Sydney musings (Nakhle, Cucinelli, Canali, Faconnable)

[Balthazar]

So just a few tidbits of information that I've learned recently that I thought I'd pass along. Some of it is probably old news but I'm sharing just in case.

Had dinner in Woollahra recently and noticed that there's a Brunello Cucinelli store there now. Went back the next day and the saleswoman told me they had been there for a year or so. Who knew? It's not like it was the first time in a year I'd been there. I guess I just missed it before. Prices are ridiculous as you might expect. Ian has nothing to worry about there as far as my business is concerned.

Other shops which I believe actually are new: Canali (can't remember exact location but near Zegna I think) and Faconnable (just down from Vince Maloney's on Elizabeth St.). I was particularly surprised to see Faconnable considering they have so few shops in the US. I haven't had a chance to go in either store; just saw them from the car.

Finally, I just picked up my first shirt from Charles Nakhle yesterday. I haven't tried it with a coat and tie yet but my initial impressions are very favorable. Fabric is a light blue twill (2X100s) by SIC Tess. Of note there is that Charles had a book of Alumo swatches and is waiting on the arrival of some Riva swatches which a customer had requested. Could be interesting. Also, he had a bunch of RTW shirts for sale labeled Rubinacci. Not sure what that's all about. But I believe he's selling them for A$150.

 

[Sator]

Charles is hoping to get samples from Giancarlo Bonfanti. I have given him contact details for Carlo Riva. If you guys show interest he may try to get Riva in. Some regard Riva to be the best bar none, so keep asking him about it.

 

[GuidoWongolini]

Originally Posted by Balthazar

So just a few tidbits of information that I've learned recently that I thought I'd pass along. Some of it is probably old news but I'm sharing just in case.

Had dinner in Woollahra recently and noticed that there's a Brunello Cucinelli store there now. Went back the next day and the saleswoman told me they had been there for a year or so. Who knew? It's not like it was the first time in a year I'd been there. I guess I just missed it before. Prices are ridiculous as you might expect. Ian has nothing to worry about there as far as my business is concerned.

Other shops which I believe actually are new: Canali (can't remember exact location but near Zegna I think) and Faconnable (just down from Vince Maloney's on Elizabeth St.). I was particularly surprised to see Faconnable considering they have so few shops in the US. I haven't had a chance to go in either store; just saw them from the car.

Finally, I just picked up my first shirt from Charles Nakhle yesterday. I haven't tried it with a coat and tie yet but my initial impressions are very favorable. Fabric is a light blue twill (2X100s) by SIC Tess. Of note there is that Charles had a book of Alumo swatches and is waiting on the arrival of some Riva swatches which a customer had requested. Could be interesting. Also, he had a bunch of RTW shirts for sale labeled Rubinacci. Not sure what that's all about. But I believe he's selling them for A$150.

Canali has taken over the ex Zegna premises on Macquarie St. The original importer for Zegna also imported Canali. Recently Zegna decided to open up shop, so the importer has decided to concentrate on Canali.

Zegna will be opening in MLC centre - strange location within the MLC centre, under the stairs on the corner of King & Castlereagh Sts.

Hopefully Zegna will get better staff as the previous sales people walked around as if they had canes up their A$$ & had NFI.

As for BC - yes it is expensive, but not that much different to the other BC stores in NY or HK.

& I agree about Faconnable, very strange location (next to VM).

 

[Sator]

When you consider how we have a number of excellent tailors in town offering bespoke at exceptional prices (compared to New York or London) you are mad for paying the extortionist prices for the mediocre rubbish peddled by Zegna, Canali, Armani, Brioni, Oxxford, and Kiton. These imported RTW lines are often marked up so much that they nearly always cost as much or more than bespoke here. They can often be purchased at full retail price at about at least 30% less in places like New York. In the case of Oxxford, 50% less.

I would suggest checking out:

1.John Cutler
He is expensive and has the enviable title of being a third generation Cutler bespoke tailor as well as being Savile Row trained. His prices also rival Savile Row firms. He has the widest range of cloths and books available in town. The silhouette is very much English. He has made suits for John Howard.

2. Adamo Marrone
His tailoring is softer, and more Italian. He cuts a beautiful, elegantly shaped coat. Prices are exceptional.

3. Victor Alacqua
Victor coats also seem beautifully made. His coats have a lot of handwork on them. He also stocks a good number of H Lesser books.

4. John Cutrone
I have heard very favourable things about him by but have no had a chance to inspect his work for myself.

5. Sam Disano
Sam represents amazing value for money - the best deal in town by a country mile. His coats have less handwork. He used to have a successful large bespoke tailoring store on Hunter St in the conservative business dress - so much so that he retired early. However, he was so bored that he opened up a tiny store hidden in the obscure back streets of Parramatta (not far from Charles Nakhle) - lower overheads, which are not passed on to you. His turnover time is only two weeks. He has recently made a suit for Paul Keating.

 

[ZengaGent]

Hello everyone.

I'm very excited to inform you that I've discovered a bespoke tailor in North Sydney, who seems to know what he's doing.

His name is Nick Salanitro. He used to have his own shop in Nth Sydney, but is now semi-retired, and works out of Salman Clothing in Greenwood Plaza. Apparently, he's been doing this since the late 60s, and is familiar with the the local tailoring scene, having learnt his trade the old-fashioned way, with lots of handwork, and meticulous attention to detail. Nowadays, he works for the love of the trade, and to earn a little money on the side.

