Countdown to Breaking Bad!!!

Originally Posted by somatoform

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Gus also has to proceed with caution. He wouldn't want to piss off or scare the hell out of Walt too much since the product has to be impeccable in order to sustain his independence from the cartel which has already made its reappearance this episode.


I'm guessing Gus gets taken out by the cartels. Walt knows that Gus maneuvered the DEA against them, maybe he tips them off in order to save his own life.

I see Walt allying himself with the cartels to make a move on gus and take over gus' position.

This was a pretty amazing season. The fact that we now expect Breaking Bad to be this good consistently is an indicator of what a fantastic show it truly is.

The finale was intense, and more than that. The peek into Gale's world -- the way his apartment and his lifestyle told you everything about him -- was done very well. And, likewise, the vision of a brash young Walt was revealing. Could he be overcompensating as a meth cooker for his lifelong inability to earn as he had hoped?

For a minute there, I really thought Walt was selling out Jesse. And then, his gambit -- and the way he said Yeah in the face of Mike's horror -- and the way he snapped his jacket. I've seen some reviews that bemoan Walt's continuing descent into the abyss, but frankly, in scenes like this I'm rooting for him all the way.

Originally Posted by King Francis

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I've seen some reviews that bemoan Walt's continuing descent into the abyss

Contrary to these reviewers, if by "descent" they mean a change in personality, I think one could argue that Walt's personality does not change at all.

He is very pragmatic/rational. We see this, for example, during the plane crash speech where he cites aviation tragedy statistics to the students in a context in which it may have been insensitive of him, but perfectly rational. We also see it in his rationalizing discussions with Gus.

As an established and increasingly emerging murderer, the circumstances in which he applies his logic change but his penchant for being rational and calculating do not change at all: same Walt expressing himself consistently in different circumstances. To Walt, no doubt Gale's death is lamentable, but it is perfectly logical.

Mildly annoyed that the extra 40 minutes listed in the schedule was just an episode of another series. Trying to fool the people with DVRs, AMC?

In fact, it felt more than a little bit like:

"Okay, Junebug, these are for you."

"What about the rest?"

"The rest are a preview of our exciting new series, Rubicon!"

Originally Posted by Humperdink

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I like Vince Gilligan as creative overseer more than as director, and the episode's pacing was too abrupt.

I thought the abrupt, Sopranos-esque ending worked well, and the staccato pacing of the episode as a whole is another example of why BB is a cut above every other drama on TV right now. Like a fat line of blue meth, "Full Measures" was almost too intense for me to handle at times.

Originally Posted by Humperdink

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Now did poor Gayle get it or not? And if he did, how much time can Walt really expect to buy?

According to this interview, Gale is indeed dead. Apparently, there was a bit of unintentional misdirection with the shot there.

In any case, BB has definitely entered The Wire territory for me, in which I greatly anticipate being able to view the entire series again from the start.

Originally Posted by Teacher

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Gus only wants Walt for three months. Does that mean Gus doesn't want to sell this extremely valuable product after that? Of course not. Gus DOES want his man to learn Walt's formula, and then I'm sure Gus wants Walt out of the picture. Why? To sever himself from Walt and Jesse's mistakes of the past. The longer Walt is around, the more likely the DEA could resume their investigation and track him down. Gus wants no part of that.

Can I call it, or can I call it?

Originally Posted by frenchy

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how about Walt takes out Gus and becomes the new kingpin...remember how he learned mikes lesson about "no half measures"...gus told him once "never make the same mistake twice" and i think Gus is gonna regret teaching Walt that lesson

I don't think so...at least, I don't see Gilligan going in that direction. As a kingpin, Walt could set himself up very securely, and the entire point to this is that Walt is always in danger. Yes, the cartels could be dangerous for him, but if he were in Gus's shoes, it would be too easy for him to hide out/have others taken out, etc. Besides, in crime dramas of this general nature, it seems so "conventional," and this show is anything but.

Originally Posted by somatoform

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Contrary to these reviewers, if by "descent" they mean a change in personality, I think one could argue that Walt's personality does not change at all.

He is very pragmatic/rational. We see this, for example, during the plane crash speech where he cites aviation tragedy statistics to the students in a context in which it may have been insensitive of him, but perfectly rational. We also see it in his rationalizing discussions with Gus.

