Gun Appreciation Thread

Originally Posted by JustinW

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You can do some crazy stuff with the 10/22 platform.

Have you looked at the SIg 522? I have yet to inspect one, but they are getting rave reviews!
I'm very tempted by the Sig 522. Haven't shot but have handled and from what I hear, very fun to shoot.

Originally Posted by JustinW

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You can do some crazy stuff with the 10/22 platform.

Very true, I have one myself. However, its still a 10/22.
You can dress up an ugly girl, but she's still ugly.
You can do wild stuff with a 10/22 (some of the cooler mods below), but at the end of the day its still a hundred dollar POS 10/22

Originally Posted by j

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I'm very tempted by the Sig 522. Haven't shot but have handled and from what I hear, very fun to shoot.
CDNN has a sweet deal a few months ago - but a new SIG556 and get a free 522.

Originally Posted by cahlersmeyer

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Wow I love that SAW 10/22! Even cooler than the Krinker Plinker, but $550?? http://www.gunsamerica.com/975850746..._PARA_M249.htm

I ask this in jest, but am partially serious.

I would like to construct an apocalypse survival kit. Ideally, said kit would be functional in multiple apocalypse scenarios, including:

1) Ecological apocalypse (i.e. the Road)--must fend off canibals
2) Zombie apocalypse
3) Financial apocalypse / general anarchy
3b) Financial apocalypse / Chinese invasion

Ideally, set up would have the ancillary purpose of home defense. In a pistol/rifle set up, I would prefer ammunition to be interchangeable for the two (and relatively cheap). I'd value accuracy over stopping power (unless convinced otherwise). Combined budget for said firearms would probably be limited to $600. I would also consider a rifle set up where pistol was rendered redundant (weight, wield, etc.) in so far as quality of rifle was greatly increased.

Any suggestions?

I have a .22 LR kit for my 1911, but these things are ridiculous. .223 ammo is not that expensive.

If we're talking 10/22s, I want one of these conversion kits:



$455 is steep for a kit (sans gun) though.

The 10/22 is an extremely versatile platform. The downside is that you'll spend tons of money upgrading a $150 rifle. I have over $700 into my 10/22 and I'm still not done spending!

Originally Posted by fairholme_wannabe

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I would like to construct an apocalypse survival kit. Ideally, said kit would be functional in multiple apocalypse scenarios, including:

1) Ecological apocalypse (i.e. the Road)--must fend off canibals
2) Zombie apocalypse
3) Financial apocalypse / general anarchy
3b) Financial apocalypse / Chinese invasion


The best survival kits start with:

1. Knowledge
2. Water
3. Food
4. Shelter

Frankly, you can't eat bullets. Guns are far, far down on my list of priorities in a survival kit.

If your #3 and #3b truly interest you, I would recommend buying a copy of this book, which was written by a man who lived through the 2001 economic collapse in Argentina. I've read a bunch of survival manuals -- and more importantly, I've been to survival school -- yet this poorly written book (English is not the author's first language) ends up being a most useful guide.

Some parts of his book are not very practical (e.g. the chapters on hand to hand combat/knife fighting) but the other parts of the book are invaluable in that they are based on first hand experience in a semi-likely survival scenario. We know zombies will never attack. However, natural disasters will happen, and maybe being prepared will help one get through relatively unscathed.

PS I vote 12 gauge for zombie defense. Zombies don't suffer from blood loss, so punching little .22 or .30 caliber holes in them is not likely to do much good. However, 9 pellets of 00 buck will ruin any shambling undead's ability to pursue you and your loved ones.

Originally Posted by Ace Rimmer

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We know zombies will never attack. However, natural disasters will happen, and maybe being prepared will help one get through relatively unscathed.

PS I vote 12 gauge for zombie defense. Zombies don't suffer from blood loss, so punching little .22 or .30 caliber holes in them is not likely to do much good. However, 9 pellets of 00 buck will ruin any shambling undead's ability to pursue you and your loved ones.

I would have opted for slugs against the zombies. On a more serious note, I was going to suggest one of the Mossberg/Maverick pump guns in lieu of the rifle. They can be had for less than $200 and might be more practical in many home defense scenarios than a rifle. For a handgun, I was going to suggest a medium-frame Taurus .357 Magnum revolver since such can be had for around $350 at retail. There are no doubt better options, but that $600 budget is kind of confining, and these two weapons would give him and his family an excellent level of protection.

Re: Ace Rimmer--Thanks for the book suggestion. I'll definitely have to look into that. So a Saiga-12 would be a good option by your recommendation?

