Best Selvedge Denim for the Middle Class?

LA Guy · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by wEstSidE

45rpm - $750 million (66 billion JPY) in revenue - 54 stores in japan
http://denimsandjeans.com/top-denim-...&country=Japan

i didn't believe it but i checked the 45 rpm studio website and they really do have a ton of stores in japan. in america they have 2 stores in new york.

but i can't argue that this is the norm.

60 or so doors is not a lot of outlets. Although we think of Rag&Bone as a big brand on Styleforum, it is really not. It's a mid-sized company at best. Within 100 miles of Manhattan, there are 55 retail outlets, 100 miles around Beverly Hills alone, there are 38 retail outlets. In Japan, there are 34 outlets. There are hundreds more outlets internationally.

PaulYAY · Apr 8, 2011

^for clarification, retail outlets=stockists there? Or I guess a stockist could have many outlets...

anyways, those 45rpm numbers are pretty shocking to me.

LA Guy · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by MrGoodBytes

I was arguing with a style-victim friend the other day about clothing prices:
why would I spend 100-200 for that hoodie, this one was 60 (overpriced) and I've gotten 10 years out of it.
Distributed cost. If your going to wear it obsessively, does it really make a difference if it averaged 6 dollars a year or 20. It should last longer than what you have but even if it doesn't your going to look a hell of a lot better in the process.

splurge! its worth it in the end.

The distributed cost argument is a chimera. The truth is that people who buy expensive clothes will (usually) continue to buy more expensive clothes. My dad, by contrast, has worn a pair of jeans from Sears that I think my mom got him over a decade ago, several times a week. It is frugality that would make Mother Teresa weep.

My clothes, and yours, are luxuries. Nothing wrong with that.

wEstSidE · Apr 8, 2011

the number of stores in japan = 54.

meaning they have 54 of their own stores (45 or baidou R, NOT stockists) which sell mostly their own products.

LA Guy · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by PaulYAY

^for clarification, retail outlets=stockists there? Or I guess a stockist could have many outlets...

anyways, those 45rpm numbers are pretty shocking to me.

Yes. I specifically write retail outlets to get rid of that ambiguity.

The 45RPM numbers don't surprise me that much. Brands nearly always have more doors domestically, and Japan is a fashion crazed country. Some of the brands that Self Edge carries, by comparison, are by comparison, much smaller.

lesamourai · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by LA Guy

The distributed cost argument is a chimera. The truth is that people who buy expensive clothes will (usually) continue to buy more expensive clothes. My dad, by contrast, has worn a pair of jeans from Sears that I think my mom got him over a decade ago, several times a week. It is frugality that would make Mother Teresa weep.

My clothes, and yours, are luxuries. Nothing wrong with that.

Yep. I'm sure if we didn't buy expensive clothes our money would go to 'waste' elsewhere.

CalTex · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by lesamourai

Yep. I'm sure if we didn't buy expensive clothes our money would go to 'waste' elsewhere.

Hey I consider my money spent on clothes as an investment, I walk into class looking better than the rest and I will preform better than the rest. ALPHA MOTHER FREAKING MALE.

lol

On a serious note, The thread seems to be developing nicely.

whatever123 · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by wEstSidE

45rpm - $750 million (66 billion JPY) in revenue - 54 stores in japan http://denimsandjeans.com/top-denim-...&country=Japan i didn't believe it but i checked the 45 rpm studio website and they really do have a ton of stores in japan. in america they have 2 stores in new york. but i can't argue that this is the norm.
interesting. but this figure can be misleading. They earned 750M (usd) in total revenues (p * q). this figure does not tell you how wealthy they are as it has nothing to do with true profit. net income would be the best indicator of their true wealth. but yeah, they really do sell a ton of clothes especially for having ~ 60 stores worldwide.

El Argentino · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by lesamourai

Yep. I'm sure if we didn't buy expensive clothes our money would go to 'waste' elsewhere.

For sure - the argument I was originally trying to make was that dropping $300 for denim as opposed to $30, ignoring quality, image, whatever, is all a pride issue. "I can pay this much, so I will. The plebe next to me can't or isn't willing to and I thereby feel better about myself."

Kind of sad, but I think this affects everyone to some degree, especially here on the forums, or they wouldn't be here. I see it a lot with Mac owners too in classes. "I can afford (correction - my parents can afford) to spend double on a functioning computer, so I will, just to have that shiny apple on the cover of my laptop."

supermidget · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by Jd5016

HAhaaa, really guy?!
cmon.

Thank you to all that had positive and informative input.

I actually just got home from Tanger Outlets and scored a nice pair of NF Skinny Guy selvage at Barney's for a cool $80bucks after all discounts!

i actually had taken a look at those and ultimately decided against them on behalf of the camo denim.

Jd5016 · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by supermidget

i actually had taken a look at those and ultimately decided against them on behalf of the camo denim.

Yea, I don't care for the inner camo print but I guess these will have to permanently remain uncuffed. For the price, I'm OK with that.

LA Guy · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by El Argentino

For sure - the argument I was originally trying to make was that dropping $300 for denim as opposed to $30, ignoring quality, image, whatever, is all a pride issue. "I can pay this much, so I will. The plebe next to me can't or isn't willing to and I thereby feel better about myself."

Kind of sad, but I think this affects everyone to some degree, especially here on the forums, or they wouldn't be here. I see it a lot with Mac owners too in classes. "I can afford (correction - my parents can afford) to spend double on a functioning computer, so I will, just to have that shiny apple on the cover of my laptop."

I have both PCs and Macs, for purely functional reasons. However, I can see the aesthetic appeal of the Mac products. There is a price associated with that. Whether the price of any particular feature, be it functional or otherwise, is worth it to the consumer, is an intensely personal decision.

wEstSidE · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by whatever123

interesting. but this figure can be misleading.

They earned 750M (usd) in total revenues (p * q). this figure does not tell you how wealthy they are as it has nothing to do with true profit.

net income would be the best indicator of their true wealth. but yeah, they really do sell a ton of clothes especially for having ~ 60 stores worldwide.

it's not misleading. building stores aint cheap. you've got to be successful to grow like that. compare this to diesel that has 300 own-branded stores worldwide, and was founded in the same year (1978).

whatever123 · Apr 8, 2011

Originally Posted by wEstSidE

it's not misleading. building stores aint cheap. you've got to be successful to grow like that. compare this to diesel that has 300 own-branded stores worldwide, and was founded in the same year (1978).
i was suggesting that the 750M figure is simply their total revenue. as such, does not include any deductions found on their income statement (all expenses, liabilities, capex, deprecation, blah, blah, blah). some people might look at the 750M figure and assume that is what the owners/shareholders earned during last fiscal year when in fact the true net income (true earnings after all deductions) would be a fraction of the total revenue ... a small fraction! but yes, it does cost a fortune to maintain a clothing line

wEstSidE · Apr 8, 2011

i said clearly "in revenue." you can't blame me if people don't know what that means.

Best Selvedge Denim for the Middle Class?

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