The Ultimate "HARDCORE" Shoe Appreciation Thread (Bespoke only)

Originally Posted by DWFII

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I was informed some time ago that they have gone to gemming in some models and I am not a fan.

Originally Posted by DWFII

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I am relatively sure (hopeful, anyway) that all of G&G bespoke work is hand welted.

All G&G bespoke shoes are fully handmade: individual last, individual patterns, uppers made for that particular last, hand welted, hand stitched. (Just like all the bespoke work from John Lobb, Fosters or Cleverley.}

All G&G ready-to-wear, bench-made or made-to-order shoes, are machine made (with hand finish for certain production steps) and utilize gemming, just like all other English shoes (bespoke excepted) for the last fifty years. JLP, Cleverley and Fosters (or previous Alan McAffee) use also gemming for their RTW ranges.

The difference is in the price: a pair of bespoke shoes (from any of the companies mentioned) costs about three times as much as a RTW or MTO pair. Every customer can decide for himself, whether he wants one or three pairs of shoes for the same amount of money.

It's horses for courses.

Originally Posted by bengal-stripe

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All G&G bespoke shoes are fully handmade: individual last, individual patterns, uppers made for that particular last, hand welted, hand stitched. (Just like all the bespoke work from John Lobb, Fosters or Cleverley.} All G&G ready-to-wear, bench-made or made-to-order shoes, are machine made (with hand finish for certain production steps) and utilize gemming, just like all other English shoes (bespoke excepted) for the last fifty years. JLP, Cleverley and Fosters (or previous Alan McAffee) use also gemming for their RTW ranges. The difference is in the price: a pair of bespoke shoes (from any of the companies mentioned) costs about three times as much as a RTW or MTO pair. Every customer can decide for himself, whether he wants one or three pairs of shoes for the same amount of money. It's horses for courses.
Thank you for that clarification...pretty much what I thought. That said, while not intending to revive a brouhaha that hits all the tender parts for some folks...there is an objectively demonstrable difference in the quality--the superiority--of handwelted versus gemmed/goodyear techniques. That's my take as a maker.

Originally Posted by DWFII

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That said, while not intending to revive a brouhaha......

Of course not! - You wouldn't......

Originally Posted by DWFII

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......there is an objectively demonstrable difference in the quality--the superiority--of handwelted versus gemmed/goodyear techniques.

There is also a demonstrable superiority in the price.

Originally Posted by DWFII

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That's my take as a maker.

Only a maker/manufacturer who employs and has experience with both methods can evaluate the two and give his reasons,
why they have made the choices they've made.

So far Messrs. Gaziano, Corthey, Cleverley(Glasgow) have not been forthcoming to give their side of the coin.

Originally Posted by bengal-stripe

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Of course not! - You wouldn't......

There is also a demonstrable superiority in the price.

Only a maker/manufacturer who employs and has experience with both methods can evaluate the two and give his reasons, why they have made the choices they've made. So far Messrs. Gaziano, Corthey, Cleverley(Glasgow) have not been forthcoming to give their side of the coin.
Well, I'm not ever gonna forswear mentioning gemming, nor even placing lower on the hierarchy of quality than GY welted. But I wouldn't have pursued it any further than a mention if cdmoore hadn't asked about it. When I was a young man and doing repair, I saw a lot of problems with gemming. But never in life would I have thought that I would need to document those issues. So I don't have photos from that time. That said,I do have a few photos...taken just in the last couple of months...that document a lot of the same problems I saw thirty years ago...one photo in particular taken of a pair of "famous name" English shoes that have been worn as part of a rotation and on "rose-petal strewn carpets", as who should say. Striking photo, that one. Beyond all that I will say...in passing because I don't want to hijack this thread...that the real question posed by your response (when you burrow down to the real substance and meat of the discussion) is what constitutes "superiority in the price"? Your comments suggest...imply...that a low price is superior. And to be preferred. I disagree but that's one perspective. But once you take that tack you can't escape the logical conclusion--that the lower the price the more superior. Soon we're at Walmart looking for shoes. I might add, also in passing...and to get us back to bespoke shoes and these G&G's...that we have heard from Gaziano and Corthay and Lobb and Delos: The very fact that they offer...indeed insist on...hand-welted in their premier lines, speaks volumes. As much or more than a post on SF. And far more than my...obviously biased...explanations.

Originally Posted by DWFII

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That said,I do have a few photos...taken just in the last couple of months...that document a lot of the same problems I saw thirty years ago...one photo in particular taken of a pair of "famous name" English shoes that have been worn as part of a rotation and on "rose-petal strewn carpets", as who should say. Striking photo, that one.

Would love to see those photos.

I've decided since I don't want to spend the money on bespoke shoes and I also hate gemming that I am no longer wearing shoes.

In that case may I recommend this alternative for an affordable, handsewn and bespoke option:



No gemming here!

^Exactly.

I still wear socks and handmade flip flops made with organic coconut husk, which is naturally anti-microbial. I also wear goggles all the time now too as I was informed that gemmed shoes from wearers nearby would fail unpredictably and explode and the shards of leather and more importantly the synthetic fiberboard could blind me.

Originally Posted by imatlas

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No gemming here!

Obviously the 'Darling Clementine' range of footwear:

"And her shoe were number nine,
Herring boxes without topses,
Sandals were for Clementine"

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Discussions of gemming should go in the Official Gemming thread. Let's get this thread back on track.

All from here.

Koji Suzuki (boots included just for DWFII ).








Edward Green bespoke













Lobb





Cleverley







G&G

Jesus Christ . . .

Originally Posted by onix

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Would love to see those photos.
Well, I can post them...but where?

Originally Posted by HORNS

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Jesus Christ . . .

Agreed, wonderful work of art!

Originally Posted by ohm

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damn the stingrays almost made me orgasm. i'll try to remember to post my pics tonight