Originally Posted by JLibourel

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I would have opted for slugs against the zombies. On a more serious note, I was going to suggest one of the Mossberg/Maverick pump guns in lieu of the rifle. They can be had for less than $200 and might be more practical in many home defense scenarios than a rifle. For a handgun, I was going to suggest a medium-frame Taurus .357 Magnum revolver since such can be had for around $350 at retail. There are no doubt better options, but that $600 budget is kind of confining, and these two weapons would give him and his family an excellent level of protection.

Fabulous! Thanks for the advice. What $$ would be necessary to procure the option that you would wish to recommend?

Yeah, 12ga security (high capacity) pump shotgun and cheap compact Glock 9mm would be my suggestions. You most likely won't need a rifle no matter what happens and if there were such a scenario, they would be available to someone holding a shotgun. Also +1 on that book, that guy seems a little overboard at times but he has lots of good suggestions you wouldn't think about. His blog is good too.

Originally Posted by Ataturk

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I have a .22 LR kit for my 1911, but these things are ridiculous. .223 ammo is not that expensive.

100 rounds of quality .22lr (MiniMags or equivalent) will run you about $7.50
100 rounds of decent brass-cased .223 will cost $30-40.

A base 522 is ~$400 (I paid $410 for one with the green stock, IIRC) - thus paying for itself in 1700 rounds (or less) if you think of it as exclusively a replacement for .223.

There are a ton of other reasons to shoot a .22 over .223, though - shorter ranges needed to push yourself, less noise/easier suppressing if that's your game, etc..


It would be fun to put together a set of .22 SBRs - a GSG-5 or Umarex MP5 shortened to MP5 Navy specs, a shorty AR-22, a 522P with a stock. $600 in tax stamps and the cost of setting up a trust and it could be mine, all mine.

Originally Posted by fairholme_wannabe

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Re: Ace Rimmer--Thanks for the book suggestion. I'll definitely have to look into that. So a Saiga-12 would be a good option by your recommendation?

No. From what I've seen, the Saiga 12 is not a reliable gun. At the last shotgun class I attended, a local cop brought a Saiga shotgun. Yes he reloaded faster than the rest of us (who did not have magazine-fed shotguns) but he experienced quite a few misfeeds. A fighting gun needs to be dead-to-rights reliable -- and IMO the Saiga fails to meet this criteria.

Per Jan's recommendation, check out a lightly used 12 gauge Mossberg 500, Maverick, or Remington 870 Express/Wingmaster with a short barrel (18" or 20" -- subject to legal limits on barrel length). New, these guns may be had for $300 but that eats up half of your $600 budget so I say go used and you can find one for $200 if you look hard enough.

Remember, your budget must account for:

1. Firearm
2. Ammo
3. Sling (for long guns)/holster (for handguns)
4. Spare speedloaders/magazines
5. Hearing/eye protection, cleaning kit, triggerlock

and

6. Training -- possibly the most important expenditure of all! Owning a Stradivarius does not make one an expert violinist.

... so make sure your budget reflects a realistic and practical view of everything you need to have a complete solution.

Originally Posted by fairholme_wannabe

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I would also consider a rifle set up where pistol was rendered redundant (weight, wield, etc.) in so far as quality of rifle was greatly increased.

One more thing: again as Jan confirmed, get a long arm and a handgun. Don't blow your budget on just one or the other. They are different tools for different jobs, and its best to cover all your bases. Handguns are great for mobile defense, long arms for stationary defense.

Part of any effective home defense strategy involves collecting your loved ones and getting back into your safe room. Got a wife? Got kids? Got doors in your home? Gonna need to shepherd everybody back into the safe room, and sometimes you need one hand free to open doors, carry small infants, turn on lights, and all that jazz. Hard to do with a shotgun; easier to do with a handgun. Once you've got everyone into your safe room, you can unlimber the shotgun and point it at the door, and woe betide anyone who gets into that funnel.

I'll second Jan's vote for a .357 Magnum revolver as a great first handgun. Simple, relatively economical and very effective. Versatile as well -- you can shoot cheap, soft-shooting .38 Specials or you can shoot firebreather 357 Magnum loads from the same gun.

A shotgun is good for home defense, but for a real end-of-the-world scenario, you'd need a rifle. For shooting things at more than 20 yards or so. And a rifle that shoots pistol ammo is useless. Go with the classic AR-15.

And don't worry about food and the like; there will be plenty of Ace Rimmers to rip off.

^^ oh yeah? You've never seen how much I can eat!