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Originally Posted by mmkn

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I think L&L has perfected what I see as "masculine" in a jacket with MM's jacket.

If one were to extrapolate to the muscles beneath, MM's bicep/tricep - deltoid/trapezius -pectoralis complex is very pleasing to the eye and masculine in presentation. The more openly cut quarters accentuate this even further. It is almost like the fishmouth notch point the eyes towards this comples. This is truly art in clothing.

Yours B., the deltoid/trapzezius is a little small proportionally and less delineated relative to the other two groups of muscles. Subtle, but as a part of the whole it makes a difference [to these eyes anyway].

- M

Would you be able to masturbate as eloquently were MaoMao to all of a sudden reveal that the jacket was some MTM effort from China?

Originally Posted by lee_44106

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Would you be able to masturbate as eloquently were MaoMao to all of a sudden reveal that the jacket was some MTM effort from China?

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- B

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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Northern Italian (Milanese) RTW on the right...mid 1990s Luciano Barbera for Louis, Boston.

MM looks like he has a longer torso, with the breast pocket very low and buttoning point high on his jacket, even considering differences in body proportions. In comparison to the Barbera, it looks like someone stretched the middle part of the jacket from the gorge to the tops of the hip pockets, and moved the buttons up a bit. Bespoke fit vs. RTW perhaps to better suit his proportions?

That said, I like it. It looks kind of slouchy and soft in comparison, too, and the shoulder/sleeve cap area looks awesome.

--Andre

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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I'm fascinated by the commentary. Everyone: please continue.


- B

I will ask Hans and Fritz for some sartorial Denazification of this thread.

Originally Posted by A Y

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It looks kind of slouchy and soft in comparison
--Andre

And it also looks like meow -IS- slouching while Billy is not.

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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Too late.

- B

That's some serious chest lettuce right there.

Originally Posted by coolpapaboze

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That's some serious chest lettuce right there.

He shaved too before going out that night.

I don't know if this is what is meant by sleeve pitch, but the angle formed by the seam between the shoulder and chest piece seems quite a bit more tilted from the vertical in maomao's coat than in the other comparison coats. I suppose that's also a result of the more extended shoulder?

Originally Posted by Douglas

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I don't know if this is what is meant by sleeve pitch, but the angle formed by the seam between the shoulder and chest piece seems quite a bit more tilted from the vertical in maomao's coat than in the other comparison coats. I suppose that's also a result of the more extended shoulder?

I noticed that, too, but I don't think that's sleeve pitch. Here's an explanation with some pictures of sleeve pitch:

http://www.englishcut.com/archives/000184.html

If you imagine the sleeve swinging forwards and backwards as you view a jacket from the side, the pitch is the angle where the sleeve will hang.

--Andre

Mao, that's a really nice finished product. Look forward to seeing your other projects from Liverano as they're completed.

Great pictures, and great coat. Thanks for sharing!

Originally Posted by bcate3

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Mao, is the shoulder more extended than some of your other jackets? If so, is it a new direction for you or is it the style of L&L?

I do have other jackets with extended shoulders and they are all Neapolitan in origin, Kiton, Panico comes to mind. I must say I prefer this style as it gives the illusion of a tapered waist without having to actually cut a very close fitting jacket that may be uncomfortable.

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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Northern Italian (Milanese) RTW on the right...mid 1990s Luciano Barbera for Louis, Boston.


- B

Other than bespoke fit versus OTR fit, the main difference to me is in the overall roundness of the Liverano versus the more angular cut of the Milanese jacket. In my view, the liverano jacket has a lot of Northern Italian details, but executed in a Southern Italian, relaxed way.

Originally Posted by srivats

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You have to remember that one is bespoke and one is RTW.

But yes, maomao's jacket looks really really nice - it is more "maomao's" than "Liverano's". I like this far better than any other italian jackets posted in the forum (including MBT/rubinacci).

We spent quite a bit of time discussing how to make the jacket for me. On areas where we agree for example, both Antonio and I wanted to cut the lapels wider, but for different reasons. He thinks the wide lapel helps to balance the wider chest, while for me, I wanted wide lapels to balance my wider face. We both wanted to have front and back drape for movement. We also had ideas the other did not think of, for example I made very specific requests to have no padding for the shoulders at all, and Antonio was very specific on where the button point should be, despite my initial doubt. I think the input from both the customer and the tailor was able to make this a very personal commission. I still look like me in this jacket, and there is no mistake, from the details and execution, that this is a Liverano jacket as well.

Originally Posted by teddieriley

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Backlash will be forthcoming momentariliy.

10 pages and no backlash yet, is SF growing more patient?

Originally Posted by fritzl

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noice.

update on the shoes?

Will be ready in the summer. When they are finished, will update the thread.

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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Let's compare something really different:

- B

On the right, the headless, late Elliot Richardson.

Originally Posted by maomao1980

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Will be ready in the summer. When they are finished, will update the thread.

thanks for not forgetting the shoe geeks

Originally Posted by maomao1980

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Other than bespoke fit versus OTR fit, the main difference to me is in the overall roundness of the Liverano versus the more angular cut of the Milanese jacket. In my view, the liverano jacket has a lot of Northern Italian details, but executed in a Southern Italian, relaxed way.

I really like your L&L jacket, as I noted in my first post in this thread. And I've also enjoyed the lark of putting up the Saint Andrews next to it. The comments have been fascinating.

The L&L is superior in nearly every way. I do think some of the comments comparing the two go a little overboard in the sense that some of the differences attributed cut and make seem to me to be more differences of fabric (mine apparently being much thicker) and how we are standing in the photos (I am, of course, more robotic.)

The solitary thing that I does not wow me about L&L is how the sleeves fall. Your example shows what has struck me in other photographs:



If I didn't know the makers and I only saw the sleeves, I would have to say that the Saint Andrews shows more finesse and desirable shape.

Otherwise, your jacket is really swell. I look forward to seeing more of your L&Ls as you have them made up.


- B