As an established and increasingly emerging murderer, the circumstances in which he applies his logic change but his penchant for being rational and calculating do not change at all: same Walt expressing himself consistently in different circumstances. To Walt, no doubt Gale's death is lamentable, but it is perfectly logical.

True, but there is still most definitely a metamorphosis here. The Walt of seasons one and two would never have taken these measures. He killed that thug before because his own life was in danger. Then, he had a difficult time dealing with the fact that he'd let Jesse's girlfriend choke to death. Running people down and shooting them in the head, even making the calculated decision to do so, is a huge leap beyond that. He rationalizes these measures by telling himself they're perfectly logical. On some level they are, but when one considers the emotional and legal tolls they ultimately must take on Walt and his family -- not to mention how much more dangerous his life has just become -- one has to at least question the rationality of what he's done. He should have taken his money and run or killed Gus and Mike, who are likely the only two who could find him.

Originally Posted by frenchy

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perfectly put...and speaking of Mike the PI,man he likes his guns big,what was that a desert eagle with a 12 inch silencer?

I think it was.

Originally Posted by mgoose

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I see Walt allying himself with the cartels to make a move on gus and take over gus' position.

I don't think so. Walt is a domestic producer, which puts him directly in competition with the cartels who bring the stuff into the country. Having Walt decide to get in on the distribution part of the equation, which is what Gus does, would be a pretty big trick to pull off.

^^ Not even close on the gun...Not to turn this into the firearms thread...

Heckler & Koch Mk23 .45



It's large, powerful, rugged, and extremely well built. It's an "offensive handgun" built to US Special Forces specs and uses a subsonic .45 round which allows it to be used with a suppresor, I don't think you could really silence a Deagle. Makes sense for Mike to use it in that situation.

It weighs 5lbs loaded with a suppressor and has a total length of 16.5". That is not a small weapon.

It could be a USP (based off the MK23) hard to tell in the low lighting, but I think it's big enough to be the Mk23.

Size comparison (I think these are airsoft toy guns):


That was a truly great scene. Mike was careful and showed that he has some serious bite, if not bark. I am not a fan of the huge cliffhanger ending, but my god was my heart POUNDING during that final scene. What a fantastic show

There's no way Walt can take over from Gus.

Think about what Gus has - a distribution network facilitated by his ownership of Los Hermanos Pollos (yum) as well as his status in the local community.

Walt has none of that and doesn't get any of that by offing Gus.

You guys make it sound as if it's easy enough to just kill Gus and then take over the chicken business.

Originally Posted by mgoose

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I see Walt allying himself with the cartels to make a move on gus and take over gus' position.

I hope not. Without Gus there is no leverage with the DEA. One of the biggest shockers we've been led to believe might happen is that the DEA comes to know that this respectable businessman and philanthropist to the police is a drug kingpin - and Walt could save himself by ratting Gus out. With Gus gone, no shocker and no more leverage for Walt (or anyone else).

Originally Posted by Teacher

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He rationalizes these measures by telling himself they're perfectly logical. On some level they are, but when one considers the emotional and legal tolls they ultimately must take on Walt and his family -- not to mention how much more dangerous his life has just become -- one has to at least question the rationality of what he's done.

True, there's always that irrational underside to his (street) rational decisions.







What about Saul? What does all of this mean for Saul's character? It seems he's a dead man. He lied to Mike (and therefore Gus). He either has to run or enter into a stronger alliance with Jesse and Walt.

Originally Posted by somatoform

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What about Saul? What does all of this mean for Saul's character? It seems he's a dead man. He lied to Mike (and therefore Gus). He either has to run or enter into a stronger alliance with Jesse and Walt.

Heh...in all the commotion, I forgot about him. Last we heard, he was looking for Tetris. And you're right; he's in a lot of trouble. Gus and Mike only buy so many excuses. If they're willing to kill Walt at this point, Saul doesn't have a prayer. In fact, Mike probably will move in on him next before he has a chance to go to the Feds with what he knows.

The show's been officially renewed for a fourth season! Wooohoooo! I can't say it was terribly surprising (it's now AMC's top-rated show), but I'm just glad it's official.