Are Neckties Going To Go The Way Of Bowties?

[pasadena man]

Agreed. Which is why I may think sharper in calf. I am very lazy, need some tension.

After a night’s reflection I have come up with my personal “Maslow hierarchy” of the right leather for a given job:

-Writing a spending proposal-calf (Church’s oxford)

-Writing a long-term strategy document-cordovan, the leather built to last (vintage Florsheim 93605 LWB, manufactured 1981)

-Writing/attending a cultural program or planning a vacation-suede (C & J derby).

-Planning an exotic vacation or adventure travel-alligator (vintage Edwin Clapp NST).

 

[dieworkwear]

Curious around the pocket square reference, any 101s or firm guidance as I begin to build out a collection?

I don't think there are any "firm rules" besides "don't buy pocket squares in matching tie sets." I suppose I would add, "don't buy solid colored pocket squares, except for white." But most people on here would never do either of those things in the first place.

If you're wearing a pocket square with a tie, the general idea is to not match the tie too closely -- either pick up a small color or complement a major color. So if you're wearing a navy tie with small green dots, choose a pocket square with a yellow or green base. A soft yellow square will complement the navy base of the tie. A green one will pick up the green dots.

If you're not wearing a tie, then I think you can just coordinate according to your jacket. I try to choose things that feel at home with the color, texture, and "mood" of the jacket. A spring/summer wool-silk-linen sport coat has a bit of sheen, so I try to choose matte squares with "summer" colors.

When done well, a classic tailored outfit has so few points for personal expression, as so many things are restricted. Jacket colors are generally blue, tan, olive, etc. You rarely see things like purple or orange. Shirts are also generally white or light blue. I think a pocket square can be a bit of an individual expression, so just buy whatever you like. Everyone says that the only pocket square you need is a white linen, but I never wear mine. I mostly wear patterned squares from Drake's, Rubinacci, Rumisu, and Christian Kimber because I like the designs, but the designs mostly stay hidden anyway. It just ends up being a spot of color on your jacket.

FWIW, I find it's useful to have some squares that are matte (often wool-silk blends, but sometimes also thin cotton) and sheen (pure silk). Sometimes a shiny pocket square doesn't look right on a jacket, whereas some jackets (e.g. tweed) look better with that hint of sheen. If you buy things with different sheen levels (matte versus shine) and colors (dark base versus light base), then I think you'll have most situations covered. And white linen, I suppose, since that's supposed to be obligatory. They're not expensive, anyway.

 

[TheChihuahua]

Curious around the pocket square reference, any 101s or firm guidance as I begin to build out a collection?

you might want to check out solid colored pocket squares (besides white).
Your tie will generally have a pattern, your shirt might have a pattern. While it is perfectly fine to contrast patterns, sometimes doing so causes added distraction. If your tie has some activity, it is easier to compliment it if the pocket square is toned down (and Vice versa)

blues (especially lights), differing shades of grey, lighter to medium browns, creams and off whites are all very versatile.

solid pocket squares are probably better off for the more neatly folded pocket square, as opposed to the more flamboyant puff or exotic folds. And linen or cotton ones are a bit more subtle and to me tend to hold their fold better than the more glossy/shiny and flowing silk.
Although, most patterned pocket squares will ultimately have a solid border, so you can still accomplish this solid thin line above your breast pocket even if you purchase some pattern ones.

if you are going with a no tie look, getting more adventurous with the pocket square and making it more of a focal point is less complicated, so swing away at some louder and more showy ones if you want.
I wouldn’t overthink the pattern though as it won’t really be visible. Only the color shows. More about sheen and primary color than about artistic appreciation.

some pocket squares will actually give you some diversity in what colors to display (say parts of the center are blue and the edges are red or something, you can opt for either depending on how you fold it)

 

[dieworkwear]

Get a string of solid colored pocket squares -- solid red, purple, blue, white, yellow, green, etc. And then when the right moment arises, pull them out of your breast pocket like a magician.

 

[Goofy]

I can’t remember the last time I wore a necktie, but I wear pocket squares on a regular basis. I prefer offerings from Ramply&Co, Simonnot Goddard, Poszetka, New & Lingwood, Turnball & Asser and Vanda. The past year I’ve grown my PS collection by a lot, while my neckties are just gathering dust.

Just make sure when considering silk PS‘s that they are large enough so they don’t sink into your pocket and disappear out of view.