Two weeks ago, I decided to pull the trigger, and commissioned Nick to make me a suit in H&S Perennial Lite fabric (Navy with fine blue pinstripes; 9 oz). Fully canvassed. Working buttons. Soft-shoulder. Waist suppression. High two-button like my Zegna MTMs. The price was $1,800AUD.

Initially, I was a little concerned, as the shopfront posters advertised 'Made-to-Measure suits'. Now, having spoken to them at length, and done the first fitting, I realize that Nick's got his terminology mixed up, and that to him, made-to-measure means bespoke, i.e. fully tailored, while made-to-order covers what Zegna and various other makers do, i.e. altered based on an existing template.

I'm now waiting on the second fitting (scheduled for next week), and look forward with great anticipation to the finished product (possibly the week after next)!

If this works out (here's praying), I won't be buying much from the likes of Zegna and other international menswear brands.

Can't wait!!!

 

[Sator]

I'd love to hear how it all works out.

I have heard of other small, independent tailors around. Some of these gentlemen are semi-retired - a little like Sam Disano. I think there is a whole generation of tailors out there who would gladly make bespoke garments for a bit of extra cash in their retirement.

As for terminology, although on these fora we are agreed on definitions, in the real world usage is highly inconsistent. It is made worse by the fact that many people no longer understand the term "bespoke". Furthermore, in Italian the word for both bespoke and MTM is "su misura" which translate literally to "on measure".

 

[ZengaGent]

Originally Posted by Sator

I'd love to hear how it all works out.

I have heard of other small, independent tailors around. Some of these gentlemen are semi-retired - a little like Sam Disano. I think there is a whole generation of tailors out there who would gladly make bespoke garments for a bit of extra cash in their retirement.

As for terminology, although on these fora we are agreed to terminology, in the real world usage is highly inconsistent. It is made worse by the fact that many people no longer understand the term "bespoke". Furthermore, in Italian the word for both bespoke and MTM is "su misura" which translate literally to "on measure".

Will definitely keep you posted, Sator.

Best Regards

 

[Shraka]

All these bespoke tailors in Sydney. Are there any in Melbourne?

Pah, who am I kidding. I don't have the money for bespoke.

 

[Sator]

Originally Posted by Shraka

Pah, who am I kidding. I don't have the money for bespoke.

You won't have any money after bespoke either

 

[Presto87]

How much are we talking here guys? in terms of say a bespoke french cuff etc. shirt???

The only reason I ask, is because as of late I've purchased 2 Rhodes and Beckett shirts from their Pitt St. store. I'm satisfied with the shoulder fit, though the sleeves are a tad long, but for now I roll the sleeves when wearing them (I know many will cringe at that thought, but suits me well, I think)

Yea so I've paid $159 each for those, and the fabric quality is damn good (my opinion).

 

[Sator]

R&B are made somewhere like Turkey. I have insider info that the cost price of their shirts is about $20 or thereabouts. For a good shirt you can easily pay that much for the cloth alone - per meter of cloth that is.

 

[penguin vic]

Originally Posted by Presto87

How much are we talking here guys? in terms of say a bespoke french cuff etc. shirt???

The only reason I ask, is because as of late I've purchased 2 Rhodes and Beckett shirts from their Pitt St. store. I'm satisfied with the shoulder fit, though the sleeves are a tad long, but for now I roll the sleeves when wearing them (I know many will cringe at that thought, but suits me well, I think)

Yea so I've paid $159 each for those, and the fabric quality is damn good (my opinion).

At full retail, Rhodes & Beckett, Herringbone and most Australian RTW shirts are terribly overpriced IMO - a lot goes in and depends on their marketing as supposedly high-end clothing.

 

[Balthazar]

Prices for a Nakhle shirt will vary based on the fabric you choose. I think the range is something like A$185 to A$300 with the majority of fabrics being close to A$200. The finer SIC Tess fabrics (i.e. 2X180 or 2X200) will be at the high end of that range. I think the Alumo fabrics may be even more but I didn't get pricing on those.

I'm not terribly familiar with Rhodes and Beckett shirts but I would be very surprised if their fabric is as good as the average SIC Tess fabrics. Is it worth it to pay an extra $50 per shirt? Obviously, everyone will have a different opinion. I personally think that would be a pretty easy call (I'd go with bespoke). The thing I'm struggling with is whether a Nakhle shirt is worth double an RLPL, Barba, Luciano Barbera, etc. shirt picked up on deep discount.

 

[Presto87]

Sator, I believe it's actually Egypt (someone correct me if I'm wrong). Excuse the ignorance, but I didn't understand what you meant by: "For a good shirt you can easily pay that much for the cloth alone - per meter of cloth". So how much does a bespoke shirt cost on average then???

Oh and believe me, Penguin, I know they must be overpriced ... but quality of fabric is most important to me, and in that price range I haven't found anything that beats it ... anyone know of any local brans that beat the price and/or quality??? Thing is, I like both the fabric, the slim-ish cut, and the designs (at least I really like the 2 I purchased).

Edit: Price question has been answered

 

[misterjase]

yes, I would agree that these shirts from retailers are well marketed and overpriced with big markup on unit cost (I suppose because these are manufactured in a developing country). ie. not the product of someone who has pride in what they do and care in what they do for you.