The Middle Class Mind / The Wealthy Mind

Originally Posted by Lighthouse

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By either Manton's or DonCarlos' standards, I'd be quite happy. I would assume that striking out on ones own requires a supportive spouse and nail biting over bills, perhaps eating ham sandwiches for a while. I made this leap several years ago, but my industry went to **** in late 2008 and, being a "Green Sprout," it didn't take long to destroy the dream.
To me it meant knowing that in the beginning I would get paid the least and last, that "delayed gratification" regarding luxuries would be my mantra and and it may take years to realize my financial dreams. On the other hand, whatever I made was because of my devotion, skill and execution of my duties. I put my head on the pillow at night knowing that it was my business and I would make it no matter what. I considered myself a rich man long before I ever went out on my own. That was the impetus for opening my business. I was simply not afraid to fail.

Originally Posted by yjeezle

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please explain investment bankers as well :x

Same as what was discussed about selling your "brand". Bankers have connections, relationships, and influence to bring business to their respective employer. Investment bankers, NOT analysts/associates/VP's doing grunt work, don't sit there doing any "work" the way most of us do. They are traveling and negotiating with C-level guys at firms looking to possibly sell more stock, issue bonds, merge, etc. They are super-high level salesmen/relationship managers.

Originally Posted by Freewheeler

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Then don't use a stupid and inaccurate quote about salaries, which uses the words "no matter how high".
Oh, for ****'s sake. First of all, you're WAY too hung up on the wording of that quote. You don't like the lettering of the second sentence? Fine. Fair. I'll concede that it was a poor choice. That said, the spirit of the quote holds true, and it's pretty ******* far from "stupid." Certainly wiser and more worthwhile than the inane semantics discussion you've brought to bear on this thread.

If you can add, then you know that someone who makes 10 million plus a year and has been doing that for a few years - then they obviously are worth more than 10 million dollars. 10 million a year for 10 years, minus the taxes and what do you get? Is that **** you money? By the way, 10 million dollars is easily **** you money for most people, when you consider the fact that you can live out the rest of your life very well with much less if you are smart with the money. Are you telling me the guy who have lived on 40,000 a year for many years now, can't quit his job tomorrow and live a great life with his 10 million dollars minus taxes? I am quite sure he would be in a position to tell everyone to **** off and die a very happy man who never had to work for money to live since. It sounds like **** you money by your standards is to be able to blow millions of dollars on cocaine, hookers, cars and nice clothes or whatever you want to waste money on - but still have a huge chunk of change in the bank. I guess Bruce Wayne is **** you money.

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Didn't I just predict that you'd start getting into a semantics discussion on quantifying the definition of ****-you money? Did I not just call this and suggest that it was orthogonal to my point? I did, didn't I? Look, man. I don't know what's up your ass tonight, first of all, but your tone is a little unnecessarily aggro. Second, you're missing my point repeatedly in service of stupid semantics discussions. If I had any interest in continually picking nits over word choices with you, I have no doubt you'd be up for it all night. Unfortunately, I lack the interest. I don't think you've suggested anything that detracts from my broader point. Rather, you've bitten relentlessly into the quote I cited -- which was supposed to be a philosophical jumping-off point, and whose implications are still valid. If that's not computing with you, I'm sorry. We're just not going to go anywhere productive or worthwhile with more semantics debate, and I hope you feel the same. If not, I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I'm done with it. I've made my point, it's a valid one, and if folks want to spin their wheels on the word choices like a bunch of lawyers in discovery, that's their prerogative. Going forward, I'd suggest that you bring productive value to the thread, such as offering your take on the OP's discussion. What, in your esteemed and scholarly opinion, is the better path to wealth? Clearly everything I've said has been like pig slop compared to the pearls you're about to lay down for everyone.

Originally Posted by Don Carlos

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Oh, for ****'s sake. First of all, you're WAY too hung up on the wording of that quote. You don't like the lettering of the second sentence? Fine. Fair. I'll concede that it was a poor choice.

That said, the spirit of the quote holds true.



Didn't I just predict that you'd start getting into a semantics discussion on quantifying the definition of ****-you money? Did I not just call this and suggest that it was orthogonal to my point?

I did, didn't I?

Look, man. I don't know what's up your ass tonight, first of all, but your tone is a little unnecessarily aggro. Second, you're missing my point repeatedly in service of stupid semantics discussions. If I had any interest in continually picking nits over word choices with you, I have no doubt you'd be up for it all night. Unfortunately, I lack the interest.