 

[TheChihuahua]

A nice solid pocket square (or a very subtle border) is a good way to go…. Loud and showy ones are risky

here are some examples.
(And I tend to think the folds that look like an actual fold work better than the puffs or the flower petal style folds, which look more like intentional sprezzatura than a natural accessory)

now if your tie is solid, it makes it easier to go with a pattern. Of course patterns on ties can be matched with patterns on pocket squares, but it’s just an extra thing to think about.
(also this is a great subtle pocket square with a nice fold and would go with most patterned ties as

you should probably try to avoid this type of look, where the pocket square screams out for attention and looks out of place.

 

[apShepard]

A nice solid pocket square (or a very subtle border) is a good way to go…. Loud and showy ones are risky

here are some examples.

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now if your tie is solid, it makes it easier to go with a pattern. Of course patterns on ties can be matched with patterns on pocket squares, but it’s just an extra thing to think about.
(also this is a great subtle pocket square with a nice fold and would go with most patterned ties as


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you should probably try to avoid this type of look, where the pocket square screams out for attention and looks out of place.

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All of those except one are white. I have to disagree, solid PS except white look bad.

 

[TheChihuahua]

All of those except one are white. I have to disagree, solid PS except white look bad.

Only 2 are white.

1 is beige or tan or lighting brown
2 is green
3 is blue
4 is a darker brown or blue
5 is white
6 is blue
7 is white

I actually think the two white ones look among the worst. Especially #5 (#7 is ok, I like it better than #4)

the others are nice.

and the subtle pattern with the solid tie is nice.

the last picture is a good example of how not to wear a pocket square.

 

[TheChihuahua]

If you are going without a tie, a little louder pocket square, maybe a more pronounced pattern, is a lot easier and probably a better move. A bit more showy fold as well.

 

[twodice1]

I don't think there are any "firm rules" besides "don't buy pocket squares in matching tie sets." I suppose I would add, "don't buy solid colored pocket squares, except for white." But most people on here would never do either of those things in the first place.

If you're wearing a pocket square with a tie, the general idea is to not match the tie too closely -- either pick up a small color or complement a major color. So if you're wearing a navy tie with small green dots, choose a pocket square with a yellow or green base. A soft yellow square will complement the navy base of the tie. A green one will pick up the green dots.

If you're not wearing a tie, then I think you can just coordinate according to your jacket. I try to choose things that feel at home with the color, texture, and "mood" of the jacket. A spring/summer wool-silk-linen sport coat has a bit of sheen, so I try to choose matte squares with "summer" colors.

When done well, a classic tailored outfit has so few points for personal expression, as so many things are restricted. Jacket colors are generally blue, tan, olive, etc. You rarely see things like purple or orange. Shirts are also generally white or light blue. I think a pocket square can be a bit of an individual expression, so just buy whatever you like. Everyone says that the only pocket square you need is a white linen, but I never wear mine. I mostly wear patterned squares from Drake's, Rubinacci, Rumisu, and Christian Kimber because I like the designs, but the designs mostly stay hidden anyway. It just ends up being a spot of color on your jacket.

FWIW, I find it's useful to have some squares that are matte (often wool-silk blends, but sometimes also thin cotton) and sheen (pure silk). Sometimes a shiny pocket square doesn't look right on a jacket, whereas some jackets (e.g. tweed) look better with that hint of sheen. If you buy things with different sheen levels (matte versus shine) and colors (dark base versus light base), then I think you'll have most situations covered. And white linen, I suppose, since that's supposed to be obligatory. They're not expensive, anyway.

Think within the patterns it’s open season or is there a balance of styles (floral, paisley, jacquard, full on images, polka etc.) or balance of colors?

 

[dieworkwear]

Think within the patterns it’s open season or is there a balance of styles (floral, paisley, jacquard, full on images, polka etc.) or balance of colors?

I don't think pocket square patterns are seasonal. That said, the patterns you listed feel very "necktie" to me. I don't think I would wear a jacquard pocket square.

Nearly all my squares have a pattern that you don't see on ties. I mostly go by sheen (sometimes a matte square against a shinier jacket, or a shiny square against a matte jacket). And colors.

Just some random examples:

I took these photos hastily and they're not color corrected, so read this with that in mind. That said, above is a cream-colored sport coat I own. It's the color of oatmeal. The check is off-white. I typically wear this with darker trousers.

I find that very dark pocket squares don't look right in this jacket, as it stands out too much against the light-colored cloth. Since I only wear this jacket in the spring and summer months, I also try to choose pocket squares that have that spring/ summer feeling. So here, I've paired it with different Christian Kimber pocket squares. His designs are inspired by traveling and different cities, including places in Vietnam, where my family is from. So I choose the square because 1) it's a lighter colored square against a lighter colored coat, thus not making it stand out too much in an outfit; 2) it has summer colors; and 3) it has personal meaning.

