft that's invisible unless the wearer deliberately wants to show them off. That was judging footwear independently of an outfit.

In all seriousness, do you have any photos of those boots in an outfit? Whether you want to show them off or not, it seems like the simple act of sitting down or walking would expose the shaft. Trying to picture how I would wear them and not sure.

 

[nh10222]

In all seriousness, do you have any photos of those boots in an outfit? Whether you want to show them off or not, it seems like the simple act of sitting down or walking would expose the shaft. Trying to picture how I would wear them and not sure.

No. I often wore them with grey odd trousers with a generous cut and full break, and they mostly just looked like black shoes.
In circumstances where indecent exposure of the shaft was anticipated, I wouldn't wear them.

Anyway, I bought the purple shafts in 2012 after tiring of wearing Oxford shoes every day, along with a number of other pairs over the next few years, posting photos of some of them for everyone to poke fun at, years later. Once again, I'd like to thank dww for his genuine interest in that phase of my life. It's reassuring to know he's looking out for me.

 

[KarlHungus]

Can we quit all the slappy fighting in this thread? It's very unbecoming for those of us who are trying to perfect our effeminately masculine (and highly classy, of course) aesthetic.

 

[KarlHungus]

So in the spirit of trying to keep this thread on track, I wore Chelsea boots today. Forgive the work bathroom selfie but at least the mirror’s clean.
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But did you feel "a little embarrass[ed]" while doing so?

 

[nh10222]

Can we quit all the slappy fighting in this thread? It's very unbecoming for those of us who are trying to perfect our effeminately masculine (and highly classy, of course) aesthetic.

It won't happen while even the godfathers of the forum aren't leading by example, but my apologies.

 

[Monsieur de Givenchy]

Does he really want to see that change, or just to use 'rules' against others where socially expedient? He just drew attention to boots with a purple shaft that's invisible unless the wearer deliberately wants to show them off. That was judging footwear independently of an outfit.

We'll see from his reaction if he would want to help and formulate a set of moral commandments and statement of purpose. I think it might be good inspiration for everybody joining this forum. There is no reason for there to be any hostility whatsoever on a forum like this.

I think your green suede balmorals are daring, but I can absolutely imagine an outfit where they would work. Like imagine them with a green trachten jacket with a velvet lapel. A daring, modern shoe that still makes a nod to traditionalism is pretty much the only way something like that would not look like a costume. That's just the first idea that comes to my mind. I'm sure there are a thousand others.

Take care.

 

[Monsieur de Givenchy]

But did you feel "a little embarrass[ed]" while doing so?

I've actually been embarrassed into buying a pair myself!

 

[breakaway01]

We'll see from his reaction if he would want to help and formulate a set of moral commandments and statement of purpose. I think it might be good inspiration for everybody joining this forum. There is no reason for there to be any hostility whatsoever on a forum like this.

Take care.

I think there is a difference between criticism and hostility. I will say that one difference on the “old” SF is that people were much more willing to speak their minds, both for the better and the worse. In my line of work I am used to hearing criticism. Not all of it is on target but a lot of it is valid and useful.
I think that sometimes criticism is construed only negatively and as a attack. In most endeavors in life, criticism is a necessary avenue for improvement.

 

[dieworkwear]

We'll see from his reaction if he would want to help and formulate a set of moral commandments and statement of purpose. I think it might be good inspiration for everybody joining this forum. There is no reason for there to be any hostility whatsoever on a forum like this.

Don't think of myself as anything except another member on this forum, and I'm just voicing my opinion like anyone else on here. Don't intend to write a list of rules for everyone on the forum. 95% of the people on here don't even know I exist, let alone care about what I have to say.

I came into this forum because I was looking for information about suits, and found a community of people here who were very knowledgeable about classic men's style. Over time, I feel that the forum has become more about shopping and shoes. Many others here have complained about this; I'm certainly not the first one. When I first read these complaints, I felt they were gatekeeping and putting up an unreasonable standard for participation (back then, some of the complaints were about how many bespoke customers were leaving the forum, which feels classist and exclusionary to me, as not many people can afford quality custom tailoring). I think it's good that this forum is no longer just about bespoke clothes, but do wish that it was more focused on how to dress well.

I do feel that the changes on this forum are linked to many other things, which has already been discussed. It's hard to build out the entire ecosystem that previously supported what I feel was a rich discussion on this forum. There used to be a very rich online ecosystem that I think went underappreciated. People would consume tons of online media about Ivy Style, Italian style, conservative business dress, etc. A lot of that media is still available, but it's not updated. It would be unreasonable to expect all of that media to now be hosted on the forum. This site isn't set up for that kind of thing. I don't really know the solution, although I think having an interest in the larger project of trying to dress well, not just shopping and collecting, is a good first step.

 

[nh10222]

We'll see from his reaction if he would want to help and formulate a set of moral commandments and statement of purpose. I think it might be good inspiration for everybody joining this forum. There is no reason for there to be any hostility whatsoever on a forum like this.

I think your green suede balmorals are daring, but I can absolutely imagine an outfit where they would work. Like imagine them with a green trachten jacket with a velvet lapel. A daring, modern shoe that still makes a nod to traditionalism is pretty much the only way something like that would not look like a costume. That's just the first idea that comes to my mind. I'm sure there are a thousand others.

Take care.

I don't recall ever actually buying any boots with green suede, but if I did, and posted them here, I'm sure someone would know.
Most have grey, black, brown, buff/sand shafts. The purple shaft was an oddity, but the boots work well with with grey, blue and black trousers in informal urban settings.