French wine recommendations (Burgundy and Bordeaux)

[pejsek]

I don't care much about Bordeaux. From my perch of blissful ignorance I hold Bordeaux responsible for all manner of super huge trophy wine monstrosities (Screaming Eagle, anyone?).

Burgundy, however, is a different story. One could blissfully spend a whole life drinking through the appellations of the Cote d'Or (with, perhaps, the occasional side trip to the Cote Chalonnaise for more rustic pleasures). There is an entire universe in the wines of Burgundy. And it needn't be ruinously expensive; that can come later, if it all. I would start out by getting Matt Kramer's indispensable reference Making Sense of Burgundy and then a case of basic Bourgogne Rouge from a reputable negociant such as Louis Jadot or Joseph Faiveley--both of these are widely available at supermarkets and if you are willing to buy a case can probably be had for thirteen to seventeen dollars a bottle. Whichever you get first make sure you try something different for your next case. Read and drink. The quality of basic Burgundy is fairly high and by drinking this way you will get a feel for different styles. As you go along getting your palette tuned up make the occasional foray into something more special--a village appellation or a named vineyard. Progress along into the premier and grand crus.

Of course you may decide that Burgundy is not for you. But if you do end up wanting a super alcoholic fruit bomb, please don't fall into the arms of the Bordeaux blends. Go find a nice Australian Shiraz or, better yet, one of the completely over-the-top Amador County Zinfandels.

 

[itsstillmatt]

Originally Posted by pejsek

I don't care much about Bordeaux. From my perch of blissful ignorance I hold Bordeaux responsible for all manner of super huge trophy wine monstrosities (Screaming Eagle, anyone?).

Burgundy, however, is a different story. One could blissfully spend a whole life drinking through the appellations of the Cote d'Or (with, perhaps, the occasional side trip to the Cote Chalonnaise for more rustic pleasures). There is an entire universe in the wines of Burgundy. And it needn't be ruinously expensive; that can come later, if it all. I would start out by getting Matt Kramer's indispensable reference Making Sense of Burgundy and then a case of basic Bourgogne Rouge from a reputable negociant such as Louis Jadot or Joseph Faiveley--both of these are widely available at supermarkets and if you are willing to buy a case can probably be had for thirteen to seventeen dollars a bottle. Whichever you get first make sure you try something different for your next case. Read and drink. The quality of basic Burgundy is fairly high and by drinking this way you will get a feel for different styles. As you go along getting your palette tuned up make the occasional foray into something more special--a village appellation or a named vineyard. Progress along into the premier and grand crus.

Of course you may decide that Burgundy is not for you. But if you do end up wanting a super alcoholic fruit bomb, please don't fall into the arms of the Bordeaux blends. Go find a nice Australian Shiraz or, better yet, one of the completely over-the-top Amador County Zinfandels.
I generally agree with this. My favorite Bordeaux are from the merlot/cab franc side of the area, and I find most Napa Cabs difficult to take.

 

[Manton]

Originally Posted by iammatt

I generally agree with this. My favorite Bordeaux are from the merlot/cab franc side of the area, and I find most Napa Cabs difficult to take.

This is sort of strange, then, because it is the Pomerol and especially that St. Emillion areas that pioneered the "fruit bomb" style of wine in Bordeaux. The left bank houses still, by and large, make old fashioned wines that a die-hard Napa cab lover finds too tame and subtle.

 

[itsstillmatt]

Originally Posted by Manton

This is sort of strange, then, because it is the Pomerol and especially that St. Emillion areas that pioneered the "fruit bomb" style of wine in Bordeaux. The left bank houses still, by and large, make old fashioned wines that a die-hard Napa cab lover finds too tame and subtle.
I guess I like big fruit bombs made of merlot, but am not a huge fan of big fruit bombs made mainly of cab. I actually like classic style Bordeaux wines a lot, but not their Napa cousins. I also don't know much, so my contradictions are not surprising.

 

[Manton]

In all likelihood, you are drinking the wine too young. All the bloat is gone and there is nothing left but finesse.

It is sad (to me) that prices went insane, because there is nothing better than a 15-20 y/o Bordeaux. I still have a good stash from the '80s and a few later years, but I simply could not afford the recent vintages, so in 10 years or so I will be SOL.

 

[Piobaire]

I will look up that book by Matt Kramer on my Amazon list. Favoring the "heartbreak grape" as I do, I need to know more about Burgundy, other than items (DRC anyone?) out of my price point/price sensibility range. With the US pinots, I get drawn to those makers and areas that are less fruit bomb, and more "Burgundian" in nature, such as some of the current stuff coming out of Oregon and Washington state, along with CA makers like Peay (the only CA Pinot maker on my radar that suggests a minimum 5-6 years of bottle age before opening.)

Not to say that a well made Sea Smoke or Merry Edwards doesn't make me happy either. They just tend to make better representatives of that style, IMO, as there is structure and finesse contained too, not merely over the top fruit and high ETOH.

 

[gomestar]

great Burgundy is something so incredibly haunting and full of subtle complexities. It has been my go-to French wine for quite a while now, though my drinking list is skewed heavily to the Italians.

Unfortunately, there are a lot of so-so bottles in the high price points. Purchasing great burgundy can be a daunting task filled with merely suitable bottles for $50 or $75 or $100. Furthermore, it can get progressively harder to find highly rated Burgundy as the quantities produces can be hilariously low. But if you have the wallet, I can't imagine a more interesting task to take than to pick apart the various parts of Burgundy one by one. Oof, do I ever crave that same bottle of Clos Vougeot I had at a dinner a few months ago.



Also, another Burgundy wine book recommendation, find the book by Clive Coates. Quite thorough indeed.

 

[pejsek]

Originally Posted by Piobaire

(DRC anyone?)

Funny, this reminds me. I have an old (1981-82) catalogue from the San Francisco wine merchants Draper & Esquin which reprints the 1954 wine list from "21." The 1947 La Tache could be had for $13 a bottle. Or you could shell out $20 for a magnum of the Richebourg. Good times. Read 'em and weep.

Anyway, just to be clear: I have no particular interest in bashing Bordeaux. I've just never had a transcendent moment with claret and for me the consistency of the product actually works against it. Add in the stratospheric prices and there's no pain in doing without. I'd rather spend my time chasing Burgundy or something equally elusive like a top-rate Barolo.

Burgundy prices aren't always crazy. Just don't hesitate to buy in quantity when you find something good at a good price.