Kindle?

well i'm a voracious student, so that settles it - i need to get a kindle dx. the question is, when? should i just gun for it right now or will the price will go down anytime soon, now that the ipad is out?

Originally Posted by whacked

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I'm the farthest thing from an Apple fanboy, but a little genie called the WSJ brought to my attention a curious note:


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...445033542.html

BTW, the reviews I've seen all rave about the iPad's ability as an e-reader. Maybe testing one yourself before voicing out next time?

I should voice my opinion because I'm not buying in to the hype? Of course the reviews are positive. It's a new Apple gadget. When are those reviews anything but laudatory?

LCDs have never flickered, but many people find them uncomfortable to read for long periods of time. I'm sure people will trot out studies saying there's no difference in order to make the ipad look like the best e-reader ever, but I can't remember the last time I ever got eye strain reading a book, and I read for several consecutive hours each day without breaks. On the other hand, I've gotten plenty of it from staring at LCDs for too long though, and being somewhat of a videophile i'm not the type to leave my LCD in torch mode. I don't know what it is about them, but I'm not alone. Just because it hasn't been measured yet doesn't mean a difference doesn't exist. Even the article you quoted admits that not much research has been done in that area.

Aside from that debatable aspect of eye strain, there are other aspects that are not debatable. The iPad will give off a lot more energy in the form of heat than any e-ink reader. E-ink doesn't give off heat since the pixels are actually made up of physical particles within the screen. A voltage applied to a circuit board makes them visible or not but that is the only time it consumes power, so the batteries last forever and you don't have to hold a heat brick in your hand. The kindle lasts for well over a week with constant use. An ipad lasts 10-11 hours. Even though it lasts that long, I've used my iPhone for upwards of an hour at a time and the damned thing gets hot and uncomfortable to hold (sweaty hands). I wouldn't want to hold an iPad for that long.

Oh and then there's this: http://www.buzzbox.com/top/default/p...c=iPad:The_Sun

And speaking of holding, the ipad weighs 1.5lbs. Mossberg even says in his article that most people will need two hands to read with it. I don't know about you, but I don't read with two hands. The kindle weighs about half of that.

I already said that the ipad probably does a lot of things well, but nobody will ever convince me that it's as comfortable to read as a kindle or similar device. Ya, i've seen demos of it and it is definitely a sexy e-reader. It's probably great if you're just reading a few pages at a time or using it as a web browser, but as someone that wants an e-reader to use for many consecutive hours at a time, I'll pass on it. There are too many downsides. If you want a multipurpose device, it's not even a close comparison, the iPad is better in every other way. I don't understand why that's not enough for Apple fanboys.

Originally Posted by oman

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well i'm a voracious student, so that settles it - i need to get a kindle dx. the question is, when? should i just gun for it right now or will the price will go down anytime soon, now that the ipad is out?
Aren't you done until september? Why not wait? Fwiw, I always read textbooks in a different way than I would read smaller books (typically in a library with the book on a desk and me hunched over it). I think an ipad wouldn't be terrible for text books and you would get the color illustrations if that's important to you. I also tended not to read for as long at a time without doing other things when reading textbooks, but your habits may be different than mine. And if you're gonna get a tablet for school, you might look at the ibm tablets that you can also write with and completely do away with any other devices. it obviously wouldn't be as light as an ipad but it's more versatile. There's more to consider imo.

Originally Posted by oman

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yeah i'm thinking of buying the DX, which is the larger version (9.7") for textbooks and such:

This man has nail polish.

yes but look at that fantastically dull grey screen

it's perfect

Originally Posted by GQgeek

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I should voice my opinion because I'm not buying in to the hype? Of course the reviews are positive. It's a new Apple gadget. When are those reviews anything but laudatory? :

No, please read better. I said you shouldn't voice your opinion because you obviously haven't handled the iPad yourself yet. If no one believe the opinion of a car enthusiast who doesn't drive, why should anyone trust yours?


And stop calling anyone and everyone who disagrees with you an Apple fanboy. I don't even own a single Apple product.

Originally Posted by whacked

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I'm the farthest thing from an Apple fanboy, but a little genie called the WSJ brought to my attention a curious note:


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...445033542.html

Meanwhile, the iPad uses back-lit liquid-crystal-display technology for its screen, which can light up in a dark room and is in color. Apple says the color iPad screen also uses a new display technology called "in-plane switching" to solve another common problem with LCD screens: the inability to see it from an angle. "You can hold it almost any way you want and still get a brilliant picture, with excellent color and contrast," claims Apple's product description.

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I like how they describe IPS screens as new technology when in fact if you have a nicer than average monitor it probably has one.

Quote:

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So far, there's little scientific evidence about which screens are better for the eyes. Ophthalmologists say there isn't really much of a difference between how the eye works with either e-paper or back-lit screens. Neither could damage the eye and neither of these modern screens flicker like old-fashioned TVs.

