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Experience with Prep Schools?? - Page 7

post #91 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by yachtie View Post
You really have to love doing it (proofs)and it does take a particular type of person to succeed in the upper level classes. My major was so math heavy that I took a few more "fun" classes to get the minor. A lot of the BS math majors I know wound up in finance (analysis/modeling), the rest went on for PhD's.

I think a lot of people get fooled into thinking that the math major will be just like taking a bunch of high level calc and algebra classes, then get totally blindsided by the huge swing in the higher level classes when it's all about proofs and formalisms and such (not a math major, don't interrogate me on the details).

Hell, I'm a physical chemist and I know I wouldn't have been able to hack it as a physics major. The reliance on proof-based understanding was simply too high. I can *do* the proofs, but I don't learn much from it and certainly don't enjoy it. Sitting down and deriving Schrodinger's or Maxwell's Equation for a semester would have driven me batty. My wife is also a chemist (polymer) and struggled mightily in bio classes. Pretty subtle differences between what makes people suitable for one major over another, beyond simple raw intelligence and work ethic.
post #92 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post
I think a lot of people get fooled into thinking that the math major will be just like taking a bunch of high level calc and algebra classes, then get totally blindsided by the huge swing in the higher level classes when it's all about proofs and formalisms and such (not a math major, don't interrogate me on the details). Hell, I'm a physical chemist and I know I wouldn't have been able to hack it as a physics major. The reliance on proof-based understanding was simply too high. I can *do* the proofs, but I don't learn much from it and certainly don't enjoy it. Sitting down and deriving Schrodinger's or Maxwell's Equation for a semester would have driven me batty. My wife is also a chemist (polymer) and struggled mightily in bio classes. Pretty subtle differences between what makes people suitable for one major over another, beyond simple raw intelligence and work ethic.
Too true. There's no way I could handle chem and bio (my wife) is completely off the table for me.
post #93 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by HEARTLESS-531 View Post
Interesting thoughts, sir. What about a math major? It just seems to me that I rarely hear about undregrads majoring in math. Is it dated? I know I'm straying a bit here, but interesting topics

Statistics these days can honestly be a road to riches in many ways in my experience. Analytics and applied math are arguably some of the very hottest areas right now due to the explosion of data and increasing interest in consumer insights and predictive modeling.

So I think stats, operational research and other applied math majors are very interesting and likely a good investment if you are good and enjoy it as well.

Also, one can combine the above with an MBA and likely have an enhanced chance of getting into a top employer like Google and SAS or a top 3 consultancy.

There is perhaps more of a need for a business-minded person to translate analytics know-how in simple language to senior managers. It is also valuable in presenting the business case for analytics or a specific analytics project.

The beauty of it all is that many applied math skills work on both the risk side of business and the marketing side.
post #94 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by HEARTLESS-531 View Post
OK. Back on topic because I'm a little lost with this New York thing and I've just had two glasses of kick ass Sicilian chianti. Ok. We have interviews at Choate, Deerfield, Exeter, St. Georges. You guys want pics or just the bare facts? Lemme know. Thanks. P.S. I love Toby Keith, especially that 'Stays In Mexico' song.
Thanks Dashaansafin (aureh, Baba, Concerned Parent, and mjphillips).

all are excellent choice, when I was visiting I liked Deerfield the most, not particular reason come to mind
post #95 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by HEARTLESS-531 View Post
Interesting thoughts, sir. What about a math major? It just seems to me that I rarely hear about undregrads majoring in math. Is it dated? I know I'm straying a bit here, but interesting topics

There are still people major in math., and probably the logic route if you want to get a phd in math. I would not do math as the only major if I am only getting undergrad., not specialized enough to compete with engineering (except maybe Operation Research, depends on what the guy did), but not good enough to be true mathematician. Science degree w/o phd is always kind stuck in the middle except CS I guess..., though lots of MS in science become more engineering oriented these days.

I consider myself pretty good at math., until I had to go to some phd level class with the real math major it was frustrating but interesting experience... (I was doing phd in EE, didn't finish it, left after MS, because my advisor, had to minor in applied math at the time).
post #96 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by yachtie View Post
You really have to love doing it (proofs)and it does take a particular type of person to succeed in the upper level classes. My major was so math heavy that I took a few more "fun" classes to get the minor. A lot of the BS math majors I know wound up in finance (analysis/modeling), the rest went on for PhD's.

I actually don't see that many math. major (compare to engineering anyway) in finance (especially before phd). Maybe more quant. fund, though I thought those guys really want CS major most of the time (ideally you can do math and can code well, but not the case for everyone).
post #97 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artisan Fan View Post
Statistics these days can honestly be a road to riches in many ways in my experience. Analytics and applied math are arguably some of the very hottest areas right now due to the explosion of data and increasing interest in consumer insights and predictive modeling.

So I think stats, operational research and other applied math majors are very interesting and likely a good investment if you are good and enjoy it as well.

Also, one can combine the above with an MBA and likely have an enhanced chance of getting into a top employer like Google and SAS or a top 3 consultancy.

