Allen Edmonds for Brooks Brothers

Originally Posted by ns7

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This is great and all... But why would I pay $20 extra for the Park Avenues and $50 extra for the Strands?

Unless of course they run the 40% off deal again this Christmas.

That was exactly my point. Unless the last is different there is no point of buying these shoes from BB instead of AE. But I think majority of consumers are ignorant about shoe lasts.

Originally Posted by ns7

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This is great and all... But why would I pay $20 extra for the Park Avenues and $50 extra for the Strands?


Would the the cushioned footbed (not an option with regular AEs) be worth $20 to you?

I don't disagree with your sentiments vis-a-vis Alden and BB. That being said, right now Alden can make much more money selling shell into Europe and Japan, and their specialty boots people seem to be clamoring for.

It may very well be a blip, but they don't know that. All they know right now is that they are giving up more profitbale factory time in favor of trying to supply BB. I think BB has just become too big a customer and demands too much of Alden's production capacity. Thirty years ago BB had maybe 20 US stores, now there are at least a hundred. BB needs someone with more capacity with lower price points. Enter AE, with new production capacity looking to move product.

As a 30yr BB customer, it troubles me, but quite frankly, BB doesn't really care if I leave or not. I am not their target audience anymore. They want the younger crowd. And that younger crowd---as a group---doesn't really care about conservatively styled, US made, classic shoes that Alden supplies to BB. Particularly as Alden continues to move the wholesale price to BB higher and higher.

I am sure BB can cut a much better deal with AE right now. But those styles, as a start, are very weak.

Originally Posted by ns7

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This is great and all... But why would I pay $20 extra for the Park Avenues and $50 extra for the Strands?

Unless of course they run the 40% off deal again this Christmas.

You or I wouldn't, but the majority of BB customers do not know that they are AE shoes. They have the BB name on them, which to many is still an indication of quality and luxury.

Originally Posted by classicusa

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I am sure BB can cut a much better deal with AE right now. But those styles, as a start, are very weak.

I don't have too much invested in what BB does, one way or the other, but this last comment interests me. Would you mind telling us why you think the styles are weak? Personally, I think the Strand and Fifth Avenue (the first two) are fine, solid conservative styles that would appeal to the traditional man. The other three are meh, IMO.

Originally Posted by laufer

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That was exactly my point. Unless the last is different there is no point of buying these shoes from BB instead of AE. But I think majority of consumers are ignorant about shoe lasts.
not only that, but I would guess 95% of their customers either won't know or won't care about the difference between AE and Alden. AE probably cost BB less, and is probably a higher margin product for BB to sell.

I agree pricing is too close to Peal & Co.

If anything, I would think that the volume from BB would command lower prices from AE. Hell, maybe they are and BB just thinks this price point will work.

Originally Posted by Geoff Gander

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Would the the cushioned footbed (not an option with regular AEs) be worth $20 to you?

I'm not sure what a "cushioned footbed" is, but it sounds like a description of a cheap fabric insole, as opposed to a legitimate leather insole, which in my mind would actually lower the value of the shoe.

Does anybody have information on what constitutes a "cushioned footbed?"

I also was on back order for a pair of BB Aldens. If anything, the experience made me even more pleased with BB service... the saleman at my local store finally called me to tell me he frankly didn't know when the shoes would be in and offered me both a full refund if I didn't wish to wait for them, and a discount on anything in the store if I chose to use it.

Makes me annoyed at Alden, but BB customer service has been about the best I've experienced anywhere. I'm really looking for good things from them with the whole line now.

Originally Posted by laufer

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But I think majority of consumers are ignorant about shoe lasts.

You can count me as one of the ignorant until I started reading SF a short while back, then the light bulb went off about some of my shoes fitting right and others not despite being the same size. What is the best way to figure out the lasts that fit best a person's feet? Thanks.

Originally Posted by harvey_birdman

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I'm not sure what a "cushioned footbed" is, but it sounds like a description of a cheap fabric insole, as opposed to a legitimate leather insole, which in my mind would actually lower the value of the shoe.

Does anybody have information on what constitutes a "cushioned footbed?"

Poron is a dense, synthetic rubber footbed. Common in hiking shoes and boots.

Originally Posted by Mudhiker

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Poron is a dense, synthetic rubber footbed. Common in hiking shoes and boots.

So is the Poron replacing the normal cork footbed? Does that mean these shoes cannot be resoled?

Originally Posted by classicusa

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I don't disagree with your sentiments vis-a-vis Alden and BB. That being said, right now Alden can make much more money selling shell into Europe and Japan, and their specialty boots people seem to be clamoring for.

The question is whether it's a good trade of long term stability for short run profits. None of us is in a position to answer (I don't think), but it's probably in our collective interest that they manage their business for long run stability. I'm really just assuming though - Brooks Bros may not have been a stable, consistent client at all, and Alden may have concluded that they're better off without them than with them.

From a product perspective, do we think Brooks is phasing out Alden altogether, or will they keep Alden shell and use AE for calf? I could see Alden being pretty happy with that deal.

Originally Posted by Geoff Gander

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Would you mind telling us why you think the styles are weak?

That half leather sole is not indicative of what is traditionally considered a high quality shoe. I would never buy a dress shoe with that sole, but hey, that's just me. So if I am a "target" for those offerings, they missed the mark. Maybe they'll work for others...

Originally Posted by cncrd

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I also was on back order for a pair of BB Aldens. If anything, the experience made me even more pleased with BB service... the saleman at my local store finally called me to tell me he frankly didn't know when the shoes would be in and offered me both a full refund if I didn't wish to wait for them, and a discount on anything in the store if I chose to use it.

Makes me annoyed at Alden, but BB customer service has been about the best I've experienced anywhere. I'm really looking for good things from them with the whole line now.

Other than not having any idea about when they will get the shoes, and having a poor inventory mgmt system that simply adds 21 days to a really unknown delivery date, the people have been great. They disocunted my shoes further, which is welcome---if I ever get them! BB is the ultimate middleman here. They have no control over the supplier, and don't know what to tell the buyers. I think your SA, like many others in their system, is getting frustrated with customers constantly asking "where are my shoes?" BB is making an effort recently I haven't seen in a long time from a service standpoint. There seeme to be a lot of latitude recently to "take care" of issues like this. That is commendable...although it doesn't solve the problem.