The color blew out on these two photos, but this is navy Mock Leno sport coat. The navy has a slightly warm tone to it. I wore this yesterday with tan trousers and a light blue OCBD. I went with a Kelim pocket square from Drake's because it has similarly warm colors. And a reasonably dark base. Again, when a square isn't balanced out with a tie, I don't like it to stand out too much. When it stands out too much, I think the square looks distracting, rather than harmonizing.

But like the previous choice, this feels reasonably summer-y to me. The warm colors pick up the warm colors in the jacket. And I really like Drake's as a brand, so the square again has personal meaning.

The color here again blew out a little, but this jacket is a very dark brown Donegal tweed (looks mid-brown in this photo). Since this is a fall jacket, I like to choose autumnal colors -- the green Drake's pocket square has hints of orange and yellow that complement the flecks in the jacket. The red Ralph Lauren pocket square is a pure silk piece that has a small floret pattern. The square almost has a chalky, ancient madder like feel, but also a subtle sheen that balances out the matte look of the tweed. In the fall, I like to wear a silk square because I find it helps balance out all the matte texture in an outfit (e.g. flannel trousers, tweed jacket, oxford cloth, suede shoes, etc).

Again, both squares do the same things as the others above: 1) don't stand out too much, 2) complement the jacket, and 3) have personal meaning. I'm a big fan of Ralph Lauren, as I got into classic men's clothing in the 90s because I admired his line.

Very little of a pocket square will show when worn. So even if your pocket square has paisleys, or whatever, it's probably not going to read as paisley, but rather the dominant base color (sometimes called the ground) and the secondary and tertiary colors in the pattern. I would go by the colors and the sheen. I mostly dislike squares that look cheap -- solid-colored squares look like something you buy at prom shops, tuxedo rental places, or The Tie Bar. Pocket squares can sometimes be made from remnant fabrics, but I dislike ones that look too much like shirting or necktie silk. However, so much of this is personal, I would just go by what you like and what looks right in the morning.

 

[comrade]

The last time I wore a tie was in January 2021 on a Zoom
celebration of my grand daughters' 13th birthday. When she
was younger she loved when I wore a jacket and tie, something
her Dad, a tech executive, gave up years ago. In this case it was a butterfly
bow tie that my late mother bought for me in London over 50 years ago.
It was worn w/ a H& K oxford shirt , Wlikes Bashford Cashmere blazer
from Belvest in a wonderful cut that is perfect for me from around 2012.

 

[TheChihuahua]

I think a key to a good pocket square is that it doesn’t draw too much attention to itself. It compliments the outfit and makes sense. I like some of these examples.

I don’t like these so much
I think these tend to be too showy and don’t seem to fit in with anything. Makes me wonder why they are there, other than just to accessorize but not much though as to how they fit the outfit. Either because the colors just seem out of place with the rest of the outfit.

or in the second to last example it just seems too big and pronounced with the fold so it doesn’t make sense to me (blue jacket with t-shirt)
Compare that with the similar blue jacket and white pocket square I do like, and the folds aren’t that much different. But the one I like the wearer has a more formal shirt and the more pronounced pocket square bounces off nicely. The one I don’t like the outfit seems confusing.

I think with thelast one, if the gentleman had more of a fold than a puff that would actually be pretty nice.

 

[double00]

pocket squares are functional ? i could see linen or otherwise washable but

when is the last time you *used* a pocket square ? an interesting foil to the tie bar

 

[am55]

I think a key to a good pocket square is that it doesn’t draw too much attention to itself. It compliments the outfit and makes sense. I like some of these examples.
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I don’t like these so much
I think these tend to be too showy and don’t seem to fit in with anything. Makes me wonder why they are there, other than just to accessorize but not much though as to how they fit the outfit. Either because the colors just seem out of place with the rest of the outfit.

or in the second to last example it just seems too big and pronounced with the fold so it doesn’t make sense to me (blue jacket with t-shirt)
Compare that with the similar blue jacket and white pocket square I do like, and the folds aren’t that much different. But the one I like the wearer has a more formal shirt and the more pronounced pocket square bounces off nicely. The one I don’t like the outfit seems confusing.

I think with thelast one, if the gentleman had more of a fold than a puff that would actually be pretty nice.
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I think context has flipped it. In a world where nobody is wearing a suit, you have to go all the way and mean it. In your second set of photos the bearded chap with the burgundy tie looks particularly striking.