New 911 GT2

Dragon · Jul 22, 2007

Originally Posted by LabelKing

One Japanese car that had an edge over a European counterpart was the old Datsun Fairlady which had a gearbox designed by Porsche. Its competition were the English MGs and such.

and a nice design copied from Jaguar

Tokyo Slim · Jul 22, 2007

Originally Posted by Dragon

and a nice design copied from Jaguar

The Datsun/Nissan Fairlady roadsters have always been their own car. I don't think you can fairly compare their designs more than extremely superficially to a Jag. In fact, if anything, the pre- Z Fairlady's owe more to the MG and Austin Healy than anything else, if in fact such a comparison were even logical.

Dragon · Jul 22, 2007

Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim

The Datsun/Nissan Fairlady roadsters have always been their own car. I don't think you can fairly compare their designs more than extremely superficially to a Jag. In fact, if anything, the pre- Z Fairlady's owe more to the MG and Austin Healy than anything else, if in fact such a comparison were even logical.

The Fairlady Z concept was made to be a poor man`s E-type, and the design was taken directly from there.

Tokyo Slim · Jul 23, 2007

Originally Posted by Dragon

The Fairlady Z concept was made to be a poor man`s E-type, and the design was taken directly from there.
The Fairlady Z concept was designed by Albrecht Graf von Goertz. The same person who designed the 2000GT. He had started designing the 2000GT for Nissan in 1960 before the E-type had even come out. So if anything, Jaguar ripped off his design for the E-type. The Fairlady Z was also based on the design from 1960. Although, like I said before, they are really very different cars. Comparing pictures of them reveals nothing more than a superficial shape similarity which has more to do with them all being GT cars than anything else.

Dragon · Jul 23, 2007

Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim

The Fairlady Z concept was designed by Albrecht Graf von Goertz. The same person who designed the 2000GT. He had started designing the 2000GT for Nissan in 1960 before the E-type had even come out. So if anything, Jaguar ripped off his design for the E-type. The Fairlady Z was also based on the design from 1960. Although, like I said before, they are really very different cars. Comparing pictures of them reveals nothing more than a superficial shape similarity which has more to do with them all being GT cars than anything else.

Sorry I forgot all about the 2000GT (on of my favorite Japanese cars). The E-type came first, then the 2000GTs mission was to copy the E-type, but make it better (as you can see from the design). The Z was a cheap version of the 2 more expensive cars (E-type and 2000GT)

Here`s a good overview on how it all happened;

http://www.motortrend.com/classic/c1...son/index.html

Like you said, the Nissan Z and Toyota 2000GT designs are much related, because they were working together in the beginning. The E-type debuted in 1961, well before the other 2 so the original honors has to go to the E-type. All of the documentaries I have seen of the 2000GT and Z mention that the designs were copied from the E-type too.

bachbeet · Jul 23, 2007

I've never liked those stupid spoilers that Porsche put on their cars around 75(?). And, the ones that rise automatically as speed increases are no better looking.

Southern-Nupe · Jul 23, 2007

Originally Posted by bachbeet

I've never liked those stupid spoilers that Porsche put on their cars around 75(?). And, the ones that rise automatically as speed increases are no better looking.
I can understand from an aesthetic perspective, however due to their design (rear engine) , at high speeds it become almost necessary.

Look at the history of the 911, and the role the front and rear spoilers played into their performance.

imageWIS · Jul 23, 2007

Originally Posted by Southern-Nupe

I can understand from an aesthetic perspective, however due to their design (rear engine) , at high speeds it become almost necessary.

Look at the history of the 911, and the role the front and rear spoilers played into their performance.

Also, the whale-tails are iconic. Their culmination in their last true form ended with the 993 turbo, and its sublime whale-tail.

112_0605_ptw_05z+porsche_classic_whale_tail+side_view.jpg

112_0605_ptw_06z+porsche_classic_whale_tail+side_view.jpg

112_0605_ptw_07z+porsche_classic_whale_tail+side_view.jpg

112_0605_ptw_08z+porsche_993_classic_whale_tail+side_view.jpg

Jon.

DNW · Jul 23, 2007

Originally Posted by imageWIS

Also, the whale-tails are iconic. Their culmination in their last true form ended with the 993 turbo, and its sublime whale-tail.

Jon.

The whale-tail is so effective it's been copied to stabilize other back ends as well.

bachbeet · Jul 23, 2007

Southern-Nupe: I understand the need for the spoilers. I Just think they could design them to be both functional and beautiful. Maybe Frank Loyd Wright could help.

Southern-Nupe · Jul 23, 2007

Originally Posted by imageWIS

Also, the whale-tails are iconic. Their culmination in their last true form ended with the 993 turbo, and its sublime whale-tail.

Jon.
That's simply orgasmic.

Southern-Nupe · Jul 23, 2007

Originally Posted by bachbeet

Southern-Nupe: I understand the need for the spoilers. I Just think they could design them to be both functional and beautiful. Maybe Frank Loyd Wright could help.

I know where you're coming from, after the 993, the tail began to take on more of a boy racer appearance.

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