Gun Appreciation Thread

Originally Posted by Arethusa

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From people like Martin Fackler.

I knew a SEAL who thought that 9x19mm only slowed guys down while .45ACP killed in a single shot. He had far more direct experience than me, and it didn't make him any less wrong.

those are two different points - I have seen some of MF's writtings, and they make a lot of sense, but I have also seen a whole stack of bodies that have been hit with 5.56 ammo - and the fact is that the bullets do react in the way that you called an "internet myth".

as to the difference between .45 and 9mm - I think that most americans are obsessed with caliber size. I would much rather put 3 rounds of 9 mm in somebody than a single .45 round.

Originally Posted by Arethusa

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I can't tell if this is a joke or not, but none of this is true. Bullets do not bounce. Take a look at some terminal ballistics studies. A .22LR weapon is not a self defense weapon. If you get one, use it for range shooting or maybe hunting rabbits.

There are special bullets with off-set center. They are very bouncy and never come out where you expect them.

Originally Posted by imageWIS

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I think not. I don't see any glory in taking down a beautiful deer simply for "˜sport'.

Perhaps I'll cry myself to sleep about it...

Jon.

+1000 - crying part

Originally Posted by Arethusa

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My only points are that a .22 is not a reliable combat or defensive round and that myths about its ricocheting lethality are simply that.

no, they are not.


I would agree with you about the reliability - I had a friend who once shot somebody in the forhead with a 22L, and the guys forehead was strong enough to keep the other guy alive. but I have heard very reliable reports of a 22 round bouncing 2 or 3 times through a persons skull. they are not reliable, but I wouldn't discount the amount of lethal damage you can do with a low caliber firearm.

Honestly, I think 9mm HS will do plenty of damage for home defense. I tend to own .45s because I like the feel of them and I'm used to shooting them at this point, but I think if you popped someone with a few 9mm hollowpoints in the chest it would do a bit more than just slow them down unless they were wearing body armor.

Originally Posted by globetrotter

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those are two different points - I have seen some of MF's writtings, and they make a lot of sense, but I have also seen a whole stack of bodies that have been hit with 5.56 ammo - and the fact is that the bullets do react in the way that you called an "internet myth".
5.56x45mm is not .22LR, and they do not behave remotely similarly. I have not described the behavior of the former in this thread.

Originally Posted by globetrotter

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as to the difference between .45 and 9mm - I think that most americans are obsessed with caliber size. I would much rather put 3 rounds of 9 mm in somebody than a single .45 round.
I would tend to agree.

Originally Posted by dkzzzz

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There are special bullets with off-set center. They are very bouncy and never come out where you expect them.
Please, show us. Show us these remarkably useless bullets.

Originally Posted by drizzt3117

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Honestly, I think 9mm HS will do plenty of damage for home defense. I tend to own .45s because I like the feel of them and I'm used to shooting them at this point, but I think if you popped someone with a few 9mm hollowpoints in the chest it would do a bit more than just slow them down unless they were wearing body armor.
And if they're wearing armor, it won't matter whether you're firing 9x19mm or .45ACP.

Originally Posted by Arethusa

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And if they're wearing armor, it won't matter whether you're firing 9x19mm or .45ACP.
True, but a 7.62mm round from one of my Bulgarian AKs should prolly still do the trick, depending on the armor.

Originally Posted by dkzzzz

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+1000 - crying part

I was being an ass and making fun of Conne. For your edification, topic #1186:

http://www.styleforum.net/showthread...=12189&page=80

Jon.

Speaking of guns. Do any of you gun collectors/aficionados have high quality images of guns from all eras? Either your own, or if you can link me to a website, it would be much appreciated. I need pics for my next painting. Thanks.

So who here has Class 3 weapons? Show them off!

Originally Posted by dkzzzz

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Silencers are illegal.

This is manifestly not true in most U.S. states.

However, ownership is highly regulated and administered by the BATFE and the FBI under the authority of the National Firearms Act of 1934. This is a portion of the 'Class III' category the GQ is alluding to. As is one of the other items.

Ownership typically requires the filling of an ATF Form IV with the signoff of your county sheriff, which is then sent to the ATF who, with the FBI, conducts a background check that takes 3 months. You pay $200 for the privilege, and get a pretty tax stamp on your Form IV which you (more or less) must have with the device at all times. You may not sell, transfer, or (with certain exceptions) allow the device out of your direct control. Machineguns work like that as well, but with some additional restrictions.

If you don't believe me, check the Wiki page, or subguns.com.

Regards,
Huntsman

Originally Posted by ms244

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A 22 simply doesn't have much power behind it, its a 40 grain solid lead slug traveling at maybe 1100fps (subsonic) at the muzzle.

Not to argue with the general premise, but most .22s these days are supersonic. It's getting hard, in fact, to find standard velocity rounds on store shelves.

Originally Posted by ms244

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Huntsman, is that your smallbore gun? If so what kind is it, it looks almost like the rare and unseen Swiss Tanner.

If you have some cash for a first gun you can get a 22 conversion kit for a number of guns ( Colt 1911, CZ and beretta come to mind). By changing the slide, barrel, and magazine you can shoot a cheap ($10 for 500) 22 ammo.

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Yep. It's not a Tanner, it's essentially a one-off. Good suggestion with a convertible.

Originally Posted by Lucky Strike

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Only one I own:

Cased Webley & Scott Model 700, 1952. Boxlock with ejectors and double triggers. "Monte Carlo" walnut stock with rounded pistol grip and "beavertail" forend.

Very yes.

~ Huntsman

Huntsman, so what smallbore gun is it? It doesn't seem like an Anschutz of any sort.
Can you post a picture of it? Perhaps we can critique the fit of your shooting coat and whether it matches your shooting boots?

Originally Posted by globetrotter

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I think that most americans are obsessed with caliber size. I would much rather put 3 rounds of 9 mm in somebody than a single .45 round.

Guns are barbaric.