I don't think you've suggested anything that detracts from my broader point. Rather, you've bitten relentlessly into the quote I cited -- which was supposed to be a philosophical jumping-off point, and whose implications are still valid. If that's not computing with you, I'm sorry. We're just not going to go anywhere productive or worthwhile with more semantics debate, and I hope you feel the same. If not, I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I'm done with it. I've made my point, it's a valid one, and if folks want to spin their wheels on the word choices like a bunch of lawyers in discovery, that's their prerogative.

So you can't even back up or further explain your own obviously weak point? Good job there.

Originally Posted by Freewheeler

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So you can't even back up or further explain your own obviously weak point? Good job there.
You are aggressively dense, and your snark is backed up by nothing of substance. I hope the others on this thread can pick up where we left off before you derailed it with your inane "contributions." Peace.

Originally Posted by Don Carlos

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You are aggressively dense, and your snark is backed up by nothing of substance. I hope the others on this thread can pick up where we left off before you derailed it with your inane "contributions."

Peace.

I wish you could add some substance to your own argument. I shot bullet holes through your idea of logic and now you have nothing.

Originally Posted by Freewheeler

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I wish you could add some substance to your own argument. I shot bullet holes through your idea of logic and now you have nothing.
You "shot bullet holes" through the wording on the second half of a quote I brought up. You have addressed nothing whatsoever of my logic. Let me spell out the logic for you in kid-friendly, easily digestible bullet points: 1) Salaries (for most people; $10MM+ salaries are not indicative of most corp salaries) are not a typically great path to ****-you wealth. 2) Ownership and risk-seeking, backed by hard work, is a better path to ****-you wealth. Do you disagree with that logic? If so, you haven't really said anything on the subject.

Originally Posted by Carlisle Blues

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To me it meant knowing that in the beginning I would get paid the least and last, that "delayed gratification" regarding luxuries would be my mantra and and it may take years to realize my financial dreams. On the other hand, whatever I made was because of my devotion, skill and execution of my duties. I put my head on the pillow at night knowing that it was my business and I would make it no matter what.

I considered myself a rich man long before I ever went out on my own. That was the impetus for opening my business. I was simply not afraid to fail.

This is where I think all roads are heading. I guess there was the guy who invented the twirly pop and pet rock, but those guys are the exception. Its mostly giving some value to the purchaser of your skills/products.

Mark Cuban (billionaire, owner of the Dallas Mavericks, film producer) has written about this on his blog. He's a proponent of the "no shortcuts" school of thought.

I've copied one of his posts below, you can find more at www.blogmaverick.com

Interesting discussion!

How to Get Rich (by Mark Cuban)

Thats what so many want. Right ? I'm certainly not going to lie and say it is not a whole lot better having lots of money. I had a whole lot of fun and loved my life when I was eating mustard and ketchup sandwiches and sleeping on the floor of a 3 bedroom apartment that housed me and 5 buddies.

I have a whole lot more fun now. It doesn't suck to be rich.

The question everyone wants answered, is how to get there. There are ways to get there. But there is not a template that works every time for everyone. It works sometimes. Getting there requires being ready when opportunity presents itself.

IMHO, change and uncertainty create opportunity. Times like we are facing now, with complete financial uncertainty are perfect times to start on the road to getting ahead financially.

First, here is WHAT NOT TO DO:

There are no shortcuts. NONE. With all of this craziness in the stock and financial markets, there will be scams popping up left and right. The less money you have, the more likely someone will come at you with some scheme . The schemes will guarantee returns, use multi level marketing, or be something crazy that is now "backed by the US Government". Please ignore them. Always remember this. If a deal is a great deal, they aren't going to share it with you.

I dont broadcast my great deals. I keep them all to myself. The 2nd thing to remember is that if the person selling the deal was so smart, they would be rich beyond rich rather than trolling the streets looking to turn you into a sucker. There are no shortcuts.

So what should you do to get rich ?

Save your money. Save as much money as you possibly can. Every penny you can. Instead of coffee, drink water. Instead of going to McDonalds, eat Mac and Cheese. Cut up your credit cards. If you use a credit card, you dont want to be rich. The first step to getting rich, requires discipline. If you really want to be rich, you need to find the discipline, can you ?

If you can, you will quickly find that the greatest rate of return you will earn is on your own personal spending. Being a smart shopper is the first step to getting rich. Yeah you have to give things up and that doesn't work for everyone, particularly if you have a family. That is reality. But whatever you can save, save it. As much as you possibly can. Then put it in 6 month CDs in the bank.

