Tour of Rubinacci workshop / Cappelli atelier -- June 2011

Originally Posted by A Y

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Do you know what kind of cutting system R. uses? If it's block manipulation, it seems like there's a very wide fuzzy line between MTM and custom, perhaps analogous to the better MTM shirtmakers.
No idea. To my mind, however, any meaningful difference between "MTM" and "bespoke" doesn't hinge on whether a block pattern is manipulated, but rather the degree to which manipulation is possible, and how artfully. When you order Oxxford or Kiton MTM, there is a stock pattern that can be tweaked in numerous dimensions, but there is nonetheless a limit--even if theoretical. Also, MTM changes tend to be executed piecemeal (adjust x, adjust y, adjust z, etc.), without a tailor considering the whole of the garment and making multiple adjustments at once to control the overall result. When I was measured for my Oxxford things, the process appeared very methodical and systematic with many little measurements here and there. With Rubinacci, there were only a handful of measurements--like four or five--and the rest was eyeballed. As a novice, the former was more comforting, but now the latter is.

I see Luca gave Tweed in the City a shoutout on Facebook.

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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Damn.

Originally Posted by mafoofan

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No idea. To my mind, however, any meaningful difference between "MTM" and "bespoke" doesn't hinge on whether a block pattern is manipulated, but rather the degree to which manipulation is possible, and how artfully.

Sorry. I didn't mean to imply that R. is not custom or that it's similar to simple, department store MTM. I should have said that with block manipulation, the difference between MTM and custom becomes fuzzy, and it's probably not useful trying to classify something as one or the other. The results can be as custom (and good) as one wishes, even if it's not as sexy as saying one freehands the pattern right onto paper or cloth.

I was thinking of how Carl from CEGO rails against people who try to draw a line between the two for shirtmakers.

--Andre

Originally Posted by A Y

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Sorry. I didn't mean to imply that R. is not custom or that it's similar to simple, department store MTM. I should have said that with block manipulation, the difference between MTM and custom becomes fuzzy, and it's probably not useful trying to classify something as one or the other. The results can be as custom (and good) as one wishes, even if it's not as sexy as saying one freehands the pattern right onto paper or cloth.

I was thinking of how Carl from CEGO rails against people who try to draw a line between the two for shirtmakers.

Oh, I wasn't offended. I was just giving my thoughts on the issue, which has come up many times on the forum. I truly have no idea what cutting system Rubinacci does or doesn't use. Maybe I'll ask them some time.

Is Mariano able to accomodate a 54/64 suit size?

Originally Posted by Mr. Moo

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Is Mariano able to accomodate a 54/64 suit size?

Have you grown?

Originally Posted by IndianBoyz

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Have you grown?

Only in girth.

Originally Posted by Mr. Moo

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Is Mariano able to accomodate a 54/64 suit size?

You'd have to look hard on eBay.

Originally Posted by forex

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You'd have to look hard on eBay.

pretty well played.

Originally Posted by marcodalondra

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Even Bulgari gave me a discount in Naples without asking for it.... It is very common to ask for discount on retail prices everywhere but for the multinational.

In Italy, if you want a discount, just ask the merchant what price he could give you if you paid cash.

Originally Posted by manicturncoat

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In Italy, if you want a discount, just ask the merchant what price he could give you if you paid cash.

Works like this pretty much everywhere except with "proper" American businesses.

Originally Posted by manicturncoat

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In Italy, if you want a discount, just ask the merchant what price he could give you if you paid cash.

A lot of smaller shops only take cash to begin with. I think you can be pretty blunt about negotiating. It's expected.

Originally Posted by mafoofan

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The language problem should not be underestimated...

If I can't have a friendly conversation with a tailor, I won't use him...

so true.

Originally Posted by mafoofan

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Mina caters specifically to foreigners, so the thinking doesn't apply to her. As far as other tailors in Naples: well, come on, everything in southern Italy is negotiable. I would not assume the price you get on paper is what local clients are paying. I've received numerous offers from various people over the years to introduce me to their tailors in Naples in order to get a better price.

Originally Posted by Eustace Tilley

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Interesting.

Originally Posted by banis

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When arranging trip to Naples and contacting different tailors I was told at several places that price is a personal issue and should better be discussed during the meeting. Depending on different reasons, quoted price may be negotiable. In my particular case I got a good deal and received quite a good discount from the initial price.

BTW, what did Formosa and Pirozzi tell you about their prices?

this is something that always makes me uncomfortable about having items tailored - the making up of pricing on the spot that is prevalent. especially since most of the time it does not seem to work in my favor...

Matt, if I may call you Matt, I just read your review of the Cappelli and Rubinacci ties on your blog. Coincidentally, I purchased ties at both shops last week as well. Your review of the differences in the two was on point. I think you perfectly characterized the shopping experience as well as the differences in construction and feel. Nice job.

And I couldn't find Cappelli either, but it gave me the opportunity to stumble into Formosa, across the courtyard from Cappelli, and check out some of their wares.