There is perhaps more of a need for a business-minded person to translate analytics know-how in simple language to senior managers. It is also valuable in presenting the business case for analytics or a specific analytics project.

The beauty of it all is that many applied math skills work on both the risk side of business and the marketing side.

Well, a math. major does OR will usually likely to beat the OR guys. No offense, but OR at undergrad. degree are mostly people who can't do CS/EE/ME... I think OR is a very useful degree, especially if they know what they want out of it. If I can go back I would probably do a CS/OR combination, or CS/ECON with a few courses in OR.
post #98 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artisan Fan View Post
Statistics these days can honestly be a road to riches in many ways in my experience. Analytics and applied math are arguably some of the very hottest areas right now due to the explosion of data and increasing interest in consumer insights and predictive modeling. So I think stats, operational research and other applied math majors are very interesting and likely a good investment if you are good and enjoy it as well. Also, one can combine the above with an MBA and likely have an enhanced chance of getting into a top employer like Google and SAS or a top 3 consultancy. There is perhaps more of a need for a business-minded person to translate analytics know-how in simple language to senior managers. It is also valuable in presenting the business case for analytics or a specific analytics project. The beauty of it all is that many applied math skills work on both the risk side of business and the marketing side.
Of course none of these are as fun as pure math, but then you need a PhD to get a job.
post #99 of 147
ok maybe it's different in the northeast, but where I'm from, and I assume in most of 'football country' private schools are not big enough to field competitive football teams. but i can understand that NY area public schools would suck at everything

Quote:
Originally Posted by yachtie View Post
Of course none of these are as fun as pure math, but then you need a PhD to get a job.

however, they're actually useful to society. i wouldn't push a kid into doing an OR degree though and i agree w/ the other poster that it's pretty useless at the undergrad level
post #100 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by scientific View Post
ok maybe it's different in the northeast, but where I'm from, and I assume in most of 'football country' private schools are not big enough to field competitive football teams. but i can understand that NY area public schools would suck at everything

The overall level of football in the NE sucks, but throughout the south at least private school field very competitive teams and typically punch above their weight in terms of athletics (well, except for basketball).
Isn't a school like Southlake like 6,000 students though? I remember reading something to the effect that some school districts in Texas won't redraw because they want huge schools so they have a larger pool of football players and better teams.
post #101 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjphillips View Post
The overall level of football in the NE sucks, but throughout the south at least private school field very competitive teams and typically punch above their weight in terms of athletics (well, except for basketball).
Isn't a school like Southlake like 6,000 students though? I remember reading something to the effect that some school districts in Texas won't redraw because they want huge schools so they have a larger pool of football players and better teams.

This is a little bit of a silly tangent. Yes, your typical prep school football team would get CRUSHED by some of the big Texas/Florida schools, but its not like Maurice Clarett or Willie Williams are going to find themselves at Choate or Andover.

Many of the kids who play football in prep school will go on to play for schools that recruit good (but not elite) level talent, AND have legitimate academic standards. A big number of them will go into the Ivy league, and a big group will go to the 'elite' colleges that compete at the D3 level - Amherst, Williams, etc.

In terms of overall competitiveness, if you adjusted for school size, I'm pretty sure that prep schools could compete pound-for-pound with anywhere else. If you adjusted for SAT scores as well, I guarantee they could.

And as a side note, MaxPreps top 4 high school football teams are all private schools (granted, Catholic schools, not classic 'prep' schools).
post #102 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by yachtie View Post
Of course none of these are as fun as pure math, but then you need a PhD to get a job.

Well I would argue they are much more fun but in any event the pure math jobs are not as plentiful as applied math in my experience.
post #103 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by tj100 View Post
In terms of overall competitiveness, if you adjusted for school size, I'm pretty sure that prep schools could compete pound-for-pound with anywhere else. If you adjusted for SAT scores as well, I guarantee they could.

I mean, maybe. If similar-sized private schools from Massachusetts & Virginia played each other, my money would be on VA. New England's not exactly a hotbed of athletic talent. Not sure how one "adjusts" a football team for SAT scores, other than assuming the schools have comparable academic standards. Agreed this is a silly tangent though.
post #104 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjphillips View Post
I mean, maybe. If similar-sized private schools from Massachusetts & Virginia played each other, my money would be on VA. New England's not exactly a hotbed of athletic talent. Not sure how one "adjusts" a football team for SAT scores, other than assuming the schools have comparable academic standards. Agreed this is a silly tangent though.

I'm not sure which way that would go. The draw for New England prep schools is national (and international), so it's not like you can compare "Massachusetts" talent to "Virginia" talent just because that's where the schools are. Regardless, my comparison was holding everything constant except the public/private nature of the school; not sure how geography would compare.
post #105 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by scientific View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by yachtie
Of course none of these are as fun as pure math, but then you need a PhD to get a job.
however, they're actually useful to society. i wouldn't push a kid into doing an OR degree though and i agree w/ the other poster that it's pretty useless at the undergrad level
Your view forward is too short. The stuff math PhD's do is fundamentally important but the practical results are usually a generation or two out. Can't describe it if you don't have the tools. The mathematicians provide the tools.
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