The first step to getting rich is having cash available. You arent saving for retirement. You are saving for the moment you need cash. Buy and hold is a suckers game for you. This market is a perfect example. Right at the very moment when cash creates unbelievable opportunity, those who followed the buy and hold strategy have no cash. they cant or wont sell into markets this low, that kills the entire point of buy and hold. Those who have put their money in CDs sleep well at night and definitely have more money today than they did yesterday. And because they are smart, disciplined shoppers, their personal rate of inflation is within their means. Cash is king for those wanting to get rich

The 2nd rule for getting rich is getting smart. Investing your time in yourself and becoming knowledgeable about the business of something you really love to do

It doesn't matter what it is. Whatever your hobbies, interests, passions are. Find the one you love the best and GET A JOB in the business that supports it.

It could be as a clerk, a salesperson, whatever you can find. You have to start learning the business somewhere. Instead of paying to go to school somewhere, you are getting paid to learn. It may not be the perfect job, but there is no perfect path to getting rich.

Before or after work and on weekends, every single day, read everything there is to read about the business. Go to trade shows, read the trade magazines, spend a lot of time talking to the people you do business with about their business and the people they buy from.

This is not a short term project. We aren't talking days. We aren't talking months. We are talking years. Lots of years and maybe decades. I didn't say this was a get rich quick scheme. This is a get rich path

Now you wait for times of uncertainty and change in your business. The time will come. It may come quickly, it may take years and years. But it will come. The nature of our country's business infrastructure is that it is destined to be boom and bust. Booms are when the smart people sell. Busts are when rich people started on their path to wealth.

You will know when that time is here for you because you will know your business inside and out. You will be ready because you will have been saving up for this moment in time

With all the change and uncertainty in the financial markets, there are people right now making more money than they ever dreamed of. They are the ones who have been living the real estate market and the financing behind it and understanding what actually what was going on. They re the one who understood the complexities of the credit markets. When everyone was following the crowd, they kept on saving their money and avoiding the temptation of groupthink.

Boom and busts happen to every industry. The question is whether you have the discipline to be ready when it happens for you ?

If you do, you will find out what it feels like to get lucky.

Originally Posted by Freewheeler

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Then don't use a stupid and inaccurate quote about salaries, which uses the words "no matter how high". If you can add, then you know that someone who makes 10 million plus a year and has been doing that for a few years - then they obviously are worth more than 10 million dollars. 10 million a year for 10 years, minus the taxes and what do you get? Is that **** you money?

By the way, 10 million dollars is easily **** you money for most people, when you consider the fact that you can live out the rest of your life very well with much less if you are smart with the money. Are you telling me the guy who lives on 40,000 a year for many years now, can't quit his job tomorrow and live a great life with his 10 million dollars minus taxes? I am quite sure he would be in a position to tell everyone to **** off and die a very happy man who never had to work for money to live since.

It sounds like **** you money by your standards is to be able to blow millions of dollars on cocaine, hookers, cars and nice clothes or whatever you want to waste money on - but still have a huge chunk of change in the bank. I guess Bruce Wayne is **** you money.

You're completely missing the point, brah

Originally Posted by bob99

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Mark Cuban (billionaire, owner of the Dallas Mavericks, film producer) has written about this on his blog. He's a proponent of the "no shortcuts" school of thought.
Excellent, thank you.

btw, i disagree. there is a shortcut to becoming wealthy. Start early.

Just found another Mark Cuban post where he goes into more detail about his background, starting his company, selling it to Yahoo! for over $1B. Very inspiring story, from a guy who was just working as a salesman and didn't know anything about computers initially, but he worked hard etc.

Reminds me of the Samuel Goldwyn quote, "The harder I work, the luckier I get."

Linked below, definitely worth reading!

http://blogmaverick.com/2011/04/07/s...ss-motivation/

500k may be a bit high, but there are plenty of people who earn high salaries and aren't wealthy. They live in slightly better homes, in better parts of town, drive later model cars, and send their kids to better/private schools. However, they would lose their home and everything else if they lost their jobs and couldn't find another one for an extended period of time. A wealthy person would be able to maintain a reasonable lifestyle without the need to earn wages.

Originally Posted by cross22

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500k may be a bit high, but there are plenty of people who earn high salaries and aren't wealthy. They live in slightly better homes, in better parts of town, drive later model cars, and send their kids to better/private schools. However, they would lose their home and everything else if they lost their jobs and couldn't find another one for an extended period of time. A wealthy person would be able to maintain a reasonable lifestyle without the need to earn wages.

You have got to remove that avatar. I can't focus on your words.