Help me with my "tailor speak"

Ok, so here's my problem. Every shirt that I buy off the rack I have to have tailored (I have a 12-14 drop) and I always ask for the same thing - sides taken in, darts in the back, no extra room on the sides. I ask for the last because I tuck my shirts in and don't like extra materials on the sides. Here's what's happened with the last three tailors:

1) There is still excess material on the sides
2) The darts are too close to the center, thus making it too tight around my upper back
3) They lop off TOO much material and I can't even button the bottom buttons

With my last three casual jackets its been the same deal - I like to not be able to close my fingers on my palm and feel jacket. About wrist length is what I shoot for. They pin the sleeves, I clap my hand closed, and then I get the jacket back and I can grip the ******* sleeve in my hand.

This is 3 tailors now - respected ones, supposedly, that got referred to me by the high end menswear shops in the area. So, I've come to the conclusion that although all these people are incompetent, I am not quite expressing what I need correctly. Before I venture out to have another one of my shirts ruined I could use a few pointers on how to get what I want.

1. Ask for French Seams on the shirt. This means taking in the excess cloth from the side seams. Ask them to taper the base outward from aprox 10" from the bottom hem. The flair will negate the tightness across the bottom button.

2. Remember that darts add shape, not remove cloth (they do, but only as a by-product). Use them only to remove fullness in the lower back.

3. Remember that only so much material can be taken out before you're essentially re-making the shirt. I'd say that 2" out of a sleeve, and 4" from the body is a good amount. More than that and you'll be looking at some very strange shapes.

Also WTF 14" drop? Like 44" Chest and 30" waist?!

With a 12-14 drop it sounds like you have a horrible body to fit.

Do the tailors mark or pin the shirts while you try them on? It might alleviate confusion.

I understand the function of the darts and use them to keep my tucked in shirt from looking like a giant rippling wave.

When I buy shirts off the rack I have to get the large sizes to fit my upper body but they leave me looking like a flying squirrel. I don't do this with dress shirts, only shirts that have cool colors or patterns. The sorta **** you'd find in the Gap or JCrew. I can't get shirts like that made so I try and make do.

And, yes, that's right. The numbers are higher on both ends though. Its only about a 12 at the moment.

**** dude, drop 12! Why not go MTM?

Originally Posted by robin

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With a 12-14 drop it sounds like you have a horrible body to fit. Do the tailors mark or pin the shirts while you try them on? It might alleviate confusion.
Yeah, I'm a mutant. I'm not even that muscular. I just have a big chest and shoulers. The tailors pin the shirts in the sides and sleeves. That's part of what I don't get. I watched the last woman pin the sleeves on the jacket that I brought in (a casual cotton J Crew jacket) to the point where I wanted it. I even had her readujst it when I felt it was too long. Then, when I got the jacket back, it was too long.

Originally Posted by SpooPoker

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**** dude, drop 12! Why not go MTM?
Well, when I finally settle on a size, I'm going to. In the mean time, I don't know of a MTM outfit that makes the colorful type casual shirts that I like to wear. **** like these: http://www.gap.com/browse/product.do...d=2&pid=814594 http://www.gap.com/browse/product.do...d=2&pid=831653 http://www.jcrew.com/mens_feature/catalogjcrewcomexclusives/shirts/PRDOVR~41514/99102400121/ENE~1+2+3+22+4294967294+20~~~20+16~15~~~~~~~/41514.jsp http://www.jcrew.com/mens_category/shirts/washedfavoriteshirts/PRDOVR~35764/35764.jsp

I've just checked out modern tailor and they have 200+ examples of those bold checks. Admittedly you wont get details like the flap chest pocket, but it might save you a few bucks in tailoring fees!

Design Your Shirt --> Select Patterns "Checks" ---> ???? --> Profit!!!!

Well, when I finally settle on a size, I'm going to. In the mean time, I don't know of a MTM outfit that makes the colorful type casual shirts that I like to wear. **** like these:

http://www.gap.com/browse/product.do...d=2&pid=814594

http://www.gap.com/browse/product.do...d=2&pid=831653

http://www.jcrew.com/mens_feature/catalogjcrewcomexclusives/shirts/PRDOVR~41514/99102400121/ENE~1+2+3+22+4294967294+20~~~20+16~15~~~~~~~/41514.jsp

http://www.jcrew.com/mens_category/shirts/washedfavoriteshirts/PRDOVR~35764/35764.jsp[/quote]

Almost all should have these types of patterns in their fabric lines. Unless you go MTM, you will never have a proper fit.

you are asking the impossible.

you dont want any extra fabric on the side????

how do you expect to sit down.

only buy shirts with stretch!

Originally Posted by Blackhood

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1. Ask for French Seams on the shirt. This means taking in the excess cloth from the side seams.
The seams should really be flat-felled rather than French seams.

Guys with your build usually wear more leather and steel.

It's hard for giving a advice without an clear picture.

14 drop....holy ****

I have found that "tailors" aren't always the best to go to for alterations. Try finding someone who does alterations exclusively.

Originally Posted by Quadcammer

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14 drop....holy ****

That's Kunk territory...