Michael Marmor, a professor of ophthalmology at Stanford Medical School who has a Kindle at home, says neither technology offers inherent advantages. Reading with both kinds of screen could cause eyestrain because it has relatively little to do with the function of the eye, he says. Eyestrain is caused by placing too much stress on the brain and body by doing one thing for too long. The only solution for eyestrain is taking more regular breaks

BTW, the reviews I've seen all rave about the iPad's ability as an e-reader. Maybe testing one yourself before voicing out next time?
I read that eyestrain is also caused because your eyes have adjust to the light emitted by the screen. There was a good talk about reading off screens on this years Microsoft MIX conference.

http://live.visitmix.com/MIX10/Sessions/DS07

i have a kindle 2 international. kindle dx is too large. increased size brings diminishing returns. i read a ton with it. more than paper books (many of which ive bought and never opened, and since re-ordered in digital form).

there is no way an ipad is good for "reading". i spent this weekend traveling and the kindle went on a single charge (including wireless use for checking email, blogs, etc). the ipad would not have lasted 1 of the train rides i used.

quickly browsing magazines with lots of colors and pictures? reading an actual book? no way

I have the regular Kindle. Wouldn't have bought it for myself, but got it as a gift. I don't really use it except when traveling -- but for traveling it's pretty nice. And if you have a short attention span like I do, the magazine subscription feature and the availability of a ton of public domain free content is a real plus. If I'm traveling and get bored with whatever I'm reading at the time, I can switch over to the latest New Yorker, or to one of the Twain or Dostoyevsky or Dickens novels I've never gotten around to, or some Sherlock Holmes stories I haven't read in a while.

Originally Posted by whacked

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And stop calling anyone and everyone who disagrees with you an Apple fanboy. I don't even own a single Apple product.

That's how the internet works, unfortunately. Ad hominems are the first and last line of defense for most people in most arguments on the 'net. Especially when it comes to Apple. If someone's bashing an Apple product, and you step forward to try to reason with him, you get labeled an "Apple fanboy" and dismissed accordingly. Such a phenomenon is hardly unique to this board.

Originally Posted by whacked

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No, please read better. I said you shouldn't voice your opinion because you obviously haven't handled the iPad yourself yet. If no one believe the opinion of a car enthusiast who doesn't drive, why should anyone trust yours? And stop calling anyone and everyone who disagrees with you an Apple fanboy. I don't even own a single Apple product.
I'm not asking anyone to trust my opinion. I leave that up to them. But all I see everywhere is unadulterated praise for this thing when there are legitimate criticisms to be made about it, especially as an e-reader, but the press are so in love with apple products that nobody bothers to make them. As for me not owning one, well, I own an iphone, which I have used for "reading" on the subway. I have also used every type of LCD screen in existence over the years, including the so-called "new" IPS type that the ipad uses (it's been around for years in better displays), so I don't need to use it to comment on those aspects of it. LCD technology is basically the same, whether it's a 24" screen on a desktop or a 9" screen on a tablet. There is absolutely nothing new about the ipad display. And again, I'm hardly alone in my dislike of reading on an LCD. As for my other comments... LCDs produce heat. Lithium ion batteries produce heat. Processors produce heat. When you pack all those heat sources into a thin tablet it is going to get warm after prolonged use. Just because I haven't used it doesn't mean it can side-step the laws of physics. And the orders of magnitude difference in battery life is obviously important for heavy readers.

Originally Posted by milosh

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I like how they describe IPS screens as new technology when in fact if you have a nicer than average monitor it probably has one.
i like that WSJ spelled out "liquid crystal display" for us common folks; makes it sound more technologically impressive

if i had listed my 6 year old ultrasharp IPS LCD monitor as such, i could have made more money, when i sold it last month

Originally Posted by Trompe le Monde

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i like that WSJ spelled out "liquid crystal display" for us common folks; makes it sound more technologically impressive

if i had listed my 6 year old ultrasharp IPS LCD monitor as such, i could have made more money, when i sold it last month

It's not IPS is a new in-plane switching display!

The above posts read like what one would expect from Kindle users ie claiming superiority. Seriously.

IPS, btw, has various iterations. The technology used in the iPad was patented by Apple. Both of these are facts, if you care about that sort of things.

Originally Posted by whacked

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The above posts read like what one would expect from Kindle users ie claiming superiority. Seriously. IPS, btw, has various iterations. The technology used in the iPad was patented by Apple. Both of these are facts, if you care about that sort of things.
the kindle is an e-book reader. the ipad is a multi-media tablet. they are not similar devices. Seriously. they are not competitive. for reading books, the kindle is better. it should be -- its made-for-purpose. apple has nothing to do with any display technology. they are not associated with IPS, S-IPS, TN, PVA, etc. the companies that are include hitachi, lg, samsung, which provides the majority of the panels that are built into monitors and later rebranded as "viewsonic, hp, dell, benq, acer, gateway, planar, etc".... including, yes, Apple. even those fancy glossy apple cinema pro displays = LG. facts, if you care about them